Buce Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 39 minutes ago, Strokes said: Under what law, who is the upholder of said law and what is the punishment for breaking it? Our own integrity as a nation should be what upholds the agreement; would you seriously want us to be known as a country that welshes on its debts? The punishment could be whatever the EU chose to make it - I imagine there is a myriad of ways they could make life difficult for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 12 minutes ago, Buce said: Our own integrity as a nation should be what upholds the agreement; would you seriously want us to be known as a country that welshes on its debts? The punishment could be whatever the EU chose to make it - I imagine there is a myriad of ways they could make life difficult for us. Yeah I would want to be that country, one that says fùck you, you are not pushing us around. We’ve paid fortunes into the Galileo project and won’t see any benefits, what’s good for the goose and all that.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
l444ry Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 56 minutes ago, Strokes said: Under what law, who is the upholder of said law and what is the punishment for breaking it? The Hague presumably Strokes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 4 minutes ago, l444ry said: The Hague presumably Strokes. The Hague handles cases of international debt? News to me. The House or Lords has already commissioned a legal report on this and we don't pay a penny if there is no deal. Why on earth would we? https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/04/uk-could-quit-eu-without-paying-a-penny-say-lords Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buce Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 6 minutes ago, Strokes said: Yeah I would want to be that country, one that says fùck you, you are not pushing us around. We’ve paid fortunes into the Galileo project and won’t see any benefits, what’s good for the goose and all that.... Good luck with persuading other countries to make agreements with us then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicsmac Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 A reasonable summation and paraphrasing of the Arab-Israeli situation from TVTropes, of all places: "Clashing mentalities there include the fact that the West Bank is, according to The Bible, part of the Jewish homeland, and the accompanying belief that Jews thus have a right to settle there; the Muslim belief that losing territory claimed by Islam something that must be corrected; the Jewish fear that without a stronghold and stubborn nature, people are going to wipe them out again; the knowledge of the surrounding countries that, with such a strong army, acting like a terrified oppressed people makes no sense; the question of whether the West Bank was Palestinian or Transjordanian (same with Gaza and Egypt); the belief of the Israelis that the fact that they've lived there for generations now gives them a claim on the land; the belief of the Palestinians that the fact that they've lived there for even more generations gives them a stronger claim on the land; the belief of the Middle Eastern Jews that nobody on either side seems to care that they never left... Each side has such a different way of viewing the conflict that it becomes nearly impossible to fully comprehend the other, much less have a reasonable discussion." "...Israel was founded in no small part by socialists and still has many kibbutzim, yet many Western Leftists have sympathy for the Palestinians (while others don't). Many religious Conservatives view Israel as some sort of "part of God's plan" (especially in the US), yet others resent it for not being Christian and the isolationist crowd resents the amount of aid it gets. It's fair to say that a group of politically minded people that discusses Israel - even if they agree on every single other subject - will descend into bickering and mutual accusations of being horrible people and traitors to their political cause in no time." "...In fact, a not so small number of people are just fed up with the whole debate and want both sides to just shut the hell up, and argue that the whole issue is getting way too much attention (which of course is likely to draw unfavourable answers from both sides." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 4 minutes ago, Buce said: Good luck with persuading other countries to make agreements with us then. I’ve never been big on FTA really buce, I’d much prefer to protect local industries. It’s where I differ from almost all on here, I’m happy to go WTO for everywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicsmac Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 19 minutes ago, Strokes said: I’ve never been big on FTA really buce, I’d much prefer to protect local industries. It’s where I differ from almost all on here, I’m happy to go WTO for everywhere. I'd have some sympathy for this POV, but I'd need to know first if it is indeed possible for any country in this day and age to produce everything they need themselves to maintain a reasonable standard of living for their citizens, and if not how a WTO agreement would be better for the aforementioned country (and other countries too) than FTA's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Guvnor Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 2 hours ago, l444ry said: Contrary to what the Brexiteer liars keep repeating, the UK is legally bound to pay the £39 billion. Therefore, your point is irrelevant Guvnor. I'm not entirely sure you are correct there. The EU has insisted the financial settlement must be signed off as part of the withdrawl deal - which will contain only a 'Political declaration' on any likely future trade deal. To be honest I don't really find that too appealing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
l444ry Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 2 minutes ago, The Guvnor said: I'm not entirely sure you are correct there. The EU has insisted the financial settlement must be signed off as part of the withdrawl deal - which will contain only a 'Political declaration' on any likely future trade deal. To be honest I don't really find that too appealing. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-05-23/u-k-admits-it-must-pay-brexit-bill-even-without-trade-deal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
l444ry Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 55 minutes ago, MattP said: The Hague handles cases of international debt? News to me. The House or Lords has already commissioned a legal report on this and we don't pay a penny if there is no deal. Why on earth would we? https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/04/uk-could-quit-eu-without-paying-a-penny-say-lords https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2017/09/01/world-judges-hague-should-settle-brexit-divorce-bill/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 3 minutes ago, l444ry said: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-05-23/u-k-admits-it-must-pay-brexit-bill-even-without-trade-deal Read the article and you realise that headline is terribly misleading. Only a couple of weeks ago Raab say we don't pay in the event of no deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 Just now, l444ry said: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2017/09/01/world-judges-hague-should-settle-brexit-divorce-bill/ That's an opinion piece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 2 minutes ago, MattP said: That's an opinion piece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
l444ry Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, MattP said: That's an opinion piece Look up the Hague for yourself then. I provided a link from a rag that I thought you might respect. There are plenty of others if you look. Try this one. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/germany-uk-the-hague-international-court-not-pay-50-billion-brexit-divorce-bill-warn-a7653621.html Edited 3 August 2018 by l444ry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 6 minutes ago, l444ry said: Look up the Hague for yourself then. I provided a link from a rag that I thought you might respect. There are plenty of others if you look. Try this one. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/germany-uk-the-hague-international-court-not-pay-50-billion-brexit-divorce-bill-warn-a7653621.html Thanks. I hope they do that, if they want to increase Eurosceptism on these shores that would be a perfect way to do it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DANGEROUS TIGER Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 An no deal withdrawal means we pay the E.U. NOTHING. They don't want that to happen, but I think/hope, that will be the case. The Chequers deal is far too soft for my liking, but could possibly happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buce Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 25 minutes ago, DANGEROUS TIGER said: An no deal withdrawal means we pay the E.U. NOTHING. They don't want that to happen, but I think/hope, that will be the case. The Chequers deal is far too soft for my liking, but could possibly happen. 1 Tbf, DT, Mussolini was probably too soft for your liking... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Markyblue Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 24 minutes ago, Buce said: Tbf, DT, Mussolini was probably too soft for your liking... Yes everyone who wants brexit is 1 a fascist 2 thick 3 little Englander. Change the record please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buce Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 28 minutes ago, Markyblue said: Yes everyone who wants brexit is 1 a fascist 2 thick 3 little Englander. Change the record please. Yeah, because that's what I said, isn't it? It was a tongue-in-cheek joke directed specifically at DT and I'll be surprised if it doesn't amuse him. If you were familiar with his posting record, you'd get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bovril Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 2 hours ago, Markyblue said: Yes everyone who wants brexit is 1 a fascist 2 thick 3 little Englander. Change the record please. You said that, not him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 3 August 2018 Share Posted 3 August 2018 8 minutes ago, bovril said: You said that, not him. I like to think I’m a 2, a 3 and a little bit of 1. Some day i hope to get the full house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Markyblue Posted 4 August 2018 Share Posted 4 August 2018 9 hours ago, Buce said: Yeah, because that's what I said, isn't it? It was a tongue-in-cheek joke directed specifically at DT and I'll be surprised if it doesn't amuse him. If you were familiar with his posting record, you'd get it. If that's the case I apologise completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 4 August 2018 Share Posted 4 August 2018 (edited) Edited 4 August 2018 by MattP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breadandcheese Posted 4 August 2018 Share Posted 4 August 2018 (edited) I can't help feeling that Corbyn's opinion piece was aimed at appealing to the electorate up and down the country, rather than addressing the concerns that the Jewish community have with regards anti-Semitism. In which case, he's taken the PR route rather than addressing the issue. So the issue will rear it's head again as he fails to address the problem. Let's not forget that despite his strong words in the article, he has never spoken out strongly when in the room with speakers who go beyond the pail. He was sitting right there as Pete Wilsman delivered his diatribe. I actually think this piece nails it in the Guardian. https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/03/corbynistas-politics-labour-leader?__twitter_impression=true The #wearecorbyn hashtag is the first time I've seen anything like it in British politics. It's amusing as they are the opposition. But do corbynistas not see the irony that were they in power, it would be far more chilling and befitting of totalitarian tactics? You are either with or against. Edited 4 August 2018 by breadandcheese 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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