fox_up_north Posted 27 April 2023 Posted 27 April 2023 I'm not necessarily bothered who brokers a peace deal, so long as Ukraine is respected and gets their land back and Russia stops trying to destroy them. That is peace. Anything else is just giving in to bullying behaviour.
TJQuik Posted 27 April 2023 Posted 27 April 2023 18 hours ago, leicsmac said: Absolutely, and I've said the same for years - some issues require a world response, and that obviously includes China. Climate change being at the top of the damn list. I think every talking head who knows a lot or a little about the matter has their viewpoint on what kind of state China is, but personally I'd go for authoritarian as opposed to totalitarian - the latter term just tends to be a derogation used by those who can't see past surface appearances to what is being discussed here. Most of what people believe about china over here is complete nonsense and massively influenced by racism. 3
leicsmac Posted 27 April 2023 Posted 27 April 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, TJQuik said: Most of what people believe about china over here is complete nonsense and massively influenced by racism. I wouldn't necessarily go for that viewpoint first up because then folks might counter with "oh, the racism card, same old same old, blablabla...", so I'd rather pick another area to highlight. However, I do reckon for quite a few people you're absolutely spot on here and it's simply Yellow Peril xenophobia driving their view on China and the Chinese. Edited 27 April 2023 by leicsmac 1
westernpark Posted 27 April 2023 Posted 27 April 2023 2 hours ago, TJQuik said: Most of what people believe about china over here is complete nonsense and massively influenced by racism. Do you mean trivial nonsense regarding Chinese culture? Or their domestic and international politics?
leicsmac Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 8 minutes ago, Zear0 said: Bold move by whoever it was. Bold to try, a likely escalation because it failed.
yorkie1999 Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 False flag to gain support for nuclear retaliation. No way would a couple of drones be allowed to get so close. Imagine if it had been a 2000 mph missile which the Kremlin would be prepared for. 2
fox_favourite Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Zear0 said: Bold move by whoever it was. Seems suspect to me…too convenient Edited 3 May 2023 by fox_favourite
leicsmac Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 Could well be a false flag, guess what the Ukrainian leadership has to say about it will tell us one way or another. If that is the case though, I wonder why now, and not last week or next week? 1
Zear0 Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 2 minutes ago, fox_favourite said: Seems suspect to me…too convenient My view too albeit based on nothing more than my gut. Seems extremely crude and ineffective given what I suspect is an extremely well protected building.
ClaphamFox Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 Would Russia really want to spin the narrative that an enemy drone was able to reach the Kremlin? Why would they want to humiliate themselves in that way? The embarrassment would surely outweigh any potential gains they'd have from concocting a story like that... 2
leicsmac Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 2 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said: Would Russia really want to spin the narrative that an enemy drone was able to reach the Kremlin? Why would they want to humiliate themselves in that way? The embarrassment would surely outweigh any potential gains they'd have from concocting a story like that... I think that would depend on how seriously they would want to take any retaliation for such a thing. Having said that, however, pretty much every possible escalation where they take the gloves off further from here doesn't get them what they want anyway. 1
Dunge Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 Three most likely explanations to me: 1. Ukraine or internal Ukraine-allied actors within Russian did it, in order to serve as a warning to both Putin and Russia. This feels unlikely given how close the drones got but can’t be discounted. 2. This was a false flag from Russia to either drum up continued internal support or justify (eg) a revenge assassination attempt on Zelenskyy. 3. This was someone within the Russian system not allied to Ukraine but wanting to provoke internal chaos. …Of which #2 seems the most likely. 1
Lionator Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 You can legit buy these types of drones anywhere, attach a bit of gunpowder and bobs yer uncle. No way was this a false flag. I’m going for the ‘Russian partisan’ or Ukranians not affiliated with the government/secret service.
casablancas Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 False flag or Russian group unhappy with things. Ukraine gains zero from this logically other than stirring up the nationalists and so on. 1
Lionator Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 22 minutes ago, casablancas said: False flag or Russian group unhappy with things. Ukraine gains zero from this logically other than stirring up the nationalists and so on. Ukrainian government don’t, but there’s plenty of people in Ukraine who could do this. But I still think it’s partisans in Russia.
Lionator Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 Also if Russia wanted to undertake a false flag to justify escalation, China wouldn’t have just sent a peace envoy to Kyiv. Putin is looking a for a way out not escalation. He’s completely stuck because he’s an idiot.
yorkie1999 Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 Looks very suspect when you consider theres a couple of people climbing up there as well. https://twitter.com/UkraineNewsLive/status/1653740954325532672/video/2
westernpark Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 It is a false flag operation likely for these reasons: -How would they know it was to solely target Putin? -It’s such a pathetic attempt that no one with serious intentions would attempt, thus meaning little damage was done when it as planned, failed. -Russia will know, as will the West, where it has come from. They would not advertise this, if it was an internal attack. -Putins first years in presidency saw false flag operations - Rhetoric has now been amplified by Kremlin cronies against physical harm of Zelensky.
Countryfox Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 It’s all bubbling up now .. both sides playing their opening gambits before it all kicks off.
Countryfox Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 P. S. The so called drone strike .. I’ve seen £10 fireworks that make a bigger bang than that .. what utter bollox. 3
EnderbyFox Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 A bit heavy on middle-eastern geopolitics but still an interesting watch. Love this channel 1
Lionator Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 4 hours ago, yorkie1999 said: Looks very suspect when you consider theres a couple of people climbing up there as well. https://twitter.com/UkraineNewsLive/status/1653740954325532672/video/2 There were two drones. The people climbing up were going to investigate the first one when the second went off.
Lionator Posted 3 May 2023 Posted 3 May 2023 37 minutes ago, EnderbyFox said: A bit heavy on middle-eastern geopolitics but still an interesting watch. Love this channel Meh not as good as Adam Curtis on the Middle East. It did all just get a bit more complex with the Saudi-Iran reparation of diplomatic relationship. God knows how they managed to get that sorted.
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