Ollie's knockers

[Hullfox]

I'd sooner have Beaglehole/Taggart than Holloway

Nice to see you haven't changed your mind for a few weeks.

[Daggers]

There have been perfectly reasonable managerial suggestions put forward.

And while you might wonder how the loss of £1m might affect us I'm more concerned with how much Holloway has already cost us through relegation.

While they woulkn't necessarily be my first choice I'd sooner have Beaglehole/Taggart than Holloway and if we went in that direction we'd probably save money overall as well.

We'd also have people who know our club and our players inside out.

I haven't seen them - managers who have a proven competence AND would be viable options for the club? Please don't say Ince again Thracian because we both know full well he is not coming here...he said so and we've been over this argument. All I have seen are targets beyond our means or pulling power. Not one decent prospect has been linked with us either, which speaks volumes that agents are waiting to see if better opportunities come up first.

The Beaglehole/Taggart option is the only reasonable alternative suggested so far - and not one that I would like to see myself, I simply do not see how they offer an measurable advantage. If it came to them though I must confess that I wouldn't be upset as I would if we appointed someone like Dowie.

As far as how much relegation has cost us - it's wholly irrelevant to what we now do in the future (besides, perversely, retaining the job for Holloway). I saw him as a dead man walking until the moment he became too expensive to sack when we took the plunge. And I do not agree that Holloway is solely responsible for our relegation.

Thanks for the reply though - Beaglehole/Taggart, the second choice option that wouldn't anger the fan base, eh? Which one gets put in charge though? I hate joint managerships.

[ibbosuk]

Come on - all of you carping on that he should be sacked, explain to me this:

• Why, when there is no decent, reasonable suggestion for his replacement?
  

And

• Where is the severance money coming from with a drop in revenue at the club? The Contract Termination Fairy?
  

Someone explain to me how being one million pounds worse off and not having a management team is better than what we currently have because I am ****ed if I can understand your logic.

Please. :huh

Can answers not include reference to his tactics, his record, his salary not being cut or his appearances in the media. Oh, and no mention of Bristol Rovers. Thanks

Its the Foxtalk Guru here ibbosuk...

Ian Holloway .... Listen good....You may be blue........But you'll never be A blue.... Your damaged goods punk.....and this is a firestorm........... Deep down your dirty hear me dirty.....

[Linekaaaah]

Well, here are MY reasons to have him sacked.

A multitude of largely underperforming signings, whether on loan or bought outright, along with failure to give any kind of real chance to our youngsters.

He wasn't exactly a master tactician either, reaching a new low with the negativity that resulted in our (well-deserved) relegation. He just never really had the talent for the job. I'm not questioning his passion, but it's not enough.

And my 11yr old says he's rubbish, so ner!

He tried, he failed (miserably it has to be said) so move on...

[davieG]

Steve Tilson - had promotions from this league and managed in the Championship with minimal resources

Dave Penney - been successful at Doncaster & Darlington in the mode of Brian Little

Sean O'Driscoll - currently enjoying success at Doncaster

John Ward - Experienced having been assistant to Graham Taylor, Josef Venglos, Dave Jones he got Cheltenham promoted and currently having some success at Carlisle.

Stuart Gray - Short spell in charge of Southampton been assistant to Glen Hoddle & Dave Jones currently doing a decent job at Northampton

Gary Waddock - long shot really, has worked with Holloway and at least managed to keep QPR up after Ollie was sacked, done a tremendous job at Aldershot.

I'd be happy giving Penney or Tilson a go.

But far from getting used to the idea of Division 3 I'm becoming more and more disinterested as I really don't like Leicester City Football Club at the moment everything about it that has deteriorated over the last few years on and off the pitch has culminated to a point where I really don't care.

Maybe time will change that!

[coale39]

Yeah Tilson might be alright

[lookwhaticando]

All I have seen are targets beyond our means or pulling power. Not one decent prospect has been linked with us either, which speaks volumes that agents are waiting to see if better opportunities come up first.

The Beaglehole/Taggart option is the only reasonable alternative suggested so far.

How about Newell?

He's not wholly unrealistic... after all, nobody has touched him with a 10' barge pole since he departed Luton last year. It shouldn't take too much to get his interest... He could always 'do a Megson'. We could drag him back from the wilderness, get his name back into the public conscience once more and then let him wander off to another club earning us a few pennies to spend on (yet) another manager.

Not my favourite candidate... but he's not beyond our pulling power, I don't think...

Thanks for the reply though - Beaglehole/Taggart, the second choice option that wouldn't anger the fan base, eh? Which one gets put in charge though? I hate joint managerships.

As Houllier/Evans demonstrated, the foreigner always wins. Hence, Taggart would be top dog.

[Finnegan]

I liked Holloway and I defended him for ages, but there's no way with over half a season and a transfer window at his disposal he should have taken us down. He did an excellent job at Plymouth, I concede, and I think it's possible that if he'd settled better he could have done the same here. But it really seems to me that he found himself hugely overwhelmed at Leicester. He seems to have bottled it, frankly. And how can a man lacking confidence and determination inspire the same in his charges?

The lack of suitable replacements is what worries me, but I'll be highly surprised if Mandaric keeps him on so our rantings for him to stay/go are rather moot anyway. The Serb will be considered something of a hypocrite if the only manager whom he doesn't wield the axe on is the only manager to ever see Leicester City relegated from the tiers-that-matter of English Football (pardon my elitism.)

edit: I would like to add, though, that from a human perspective, as a person, I think it'd be great to see Holloway turn it around and take us back up and into Championship play-offs. I appreciate that's a largely dream-world situation but I think he's a decent enough guy, he's entertaining and I don't care what the Plymouth fans want to cry about his heart seems in the right place.

[kendalfox]

Am I the only one who thinks Holloway is just not that entertaining?

I dunno, maybe all other footie managers are pretty boring but I find him immensely humdrum and he just tries too hard to be witty, urban. He's no character, just a characture of what he thinks a cult figure should be.

Perhaps he has got himself too caught up in the celebrity culture and has taken his eye off the ball so to speak. That's all I can think as to what may be at the root of his failure here. And that is why I don't see that he is up to the job. I mean how can players really take his authority seriously when he is clowning around for the BBC and the LCFC publicity/marketing dept?

I'd agree that it would be good to see some continuity in management but I think the time has come to have a serious cull and start from the ground up. We have a chance to disassociate ourselves from the failings of the last few seasons and start again.

You take a chance employing any manager, but unfortunately Holloway is, and always will be, tainted because of the relegation, therefore it's time to start afresh.

[Ultra]

Am I the only one who thinks Holloway is just not that entertaining?

I dunno, maybe all other footie managers are pretty boring but I find him immensely humdrum and he just tries too hard to be witty, urban. He's no character, just a characture of what he thinks a cult figure should be.

Perhaps he has got himself too caught up in the celebrity culture and has taken his eye off the ball so to speak. That's all I can think as to what may be at the root of his failure here. And that is why I don't see that he is up to the job. I mean how can players really take his authority seriously when he is clowning around for the BBC and the LCFC publicity/marketing dept?

I'd agree that it would be good to see some continuity in management but I think the time has come to have a serious cull and start from the ground up. We have a chance to disassociate ourselves from the failings of the last few seasons and start again.

You take a chance employing any manager, but unfortunately H******y is, and always will be, tainted because of the relegation, therefore it's time to start afresh'. [emboldened and enlarged for the benefit of our brummie readers]

Well said.

The manager as an individual may be entertaining in a social environment.

Unfortunately the team he has overseen for the last six months are far from entertaining in a football environment.

He has sat in judgement on players and decided that many of them were not of sufficient calibre for this club, in some cases terminating their contracts at considerable expense.

He can therefore hardly complain should the owner decide (as he should) to exercise similar judgement on him.

When you look at some of the managers who kept their sides in the Championship (Owen Coyle, Alan Irvine among others), it underlines even further just how appalling the yokel's record has been with us.

The Thatcher-style refrain of "there is no alternative" is as false now as it was when she uttered it.

[lookwhaticando]

Brian Little, anyone?

[Ultra]

Was good 15 years ago, though his record hasn't been impressive since he left Villa.

Perhaps in a Director of Football role?

[Thracian]

Was good 15 years ago, though his record hasn't been impressive since he left Villa.

Perhaps in a Director of Football role?

I thought Jon Rudkin was Director of such football as the club plays!

[Miquel The Work Geordie]

You see that thing that happened last saturday?! I'm pretty sure that was relegation to the third division, not us qualifying for the uefa cup.

And you seriously believe that list are going to come to a beleaguered Third Division side? Seriously? I sure as shit don't.

People name all these names like Tigana and Royle.

They were unwilling to touch us when we were in the championship, they wouldnt come within a mile of the club now.

Joe Royle has a bit of the old romantic about him and could see getting us out of League One as a fascinating challenge. Both managers would be handsomely paid, and, with the squad we've got, could probably get us promoted in the one season, which would look very good on the old "CV". I believe that Royle had talks with Mandaric in November, and was thoughroughly impressed witht the set-up and opportunity, but decided not to persue the job because he wasn't ready for a return to football. That was some time ago now, so he might just be willing to take his chance.

And we are hardly beleagured, we must be one of the favourites to get automatic promotion and easily have the best resources / opportunity in the division. The perfect chance for Mr Collins to begin a career of management in England?

So when I make these suggestions I do it in all seriousness because I believe they could be persuaded to come here.

[maddog]

Come on - all of you carping on that he should be sacked, explain to me this:

• Why, when there is no decent, reasonable suggestion for his replacement?
  

And

• Where is the severance money coming from with a drop in revenue at the club? The Contract Termination Fairy?
  

Someone explain to me how being one million pounds worse off and not having a management team is better than what we currently have because I am ****ed if I can understand your logic.

Please. :huh

Can answers not include reference to his tactics, his record, his salary not being cut or his appearances in the media. Oh, and no mention of Bristol Rovers. Thanks

:clap:

I've tried to sum it up like that but ended up repeating myself and swearing e.g. we should keep fooking Ollie

By the way just in case you didn't see my sig the other day I'm sorry for saying you were one of the ones slagging Ollie off.

[Miquel The Work Geordie]

:clap:

I've tried to sum it up like that but ended up repeating myself and swearing e.g. we should keep fooking Ollie

By the way just in case you didn't see my sig the other day I'm sorry for saying you were one of the ones slagging Ollie off.

With regards to your sig, David Moyes never got anyone relegated. And he had less to spend.

[Ultra]

5000+ fans not renewing season tickets will cost the club well over a million pounds anyway.

And any comparison, explicit or implied, between our current incumbent and a Champions League manager like David Moyes is even more pitiful than our season..

[Jimmy]

5000+ fans not renewing season tickets will cost the club well over a million pounds anyway.

And any comparison, explicit or implied, between our current incumbent and a Champions League manager like David Moyes is even more pitiful than our season..

the fact is the season after Everton finished 4th they had a terrible season finished not too far away from the relegation zone and Moyes could easily been sacked, I see what the guy was saying but it wasn't a point that well made

[Daggers]

I'd be happy giving Penney or Tilson a go.

Enough of you perverted meanderings, there's children reading this forum...well, dannyboy - but he could be disturbed by that.

If Penny was interested I'd be interested in him - a manager who players enjoy playing for.

He seems to have bottled it, frankly. And how can a man lacking confidence and determination inspire the same in his charges?

I'm still not convinced that this is the case. It's like the accusation that he's lost the changing room - from what I saw at Barnsley this was well far from the mark. I feel that it was a number of players who bottled it, and Holloway found it impossible to raise them - but I am certain that this applies for any manager...the players level was found in a very sad way.

Holloway is, and always will be, tainted because of the relegation, therefore it's time to start afresh.

I like to think that in life you have ups and downs - I am not defined by the mistakes I have made (apart from that one incident with the Nun) and I don't apply that to others. So he was here when we went down...the drop for this team has been inevitable for seasons. He managed to accrue a number of points that should have kept us up and we have been subjected to the absolute worst streak of luck I have seen a team suffer beyond having points taken off us.

I agree that if someone better is on offer then we change managers...but the proviso has to be the new bloke is better. Otherwise I am happy for Holloway to turn this all around over the summer, to build a team he has created not partially inherited.

But he has to attack.

[Miquel The Work Geordie]

So he was here when we went down...the drop for this team has been inevitable for seasons. He managed to accrue a number of points that should have kept us up and we have been subjected to the absolute worst streak of luck I have seen a team suffer beyond having points taken off us.

I agree that if someone better is on offer then we change managers...but the proviso has to be the new bloke is better. Otherwise I am happy for Holloway to turn this all around over the summer, to build a team he has created not partially inherited.

The division was significantly weaker this season. At least under Kelly we had random unbeaten runs.

I have to agree with the fact that any new manager must be "better" than Holloway though. Even though he took us down, he has acheived some (very few) feats in his time as a manager.

[Houdini Logic]

Come on - all of you carping on that he should be sacked, explain to me this:

• Why, when there is no decent, reasonable suggestion for his replacement?
  

And

• Where is the severance money coming from with a drop in revenue at the club? The Contract Termination Fairy?
  

Someone explain to me how being one million pounds worse off and not having a management team is better than what we currently have because I am ****ed if I can understand your logic.

Please. :huh

Can answers not include reference to his tactics, his record, his salary not being cut or his appearances in the media. Oh, and no mention of Bristol Rovers. Thanks

A 1 Million pound pay off is minimal compared to spending a couple of years in league 1, which is highly likely if Holloway were to stay.

The guy has the tactical aptitude of a national lottery pen.

[Ultra]

I'm still not convinced that this is the case. It's like the accusation that he's lost the changing room - from what I saw at Barnsley this was well far from the mark. I feel that it was a number of players who bottled it, and H*****y found it impossible to raise them - but I am certain that this applies for any manager...the players level was found in a very sad way.

Many of the worst bottlers were players who have arrived at the club since he's been here - in other words, his chosen men.

I like to think that in life you have ups and downs - I am not defined by the mistakes I have made (apart from that one incident with the Nun) and I don't apply that to others. So he was here when we went down...the drop for this team has been inevitable for seasons.

Sorry but even your standards this is complete bull. I doubt ANY of the 12k+ fans who bought season tickets at the start of this calamitous campaign expected relegation. It should NEVER be an option for us at this level.

He managed to accrue a number of points that should have kept us up and we have been subjected to the absolute worst streak of luck I have seen a team suffer beyond having points taken off us.

We've had an appalling run of refereeing decisions - that is true. However the decisions which have REALLY cost us have been those taken by the chairman and manager - especially with regard to appointments, team selection and tactics.

I agree that if someone better is on offer then we change managers...but the proviso has to be the new bloke is better. Otherwise I am happy for Holloway to turn this all around over the summer, to build a team he has created not partially inherited.

What evidence can you (or he, for that matter) give that he will turn things around?

But he has to attack.

He was told this months ago. He didn't listen then.

It's too late. His fate is already sealed.

[Miquel The Work Geordie]

Many of the worst bottlers were players who have arrived at the club since he's been here - in other words, his chosen men.

Sorry but even your standards this is complete bull. I doubt ANY of the 12k+ fans who bought season tickets at the start of this calamitous campaign expected relegation. It should NEVER be an option for us at this level.

We've had an appalling run of refereeing decisions - that is true. However the decisions which have REALLY cost us have been those taken by the chairman and manager - especially with regard to appointments, team selection and tactics.

What evidence can you (or he, for that matter) give that he will turn things around?

He was told this months ago. He didn't listen then.

It's too late. His fate is already sealed.

I agree with you on this Ultra.

[Daggers]

Many of the worst bottlers were players who have arrived at the club since he's been here - in other words, his chosen men.

Campbell, Fryatt and Hume...Clemence and McCauley. Kisnorbo and N'Gotty. Stearman and Mattock - not forgetting Sheehan.

Come on! Stop trying to warp facts to suit your argument - all the players choked and any part-time psychologist will be able to explain to you the reasons why the new additions started performing as badly as the old guard. His signings did not perform worse and arguments regarding mid-season signing success are long-held, he can not be held totally responsible for their failings.

Sorry but even your standards this is complete bull.

I'll gloss over the trite personal insult - if you can not be civil then refrain from holding a discussion.

We've had an appalling run of refereeing decisions - that is true. However the decisions which have REALLY cost us have been those taken by the chairman and manager - especially with regard to appointments, team selection and tactics.

The Chairman and managers. Yes, and the bit that I added is the salient point - it is the culmination of mistakes that has brought us to this point not the sole decisions of one individual.

What evidence can you (or he, for that matter) give that he will turn things around?

I don't need to - the onus is on someone to provide a credible alternative to the incumbent. Some names have been raised in this thread that I believe may offer a marginal advantage to Holloway - but until it can be proved that they would consider the vacancy and that the financial balance would not effect the club adversly, the choice is impossible to make.

As far as evidence, as sparce as it is, Holloway has achieved promotion from this division, he has the support of key members of the squad (Ref: Barnsley).

He was told this months ago. He didn't listen then.

He wasn't "told" - some people on a forum demanded it, the difference is obvious. What he was told is not public domain.

[Daggers]

The division was significantly weaker this season. At least under Kelly we had random unbeaten runs.

True, to the later - but I compare our worst performances under Kelly and Holloway and the difference is huge. Our bore-draw against Colchester under Kelly was infinitely worse than the 3-1 capitulation to Wednesday.

To the former, I disagree - the division has been closer, harder fought and (ultimately) unfortunately lost.

I'd argue that under Kelly we had blips of results that were outside his direct control, benfiting from the very luck that has been in such short supply this season...but that is a different thread