Finn Claw II Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 If he helps us stay up by playing his part (20-30) games then the fee is fine. The size of the fee means he should be challenging for a first team spot even if we play a back 4. Value for us is based on contribution to PL survival.
EarlBeaumont Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 I hope I'm wrong, but it is not a good signing. He was rubbish when he played in my home town club. Well, not rubbish, but an average lower-half L1 club. In Italy, it was a bit the same. 8M€ is A LOT for such a player, which is equivalent to De Laet. In France, we are really thinking that English clubs don't know how to spend thir money when we see this. I really hope he will prove me wrong, but I doubt it ....
Gerard Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 Disagree, as others have said he is not a Big Mac he is a unique commodity. Imagine you are playing monopoly, you are winning but you don't have any sets and the person in second has the light blues and the oranges. You have Trafalgar Square and Fleet Street and one of the other players, who is last has the strand. He has just landed on Mayfair and needs £400 to buy it so you offer to buy the Strand off him. You know how much he paid for it, £220 and offer him that. He knows how much it is worth to you and how much he needs to buy Mayfair, so he counters with £400, that is worth it you have £3000 so you can complete your set and build some houses. Second place comes in and offers him £500 because you not having the strand is worth it to him because it will stop you building houses and getting more money in. So you start bidding, in the end you out bid second place with £2200 10 x the market value, because it is worth more to you as it is the only chance to complete a set, it still leaves you £800 to build some houses and cement your position on the board. All these valuations are subjective based on a lot of factors, relative wealth and need are just 2 of them remaining contract is another and whether the selling club wants to sell, how long until the end of the window/start of the season. The other big factor is the cost of not getting someone in, starting the season without getting in another centre back and playing 3 CBs could have been a disaster one injury against Sunderland and we could have ended up with an academy player playing in some crucial early games or having to rejig our formation. Look at Andy Carroll, Liverpool had to do something because the alternative was to go the rest of the season with only one striker, they had £50m in the bank and needed a forward, Carroll was an incredibly exciting young English forward at the time, of course he wasn't worth £35m but they didn't have much time and Newcastle held out for the best deal, because Liverpool left it too late and had shown their hand. But your monopoly analogy doesn't work, you're assuming that Benalouane is our only option, buy him or start the season light at the back. We've had all summer to buy a defender and by the sounds of it there are hundred of defenders on earth who are at least his standard. When we buy a player to immediately step into our first team the minimum ability we should accept is mid table PL standard. Ideally we shouldn't be buying anyone who we believe wouldn't be good enough to get onto a side like Tottenham after a season. We've just spent €8m on a 28 year old who could easily be our 4th choice centre back, that's terrible business by us. I bet you the Atalanta board were high fiving each other once this deal was completed.
Gerard Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 I hope I'm wrong, but it is not a good signing. He was rubbish when he played in my home town club. Well, not rubbish, but an average lower-half L1 club. In Italy, it was a bit the same. 8M€ is A LOT for such a player, which is equivalent to De Laet. In France, we are really thinking that English clubs don't know how to spend thir money when we see this. I really hope he will prove me wrong, but I doubt it .... This is more evidence that he's a bad signing. Our own EarlBeaumont has seen the guy first hand and is basically confirming that this guy will pad out the squad not improve the first XI. Every comment I've read by Italian fans think he was rubbish and Atalanta have had our pants down. As I said before a year a go he gets sold for €1m, he was rated as one of the worst players in Serie A and remarkably his price goes up 800%. Nice business if you can get it as far as Atalanta are concerned. Now I'm hoping this is a scouting buy and they've noticed he has certain attributes that can be utilised better and improve our team but I very much doubt it, I'll judge for myself in a few weeks but everything so far points to this being a terrible buy at €8m.
FrankieWorthoYaggedMyWife Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 This is more evidence that he's a bad signing. Our own EarlBeaumont has seen the guy first hand and is basically confirming that this guy will pad out the squad not improve the first XI. Every comment I've read by Italian fans think he was rubbish and Atalanta have had our pants down. As I said before a year a go he gets sold for €1m, he was rated as one of the worst players in Serie A and remarkably his price goes up 800%. Nice business if you can get it as far as Atalanta are concerned. Now I'm hoping this is a scouting buy and they've noticed he has certain attributes that can be utilised better and improve our team but I very much doubt it, I'll judge for myself in a few weeks but everything so far points to this being a terrible buy at €8m. You might be right but have you considered watching him play before completely writing him off?
Gerard Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 You might be right but have you considered watching him play before completely writing him off? I haven't written him off yet and will watch him play over the coming weeks and form my own opinion. I'm just saying the evidence we have on his ability so far doesn't fill me with confidence. I haven't seen Kante play either but he cost the same, is four years younger and all I've heard is good things about him. I know which one I think will be more successful on the information I have already.
The Railway Man Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 Watched him a couple of times last season in matches I'd had a bet on and he was absolute dogturd, Italy is a tough league to be a defender in though. Have to give him a chance though as with all players.
Captain... Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 But your monopoly analogy doesn't work, you're assuming that Benalouane is our only option, buy him or start the season light at the back. We've had all summer to buy a defender and by the sounds of it there are hundred of defenders on earth who are at least his standard. When we buy a player to immediately step into our first team the minimum ability we should accept is mid table PL standard. Ideally we shouldn't be buying anyone who we believe wouldn't be good enough to get onto a side like Tottenham after a season. We've just spent €8m on a 28 year old who could easily be our 4th choice centre back, that's terrible business by us. I bet you the Atalanta board were high fiving each other once this deal was completed. But this is assuming that there has been no thought put into this whatsoever and we just wanted to buy any CB. I think he was recommended by Ranieri, assuming it is to complement our existing players, LCB with the right attitude who is comfortable playing at LCB in a back 3 or CB in a back 2. If he has been identified as the right player for us and the price is within our budget then we go for it. The alternative is starting again from scratch with a different target and god knows how long that could take. We can judge his ability when we see him play, but he was wanted by Roma and Inter so he isn't shit, and we needed a new CB, don't judge him based on his price tag, the same as Matt Mills, cheaper than Caulker more expensive than Micah Richards, I know which of those 3 I would prefer. This is not a valuation of their ability but the result of many factors. Even if he is just a back up we need a back up, if getting in a good back up costs us £5m then it costs us £5m, it is better than going into the new season under prepared, and the money we have as a result of being a premier league club means that it is well within our budget.
psychonaut Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 @Gerard I've been trying to convince myself that this is a good signing and he's gonna be a beast for us. Will you please STFU!!
thebluefox Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 If I can't pronounce his name properly I'll just call him 'Benayoun'. I call him balloonhead
Julian Joachim Jr Shabadoo Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 Benalouane, oh no They are through on goal AYE AYE AYE AYE AYE AYE Benalouane, oh baby It's come back off the post AYE AYE AYE AYE AYE AYE
Gerard Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 But this is assuming that there has been no thought put into this whatsoever and we just wanted to buy any CB. I think he was recommended by Ranieri, assuming it is to complement our existing players, LCB with the right attitude who is comfortable playing at LCB in a back 3 or CB in a back 2. If he has been identified as the right player for us and the price is within our budget then we go for it. The alternative is starting again from scratch with a different target and god knows how long that could take. We can judge his ability when we see him play, but he was wanted by Roma and Inter so he isn't shit, and we needed a new CB, don't judge him based on his price tag, the same as Matt Mills, cheaper than Caulker more expensive than Micah Richards, I know which of those 3 I would prefer. This is not a valuation of their ability but the result of many factors. Even if he is just a back up we need a back up, if getting in a good back up costs us £5m then it costs us £5m, it is better than going into the new season under prepared, and the money we have as a result of being a premier league club means that it is well within our budget. We should never be buying a 28 year old back up for £5.6m. Either spend £8m+ on someone who is likely to be our best DF or get a freebie like Was or a cheap £1m buy like Wes. We could have bought someone like Balanta who has potential to be world class. Admittedly it could have been another Aranguiz like affair but if Sampdoria think they can get him so should we. I know this article is a year old but you get my point. http://talksport.com/football/colombian-starlet-balanta-set-ps5m-sampdoria-switch-140820108899 http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11833/9199776/transfer-news-river-plate-defender-eder-alvarez-balanta-admits-barcelona-appeal We should have a list of players in the world that we rate and go down the list until we can find a plausible buy. By the sound of it we're the only team in the world that valued him anywhere near that amount of money. Throwing money around because we are richer than most is unacceptable. I want us to squeeze every bit of value we can out of a deal.
Guest LCFC_World Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 Is not my money so could not give a monkeys as long a he performs well on the pitch. I don't see peoples problem with us spending big on transfers, I mean they charge enough for tickets so they might as well.
Captain... Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 We should never be buying a 28 year old back up for £5.6m. Either spend £8m+ on someone who is likely to be our best DF or get a freebie like Was or a cheap £1m buy like Wes. We could have bought someone like Balanta who has potential to be world class. Admittedly it could have been another Aranguiz like affair but if Sampdoria think they can get him so should we. I know this article is a year old but you get my point. http://talksport.com/football/colombian-starlet-balanta-set-ps5m-sampdoria-switch-140820108899 http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11833/9199776/transfer-news-river-plate-defender-eder-alvarez-balanta-admits-barcelona-appeal We should have a list of players in the world that we rate and go down the list until we can find a plausible buy. By the sound of it we're the only team in the world that valued him anywhere near that amount of money. Throwing money around because we are richer than most is unacceptable. I want us to squeeze every bit of value we can out of a deal. What Ranieri has in mind for him I don't know, but I do know his success or failure will reflect on Ranieri a lot more than Kante, as he was picked by Ranieri. I agree we should be trying to squeeze every last bit of value out of a deal, but dragging this out another month and signing him on deadline day for £1m less is not a good deal. As for signing a free player, don't think for one minute we weren't looking, I'm pretty sure we were looking at Richards, and we picked up Fuchs this season, Cmabiasso, Upson and Albrighton lasts season, there are some great players to be picked up on a free. Picking up a Morgan for £1m, that will never happen again, no player that we are interested in will be sold for less than a £3m now we are a prem club, all other clubs know how much we earn in the richest league in Europe. Excluding free transfers only 3 players have been bought this summer for less than £3m, there are a few undisclosed in there too, but of the 50 transfer fees listed here http://www.soccernews.com/soccer-transfers/english-premier-league-transfers/, only 3 are under £3m. (edit: just realised that is in Euros, but you get my point) I don't agree with it, but now we are Premier League that is the market that we are in, and as fans we have to adjust our perceptions accordingly. We also don't know the full terms of the deal, £5.6m up front, £3m up front the rest based on appearances etc. Anyway, I'm going to ignore his reported fee (officially undisclosed) and assess him when I see him play, if he is shit he is shit, if he is good then he is good, the fee is now irrelevant he is a Leicester player and he needs to perform.
Richard Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 Would people really prefer us to be spending £1m on a championship defender than £5m on a Serie A defender? We can't gamble on whether a lower league player can make the step up or not, we need to be sure that they can make a difference
Gerard Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 Would people really prefer us to be spending £1m on a championship defender than £5m on a Serie A defender? We can't gamble on whether a lower league player can make the step up or not, we need to be sure that they can make a difference I want us to get value for money. I'd rather spend £1m on a Championship player who should be worth £1m than a Serie A player for £5.6m that is worth £1m. By all accounts this guy is a failure in Serie A & Ligue 1, we appear to have bought a dud if critics and fans in France and Italy are to be believed.
Miquel The Work Geordie Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 This is more evidence that he's a bad signing. Our own EarlBeaumont has seen the guy first hand and is basically confirming that this guy will pad out the squad not improve the first XI. Every comment I've read by Italian fans think he was rubbish and Atalanta have had our pants down. Yeah, he saw him in France. He last played in France 5 years ago - heaven forbid a player can improve in that time. I've read reports that contradict what you're saying though it seems you're eager for this signing to fail.
Captain... Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 I want us to get value for money. I'd rather spend £1m on a Championship player who should be worth £1m than a Serie A player for £5.6m that is worth £1m. By all accounts this guy is a failure in Serie A & Ligue 1, we appear to have bought a dud if critics and fans in France and Italy are to be believed. Roma and Inter and more importantly our scouts and management team think differently. I know which one would I would trust until I get to see him play and then I will form my own opinion.
Gerard Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 Yeah, he saw him in France. He last played in France 5 years ago - heaven forbid a player can improve in that time. I've read reports that contradict what you're saying though it seems you're eager for this signing to fail. I'm not eager for him to fail at all, I hope he goes on to be the world's best defender. Everything I've read or heard about him is negative though so I'm very cautious about his ability to do well for us.
DANGEROUS TIGER Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 Never trust rumours, they contain fictional nonsense.
Spudulike Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 We need some Atalanta fans on here... where are ya !!
EarlBeaumont Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 Yeah, he saw him in France. He last played in France 5 years ago - heaven forbid a player can improve in that time. I've read reports that contradict what you're saying though it seems you're eager for this signing to fail. When he left, the club had just finished 17th and we were quite glad to get 1M€ out of him. He was an average player in our team. Then he played in Cesena, a weak Seria A side, Parma, an average one until this season and Bergame. I haven't seen him much since then, but as I watched a lot of Sassuolo games the last couple of season, I can assure you that he wasn't impressive in those games (Sassuolo is a good attacking side, but nothing like PL). He wasn't bad neither, just random, as their are many in any championship. He is the kind of anonymous player that do their job. But between a week side in Italy and PL standard, their is a gap. I'm not saying he will be bad, but he is definitely not an improvment on the XI to start. A 3M€ player top, not an 8M ! The price spend here is the real issue. The club could have spent it much more wisely. Alone in Italy and France : Loic Perrin, Francesco Acerbi, Clément Lenglet, Stopila Sunzu, etc ...
Gerard Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 When he left, the club had just finished 17th and we were quite to get 1M€ out of him. Then he played in Cesena, a weak Seria A side, Parma, an average one until this season and Bergame. I haven't seen him much since then, but as I watched a lot of Sassuolo games the last couple of season, I can assure you that he wasn't impressive in those games (Sassuolo is a good attacking side, but nothing like PL). He wasn't bad neither, just random, as their are many in any championship. He is the kind of anonymous player that do their job. But between a week side in Italy and PL standard, their is a gap. I'm not saying he will be bad, but he is definitely not an improvment on the XI to start. A 3M€ player top, not an 8M ! The price spend here is the real issue. The club could have spent it much more wisely. And EarlBeaumont probably knows more about him than the rest of this forum put together.
ChrisFilter Posted 4 August 2015 Posted 4 August 2015 I want us to get value for money. I'd rather spend £1m on a Championship player who should be worth £1m than a Serie A player for £5.6m that is worth £1m. By all accounts this guy is a failure in Serie A & Ligue 1, we appear to have bought a dud if critics and fans in France and Italy are to be believed. By all accounts? All we've heard from your frankly turgid moaning is that you've heard rumours, but I haven't seen a source. Moan, moan, ****ing moan.
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