davieG Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 At home to Burnley and Ipswich, two teams that we have found difficult to beat, We're at home so we have really got to to take it to these two teams. Burnley as we know to our cost are a difficult team to score against have started the season well with a 2-0 win at home to QPR. Ipswich are like us very much in a transition period with an unproven manager they have started arguably worse than us losing at home 1-2 to Crystal Palace (Peter Taylor) but at least they found the net. These games are ones we definitely need to win being at home and against teams that aren't expected to be pushing for a play off. If we fail and perform badly the financial downward spiral we are in will get dramatically worse gates for the next home game to Southend could well end up near the 15K mark. By my understanding that means we would be in a loss making situation. People say it's too early to talk about a crisis, I disagree a crisis depends on the facts not just the timing. By most people's reckoning, yes, even the most optimistic there was absolutely nothing to take from the first game other than the fact it was the first game, more worryingly no one seems to have any real idea how to improve it. People talk about width but the alternatives themselves are just as frightening. It seems to me we are where we were, squad wise the day CL left which means the only option is for the players to roll up their collective sleeves pull the finger out of their bank books and put in some monumental effort. This season will be made or broken by just that. I know, I know but I had to get it off my chest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultra Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 Both of these games are indeed very winnable. But it doesn't do this forum or the club any favours to warn of "consequences" if the results in these games, for whatever reason, go against us. The flames of hysteria are already raging fiercely enough, with many calls for Rob Kelly's head after just ONE game. Confidence among FOXES is further undermined and the cycle of decline continues. The more mature and intelligent fans accept that setbacks such as yesterday's defeat will happen from time to time as part of the learning process for both players and manager alike. Kelly has shown, unlike his immediate predecessors, the ability to move on from bad defeats and produce winning performances in the games that follow, as QPR, Hull and Palace found to their cost last season. With modest changes in tactics and personnel, there's no reason why that formula can't be repeated on Tuesday. But it will be more likely if fans were present to give the team positive encouragement, instead of grumbling in their seats, or shrieking from behind their keyboards. The lynch mob, who are present on other FOXES websites beside this one, need to disappear very quickly before they do the club further damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 How many times does anyone have to emphasise the point. It ISN'T one game. City's problems have been apparent for months. It was hoped that something would be done in the closed season but the Chosen Men still rule, still enjoy their everlasting protection. If it was one game no-one would really give a shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez of Mahrez Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 How many times does anyone have to emphasise the point. It ISN'T one game. City's problems have been apparent for months. It was hoped that something would be done in the closed season but the Chosen Men still rule, still enjoy their everlasting protection. If it was one game no-one would really give a shit. It is one game. People talk about Kelly having to have a clean slate to start from again and not impressing in that one game. Fair enough, but the same should apply to the players. It's not unreasonable for Kelly to stick with the majority of the players that kept us up last year for the first game of this season. Whatever you say about Maybury, he played practically every game under Kelly last year at right midfield and our run of results was fantastic. The only reason you are able to take this moral high ground over the "Chosen Men" and the youngsters is because you haven't seen the youngsters play in the first team and you haven't been proven wrong. Whereas these supposedly "Chosen Men" secured some fantastic results for us at the end of last season in contrast to what came before, and deserve the chance to secure their positions this season too. I'd be delighted to hear who you think these "Chosen Men" are actually? I'm thinking Johansson, Tiatto and Maybury? Well that's hardly eleven players. You may champion O'Grady's cause and he may well get his chance to start very soon given Hume's ineffectiveness yesterday but the fact is that Fryatt and Hume were outstanding under Kelly last season and deserved to start as a partnership again this season. People also talk about him not being willing to change things. Last season he didn't really need to change anything, we had a settled team and we were winning enough games to not only keep us up but finish comfortably clear of the relegation zone. After yesterday, if he doesn't change things and we are as poor again on Tuesday night then you will start to have a point. I just think, given Kelly's achievements, some of you are after the perfect manager. Kelly's team were playing with passion and pride last season and he gave Wesolowski his chance. Personally I think Kelly will have been livid with that performance yesterday and will have told the players in no uncertain terms what is expected of them in the next two home games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricey Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 The next 2 games are vital, it's just like last season as we've lost the opening game and we now face a beatable team and then Ipswich both at the Walkers. I just hope we beat Burnley and play well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phube Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 We never beat either Ipswich or Burnley.... I'm worried... :cry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricey Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 We never beat either Ipswich or Burnley.... I'm worried... :cry: Never say never. I'm trying to be optimistic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phube Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 Never say never. I'm trying to be optimistic You just said it twice... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gist Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 I think we will beat Burnley only about 1-0 but I think we will win we just need fans to be posotive even after the performance yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mort Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 How many times does anyone have to emphasise the point. It ISN'T one game. To an extent it is one game, it’s the first game of the season, we lost, we played poorly and Luton (our opponents) where a pretty ordinary side… …problem is, any improvement is probably dependent upon a significant change in line up, strengthening the defence (bringing in Sheehan IMHO) and actually playing creatively in the midfield (dumping Tiato and Maybury would help) and none of this seems likely to happen, our weaknesses simply are not going to be addressed it seems and that, as you say, is very worrying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultra Posted 6 August 2006 Share Posted 6 August 2006 It is one game. People talk about Kelly having to have a clean slate to start from again and not impressing in that one game. Fair enough, but the same should apply to the players. It's not unreasonable for Kelly to stick with the majority of the players that kept us up last year for the first game of this season. Whatever you say about Maybury, he played practically every game under Kelly last year at right midfield and our run of results was fantastic. The only reason you are able to take this moral high ground over the "Chosen Men" and the youngsters is because you haven't seen the youngsters play in the first team and you haven't been proven wrong. Whereas these supposedly "Chosen Men" secured some fantastic results for us at the end of last season in contrast to what came before, and deserve the chance to secure their positions this season too. I'd be delighted to hear who you think these "Chosen Men" are actually? I'm thinking Johansson, Tiatto and Maybury? Well that's hardly eleven players. You may champion O'Grady's cause and he may well get his chance to start very soon given Hume's ineffectiveness yesterday but the fact is that Fryatt and Hume were outstanding under Kelly last season and deserved to start as a partnership again this season. People also talk about him not being willing to change things. Last season he didn't really need to change anything, we had a settled team and we were winning enough games to not only keep us up but finish comfortably clear of the relegation zone. After yesterday, if he doesn't change things and we are as poor again on Tuesday night then you will start to have a point. I just think, given Kelly's achievements, some of you are after the perfect manager. Kelly's team were playing with passion and pride last season and he gave Wesolowski his chance. Personally I think Kelly will have been livid with that performance yesterday and will have told the players in no uncertain terms what is expected of them in the next two home games. Well put. It's amazing how soon people forget. When Kelly took over most folk considered 21st place was beyond us. In the end some were grumbling because we only finished 16th. They've spent the entire close season sharpening their knives and after only ONE defeat they are busy wielding them. I know we've been scarred by the memories of Turnip, Bassett, Adams and Levein but we MUST lose the habit of viewing all our managers as lowlife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thracian Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 Chosen Men: Tiatto, Maybury, Williams, Hughes, Johansson, McCarthy, Kisnorbo. I think McCarthy and Kisnorbo are our best centre-backs so that is not an issue. As for the rest of what you say I was calling for progress to be made with the team while we were winning, never mind for the beginning of this season. I wouldn't care if we won 10 games in a row. If I could improve my side I would. We haven't. As for the youngsters you are right in that they get very little chance with the Closed Shop but Sheehan, for example, though he's only played a limited number of games, has an excellent first team record. Furthermore in his main Championship matches, Sheffield Wednesday and Crewe, the team played with a bit of style which is what I want us to foster really. No, they weren't marvelllous. But they did pass the ball around properly and both games would have been won if Hammond hadn't had a goal ruled out unfairly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manwell Pablo Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 Chosen Men: Tiatto, Maybury, Williams, Hughes, Johansson, McCarthy, Kisnorbo. I think McCarthy and Kisnorbo are our best centre-backs so that is not an issue. As for the rest of what you say I was calling for progress to be made with the team while we were winning, never mind for the beginning of this season. I wouldn't care if we won 10 games in a row. If I could improve my side I would. We haven't. As for the youngsters you are right in that they get very little chance with the Closed Shop but Sheehan, for example, though he's only played a limited number of games, has an excellent first team record. Furthermore in his main Championship matches, Sheffield Wednesday and Crewe, the team played with a bit of style which is what I want us to foster really. No, they weren't marvelllous. But they did pass the ball around properly and both games would have been won if Hammond hadn't had a goal ruled out unfairly. Seems strange you have been very quick to get on your high horse after Saturdays shambles however I don't really see you making many comments about the worst player on the pitch by a country mile Richard Stearmen Selective thinking again me thinks Thrac. Saturday was absloute tosh don't get me wrong, and however much I don't see it improving I am willing to give most of the players and the manager a few more go's before the heads start rolling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Fox Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 The shape of our season is looking more like this........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr The Singh Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 The shape of our season is looking more like this........... That's a fabulous specimen!!!!! It has many curves and does it's job well!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez of Mahrez Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 I wouldn't care if we won 10 games in a row. If I could improve my side I would. Now that's a quote! I'm having that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 7 August 2006 Author Share Posted 7 August 2006 Now that's a quote! I'm having that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez of Mahrez Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 How arrogant can you get? Win ten games in a row and he still reckons he could improve the side. Beggars can't be choosers. And if you win ten games in a row you stick with that team and be grateful for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 I think tuesday's game is going to be the most boring game of the century. Two teams who are ludicrously bad at attacking. It will be another custom 1-0 win for Burnley and I can see a demonstration afterwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 7 August 2006 Author Share Posted 7 August 2006 How arrogant can you get? Win ten games in a row and he still reckons he could improve the side. Beggars can't be choosers. And if you win ten games in a row you stick with that team and be grateful for it. I think you've missed the word 'if' ! Surely all successful enterprises are run on the basis of continuous improvement in order to stay in front, whether you are the best of your ilk or the worse. I can't see what the problem is with that statement the sentiments of it I've encountered every day of my working life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultra Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 Chosen Men: Tiatto, Maybury, Williams, Hughes, Johansson, McCarthy, Kisnorbo. But in another thread you admit that Tiatto should play (albeit alongside Sheehan.. ) Hughes didn't start on Saturday so that scuppers the argument that he's one of the "chosen men". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swedging Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 I think tuesday's game is going to be the most boring game of the century. Two teams who are ludicrously bad at attacking. It will be another custom 1-0 win for Burnley and I can see a demonstration afterwards. ONE defeat and looking for a demonstration. Is there an award anywhere for the most fickle fans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BartonFox Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 ONE defeat and looking for a demonstration. Is there an award anywhere for the most fickle fans? You are not seeing the bigger picture. Any demonstration will not be against Kelly but against Ronald McDonald and Dim Tim, it will be like the demo after we lost 3-1 at home to Blackburn in '91. Although plenty of folk wanted Pleat out, we were sick to the back teeth of the Shipman's. Look what happened after, we then went on the up and up, Martin George, Brian Little, Wembley etc.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Collymore Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 This thread is stressing me out, I'm starting to feel like pre-QPR last season. Do you remember that feeling of just someone attacking your insides with a commando knife? Lets just all chill and not panic if we lose on Tues. We've got no right to beat anyone in this division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 7 August 2006 Share Posted 7 August 2006 ONE defeat and looking for a demonstration. Is there an award anywhere for the most fickle fans? If there is can I have it? Unfortunately i've been trying to tell myself for several seasons now that we'll be alright and after the Adams era we'd start again completely and build the foundations of a successful, young team. The frustrating thing is I can see that that shouldn't be out of the question but the management, players and mainly the board have let the fans down massively over the past few seasons. Time and time again they get it wrong and it's embarassing. Rob Kelly has his limitations, i'm all for giving him a chance but my worry is that his lack of experience as a manager and the lack of any experience of football management in the club means that it could all go tits up for him and he won't know what to do. I'll keep quiet for a month or so, perhaps i'm talking bollocks (probably so) and in a month it will be all sorted. If not, then this sort of posting will prevail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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