Tactics Under Maresca

[The_Rorab]

7 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

Not saying I understand but there may be a reason beyond the nefarious. Imagine it would be different if Braybrooke or Alves were available. (Hope so anyway)

Yeah, I mean I don't necessarily think it's nefarious regardless of whether it is the case or not, and I could easily be wrong - I just think it seems a logical possibility.

 

It could also simply be that he doesn't consider any of the other academy players good enough to make the bench right now, therefore Ward is a good stopgap on the bench that doesn't rock any boats or give any players the wrong impression of how he regards them I guess, but I'd hope it's not that one because that's a bit of a damning take on our U21 players if they can't get on the bench ahead of Danny Ward as a 2nd GK! 

 

Hopefully it doesn't matter and we can finally get some transfer movement out of the club that renders it moot going forward!

[Dames]

14 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

Because the rest of the available players are moving on, or trying too?

We have a category one academy and also an u21s team. For a manager who is rated highly by every youth player he’s ever worked with its a surprise he’s not currently willing to dip into those pools to fill the bench, especially when he’s using some for the first 11. 
 

There are just too many coincidences and inconsistencies for it to be anything other than gamesmanship with want away players and the board. I’m not suggesting he’s unhappy (at the minute) but he’s clearly trying to make a point. My hope is that it doesn’t bite us. 

[Sparrowhawk]

So do people seriously believe that a new manager would cut off his nose to spite his face by weakening his options in his first few games to 'make a point?'

If it was back in the days of three subs, or even five, maybe there would be no other explanation. But seeing he'd have more outfield subs than he could use even if he put three keepers on the bench, do you not think it's more likely he's just keeping people involved so they aren't coming in so cold if they're needed? Especially as he seems to be varying who's on the bench?

[Dahnsouff]

Just now, Dames said:

We have a category one academy and also an u21s team. For a manager who is rated highly by every youth player he’s ever worked with its a surprise he’s not currently willing to dip into those pools to fill the bench, especially when he’s using some for the first 11. 
 

There are just too many coincidences and inconsistencies for it to be anything other than gamesmanship with want away players and the board. I’m not suggesting he’s unhappy (at the minute) but he’s clearly trying to make a point. My hope is that it doesn’t bite us. 

Our academy not producing yet I assume and it’s hardly like he can bring long term produced Man City youngsters with him.  Not sure what point that would prove as surely he is better to go into Rudkin/Tops office and say just it rather than acting like a juvenile. 
 

Maybe you are right, but I just don’t see it as he would essentially be making things harder for himself

[Dames]

Just now, Sparrowhawk said:

So do people seriously believe that a new manager would cut off his nose to spite his face by weakening his options in his first few games to 'make a point?'

If it was back in the days of three subs, or even five, maybe there would be no other explanation. But seeing he'd have more outfield subs than he could use even if he put three keepers on the bench, do you not think it's more likely he's just keeping people involved so they aren't coming in so cold if they're needed? Especially as he seems to be varying who's on the bench?

Its equally as likely as keeping goal keepers involved he has no intention of ever playing especially at the expense of attacking options when they are limited in this squad as it is. 

[Sparrowhawk]

5 minutes ago, Dames said:

We have a category one academy and also an u21s team. For a manager who is rated highly by every youth player he’s ever worked with its a surprise he’s not currently willing to dip into those pools to fill the bench, especially when he’s using some for the first 11. 
 

There are just too many coincidences and inconsistencies for it to be anything other than gamesmanship with want away players and the board. I’m not suggesting he’s unhappy (at the minute) but he’s clearly trying to make a point. My hope is that it doesn’t bite us. 

Or perhaps he simply sees no point in filling the bench with players he doesn't think are ready.

 

I can't see any particular 'coincidences and inconsistencies' in his choices of substitutes.

[Dames]

Just now, Dahnsouff said:

Our academy not producing yet I assume and it’s hardly like he can bring long term produced Man City youngsters with him.  Not sure what point that would prove as surely he is better to go into Rudkin/Tops office and say just it rather than acting like a juvenile. 
 

Maybe you are right, but I just don’t see it as he would essentially be making things harder for himself

As much as I didnt rate him Rodgers had the same problem last season too and no doubt he went to Rudkin and Top to say it how it is. Again its just too coincidental that the club for a second successive season are unable to shift on players the manager clearly does not want. 
 

1 minute ago, Sparrowhawk said:

Or perhaps he simply sees no point in filling the bench with players he doesn't think are ready.

 

I can't see any particular 'coincidences and inconsistencies' in his choices of substitutes.

So international players such as Castange and Daka are not ready for the Championship so never ever going to play Danny Ward is a better option to have warming a spot on the bench? Nah I don’t buy it. 

[Beachyboy]

2 minutes ago, Sparrowhawk said:

Or perhaps he simply sees no point in filling the bench with players he doesn't think are ready.

 

I can't see any particular 'coincidences and inconsistencies' in his choices of substitutes.

Surely next week, if we do manage to somehow get a comfortable lead, it will be like when Mcateer was named in the premiership game against Newcastle we won 4-0. The game was won Mcateer wasn't ready, but it was the ideal opportunity at 4-0 in the 88th minute to give him his debut.

[Sparrowhawk]

2 minutes ago, Dames said:

6 minutes ago, Sparrowhawk said:

Or perhaps he simply sees no point in filling the bench with players he doesn't think are ready.

 

I can't see any particular 'coincidences and inconsistencies' in his choices of substitutes.

Expand  

So international players such as Castange and Daka are not ready for the Championship so never ever going to play Danny Ward is a better option to have warming a spot on the bench? Nah I don’t buy it. 

That was an answer to your suggestion that he fill the bench with academy players. As I'm sure you're well aware.

[kyleolly]

Do we really need 3 at the I think it stifles our creativity it’s alright having centre backs that are good on the ball but they don’t start attacks they just pass it amongst themselves.

[Beachyboy]

3 minutes ago, Dames said:

As much as I didnt rate him Rodgers had the same problem last season too and no doubt he went to Rudkin and Top to say it how it is. Again its just too coincidental that the club for a second successive season are unable to shift on players the manager clearly does not want. 
 

So international players such as Castange and Daka are not ready for the Championship so never ever going to play Danny Ward is a better option to have warming a spot on the bench? Nah I don’t buy it. 

If both don't get sold both will be involved in the squad in September if the attitudes are right.

[Sparrowhawk]

If I was a manager with 9 sub places, I'd always pick two goalies. Unlikely as you are to need them, you're otherwise only a tweaked hamstring and a bang on the head away from having to put an outfield player in goal. With seven other spots on the bench for outfield players, why take the risk - however small it is?

[Aleksz]

1 minute ago, kyleolly said:

Do we really need 3 at the I think it stifles our creativity it’s alright having centre backs that are good on the ball but they don’t start attacks they just pass it amongst themselves.

The idea of this is literally to bait out a team that want to sit deep and create the space behind them.

[Dames]

1 minute ago, Sparrowhawk said:

That was an answer to your suggestion that he fill the bench with academy players. As I'm sure you're well aware.

My overall point is that its too inconsistent. He’s not willing to put outfield players he doesnt want on the bench but hes willing to put goalkeepers hes unwilling to keep on the bench and limit his options? Hes known for bringing players through which he is doing but he also has an opportunity to take it a bit further he instead opts for Danny Ward rather than a promising youth prospect? 

 

Doesn’t make sense unless he’s trying to make a point.

[Dames]

3 minutes ago, Beachyboy said:

If both don't get sold both will be involved in the squad in September if the attitudes are right.

True but he’s already made it clear he doesn’t want or rate them so he’s making it harder for himself to bring them back in when he would rather involve Danny Ward over them. 

 

3 minutes ago, Sparrowhawk said:

If I was a manager with 9 sub places, I'd always pick two goalies. Unlikely as you are to need them, you're otherwise only a tweaked hamstring and a bang on the head away from having to put an outfield player in goal. With seven other spots on the bench for outfield players, why take the risk - however small it is?

When has it ever happened that a keeper has needed to be subbed twice in a game? Its less than 1 in 1000. On the flip side why take the risk only having 1 attacking player on the bench when you are two injuries away from not having enough on the pitch? 

[TMELcfc]

Reading the thread during the game, 90% was people slating how poor it was at times… I get that, but I am (for once) showing some patience. 
Feels like some people are expecting prime barca after 4 games… our preseason schedule was pathetic, we should’ve been in the UK putting two teams out in 2 different games… instead we were doing a vanity tour of Asia! 
 

We have also had the same slow methodical Puel / Rodgers ball for 6 odd years. It was never going to change overnight. But at least there were glimpses today. 
 

Until the window is closed and we know what our squad is going to look like, and we’ve had 3-4 months of football, I think it’ll continue like today. But if we win while we are playing poorly, bonus. 
 

The manager has asked for a bit of patience so think it’s time we showed some 

Edited 19 August 2023 by TMELcfc

[Beachyboy]

2 minutes ago, Dames said:

My overall point is that its too inconsistent. He’s not willing to put outfield players he doesnt want on the bench but hes willing to put goalkeepers hes unwilling to keep on the bench and limit his options? Hes known for bringing players through which he is doing but he also has an opportunity to take it a bit further he instead opts for Danny Ward rather than a promising youth prospect? 

 

Doesn’t make sense unless he’s trying to make a point.

I think he thought like I thought before the game, Cardiff almost beat Leeds, this game will be tight, I don't see us getting a strong lead to introduce a youngster. I'd be looking at a Rotherham game where they are 3rd bottom, apparently the worst atmosphere in the championship, likely to struggle as a good chance to bring in a younger player to the squad, as there is more chance the game will present an opportunity to actually bring that player on.

[TrentFox]

5 minutes ago, Sparrowhawk said:

If I was a manager with 9 sub places, I'd always pick two goalies. Unlikely as you are to need them, you're otherwise only a tweaked hamstring and a bang on the head away from having to put an outfield player in goal. With seven other spots on the bench for outfield players, why take the risk - however small it is?

Which, given our keeper has only just recovered from injury, makes it even more understandable. 

[STUHILL]

The problem with tactics that involve keeping possession of the ball, is there are always moments in games where the team will look slow and unable to make break throughs. It also relies heavily on the technical ability of players, which we are still lacking in a few areas. 

I found myself a bit envious at times how Cardiff seemed to break forward so easily and have space and time to cross. 

However, once we add a few more quality players and Enzo really gets his ideas across, I think we will see his tactics help us dominate and win games on a regular basis. 

The fact we are 3 from 3, with a handful of players still to come in, and only limited time for Enzo so far, is a huge bonus! We will only get stronger over the next few weeks. 

[kyleolly]

6 minutes ago, Aleksz said:

The idea of this is literally to bait out a team that want to sit deep and create the space behind them.

But it didn’t work

[LinekersLugs]

Enzo is Gordon Ramsey 

 

sadly 

 

he is trying to run his restaurant with McDonalds employees 

 

we need to give him time and space to develop his philosophy and team 

 

He is a man who has Lady Luck on his side and that’s valuable 

 

 

[Aleksz]

2 minutes ago, kyleolly said:

But it didn’t work

Our “best first half performance of the season” in Maresca’s words and 3 points later, I would say it did.

[Headcase]

4 minutes ago, STUHILL said:

The problem with tactics that involve keeping possession of the ball, is there are always moments in games where the team will look slow and unable to make break throughs. It also relies heavily on the technical ability of players, which we are still lacking in a few areas. 

I found myself a bit envious at times how Cardiff seemed to break forward so easily and have space and time to cross. 

However, once we add a few more quality players and Enzo really gets his ideas across, I think we will see his tactics help us dominate and win games on a regular basis. 

The fact we are 3 from 3, with a handful of players still to come in, and only limited time for Enzo so far, is a huge bonus! We will only get stronger over the next few weeks. 

What handful of players? Curious 

[Fox42]

3 minutes ago, LinekersLugs said:

Enzo is Gordon Ramsey 

 

sadly 

 

he is trying to run his restaurant with McDonalds employees 

 

we need to give him time and space to develop his philosophy and team 

 

He is a man who has Lady Luck on his side and that’s valuable 

 

 

Let him cook.

[kyleolly]

2 minutes ago, Aleksz said:

Our “best first half performance of the season” in Maresca’s words and 3 points later, I would say it did.

It didn’t bait the Cardiff players to come out of position though did it they just sat in