Absolute *** of our time Pt.MXXVI

[MooseBreath]

I'm sure there are many, many Muslims who feel that way about Christians. Whilst I agree that it is often a brutal religion you'd be kidding yourself if you can't see how Christians are often just as bad.

It's not about how anyone feels about anyone. I'm not speaking subjectively, i'm talking cold heart facts. No-one can say that chrsitianity is at the heart of most current major conflicts because it isn't true. Islam, however, is right there in the middle of almost every current conflict in the world.

Edited 13 November 2012 by MooseBreath

[Rincewind]

What is this 'You lefties' I do not look on people as black or white or Muslim, Catholic Jew or whatever yhey are. If a person acts like a cvnt as you pleasantly put it then it does not matter what label you put on them. If that makes me a bad person in your eyes for treating people as I want to be treated then I am guilty.

[Rincewind]

It's not about how anyone feels about anyone. I'm not speaking subjectively, i'm talking cold heart facts. No-one can say that chrsitianity is at the heart of most current major conflicts because it isn't true. Islam, however, is right there in the middle of almost every current conflict in the world.

I'd love to see the statistics that prove that.

[MooseBreath]

What is this 'You lefties' I do not look on people as black or white or Muslim, Catholic Jew or whatever yhey are. If a person acts like a cvnt as you pleasantly put it then it does not matter what label you put on them. If that makes me a bad person in your eyes for treating people as I want to be treated then I am guilty.

Well that's very righteous and all but it is irrelevant in the context of this conversation. Also if you don't like people being called cvnts then perhaps this isn't the thread for you.

[MooseBreath]

I'd love to see the statistics that prove that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_military_conflicts

There you go. See how many you can find that are free from islamic influence.

[Rincewind]

I refuse to take the bait. I am laughing too much at your replies to think.

[Tielemans63]

It's not about how anyone feels about anyone. I'm not speaking subjectively, i'm talking cold heart facts. No-one can say that chrsitianity is at the heart of most current major conflicts because it isn't true. Islam, however, is right there in the middle of almost every current conflict in the world.

Not really interested in being dragged into a never-ending debate to be honest, I was just pointing out that most of the major religions have a very chequered history - maybe Islam is at the centre of most current wars but historically Christians have run them very close - or does history not count?

Edited 13 November 2012 by Paddy Akinbiyi

[Rincewind]

I lost interest after seeing the statement that treating people for what they are rather than their race, creed , colour or religion was irrelevant and to do so was wrong and therefore is practiced by 'lefties'

It was funny though and I cannot see anyone in a right mind taking it serious or agreeing with it.

There was a report on Newsnight about the civil war in Sri Lanka and the cock up by the UN. There were 20,000 civilian deaths in the last month caused by the Government forces. The UN moved them into a zone that was being attacked. Why were they ignored and those in Iraq/Iran were not? As a former UN worker said on the report there was no oil or valuable resources there. I would imagine that the Sri Lankan war did not involve Islamac people either. I'm one of the last ones to defend religion but I do not see any one better or worse than another. I know some Muslims that do a lot of good within the communities of Leicester alongside people of other faiths. I just see them as good people and humanitarian. Their religion does not bother me. I do not take any notice of papers that brand all those of one race or colour as the wrongdoers because I do not know them and therefore cannot judge.

[acooling08]

Not really interested in being dragged into a never-ending debate to be honest, I was just pointing out that most of the major religions have a very chequered history - maybe Islam is at the centre of most current wars but historically Christians have run them very close - or does history not count?

I guess the major Christian countries - if we are still classed as christian - have civilised themselves.

Most Islamic countries are still living in the middle ages.

[BoneDog]

They would still be cvnts, of course.

You lefties confuse me. You're all for peace and shit but when you're confronted with a religion which is at the root of most major conflicts you defend them.

None of the recent wars were started by a religion. Some of them might be taking place in Muslim countries, but would still be going on whether religion existed or not. Syria for example is a secular country that is being attacked by paid mercenaries, most of whom would be there whether any religion existed or not.

The Muslim Brotherhood is a western front group, created by the British. Hamas was created by the Israelis. The list could go on for a while and it seems obvious to me what it all means.

Religions and political movements get hijacked to take the blame for orchestrated mess.

[Rincewind]

You lefties confuse me. You're all for peace and shit but when you're confronted with a religion which is at the root of most major conflicts you defend them.

I'm all for peace (not sure about the shit part) with or without religion. If any religion is used as an excuse or in its name I will not defend it, in the same I will not defend it when the war is fought over land, oil, politics, racism, colour, creed, or anything else for that matter.

Is that what a leftie does? Strive for peace and harmony between all Mankind? I never knew that. I always thought Lefties were supposed to be evil. Well you learn something new every day. You have enlightened me Moosebreath. Thank you.

Edited 14 November 2012 by Nightguard

[flowwolf]

Personally I despise all religions but in particular Islam. What other religion has the gall to settle in this country then in a very short space of time decide our laws are not good enough for them. The law is at the very core of any society a society that they the Muslim community have decided to come here and join, and now are ignoring not only our laws but our way of life. If ever there was a more brain washed religion I would not want to see it. Mandatory dress codes for both men and women no individuality allowed. Repression on a grand scale , the stoning to death of women for adultery to name but one.

A backward medieval outlook on life and no progression since it inception. Oh yes and death warrants issued by their leaders to anyone who dares to challenge them. In fact murder is sanction in the name of this particular disgusting faith as witnessed by the London bus and tube bombings All in all they add nothing to our progressive society which begs the question why are they here in the first place. No doubt the hand wring lefties on here will now shout racist it's the only card they have when faced with facts.

[MooseBreath]

Not really interested in being dragged into a never-ending debate to be honest, I was just pointing out that most of the major religions have a very chequered history - maybe Islam is at the centre of most current wars but historically Christians have run them very close - or does history not count?

We're not talking about historical cvnts in this thread though, we're talking about absolute cvnts of our time. Acooling implied that Islam is currently responsible for producing a disproportionately high number of cvnts, a point which I agree with, as evidenced by the fact that almost all current conflicts have a strong Islamic element, not to mention the hate preachers, terrorist attacks etc. Only el empty has addressed the point about conflicts, and with all due respect, he is a nutjob conspiracy theorist who does actually believe the entire world is "orchestrated", presumably to stop little people like me from 'seeing the truth', or whatever.

I'm obviously not suggesting all or even many Muslims are cvnts, but I do think if we came up with a robust set of criteria which determines who constitutes a cvnt and then applied it to the global population, it would be disproportionately represented by Muslims.

[Captain...]

It is not the statistical accuracy behind your comments that is so concerning it is the subtext and the implication that the majority of our problems are because of Muslims, but that is not true for every Muslim cleric hate preacher there is a westboro baptist church and many others like it preaching just as much dangerous crap about gays and abortions and many other things. There are also many regimes in Africa that are Christian and are just as tyrannical and despotic as the Muslim ones but we don't get involved we don't make it our concern, probably because they are Christians.

The second implication is that all Muslims are bad, they are the new bogey men, before it was commies and before that the Germans, before that the French and going further back the Catholics and the puritans, we need to have a bogey man, something to fear so these things are amplified in the press and by the government because it sells papers and keeps the people in check, just look at the way the US used 911 to eat away at American's civil liberties, and here we have done the same to a lesser extent.

Yes there are some cvnty Muslims around, but there are just many cvnty Christians and Jews and atheists and a lot of these have a lot more power, influence and blood on their hands than some guy on a street corner in Bradford saying shit.

Edited 14 November 2012 by Captain Shrapnel

[MooseBreath]

You say for every Muslim hate preacher there is a westboro equivalent and that might be true, but for every current major conflict with an Islamic element there is most definitely not a Christian, Buddhist or Hindu equivalent. I will repeat, almost every current major conflict in the world has a strong Islamic element. You seem to be ignoring this point like everyone else.

Also, nowhere did I imply that "all Muslims are bad", infact I made a point of saying the opposite. Strong confirmation bias on your part with that one.

[Finnegan]

Just out of interest, did you consider the Serb-Croat war, the Falklands war, Russian-Georgian disputes, the Congolese civil war and numerous others "Christian" wars?

Your argument seems to be entirely that any conflict in an area with an Islamic populace is a religious war. That's just simply incorrect.

I concede that there are organisations like Al Qaeda using religion as an excuse to commit acts of terror but they're a minority. Most of these disputes are either territorial or are civil wars based on internal disputes, not religion.

Even Israel's conflicts in the region are, really, far more about territory and the fact the West just created a space out of nowhere for an entire country than anything religious.

[The Doctor]

It is not the statistical accuracy behind your comments that is so concerning it is the subtext and the implication that the majority of our problems are because of Muslims, but that is not true for every Muslim cleric hate preacher there is a westboro baptist church and many others like it preaching just as much dangerous crap about gays and abortions and many other things. There are also many regimes in Africa that are Christian and are just as tyrannical and despotic as the Muslim ones but we don't get involved we don't make it our concern, probably because they are Christians.

The second implication is that all Muslims are bad, they are the new bogey men, before it was commies and before that the Germans, before that the French and going further back the Catholics and the puritans, we need to have a bogey man, something to fear so these things are amplified in the press and by the government because it sells papers and keeps the people in check, just look at the way the US used 911 to eat away at American's civil liberties, and here we have done the same to a lesser extent.

Yes there are some cvnty Muslims around, but there are just many cvnty Christians and Jews and atheists and a lot of these have a lot more power, influence and blood on their hands than some guy on a street corner in Bradford saying shit.

The only thing a guy on a street corner in Bradford says is "Spare any change? No, in that case want to buy some drugs?". It's impossible to get out of the train station without being offered drugs or mugged.

[chuck'em]

Moosebreath, flowwolf and acooling talking about religion? I might give this thread a miss for a while

Moosebreath, flowwolf and acooling talking about religion? I might give this thread a miss for a while

[Captain...]

You say for every Muslim hate preacher there is a westboro equivalent and that might be true, but for every current major conflict with an Islamic element there is most definitely not a Christian, Buddhist or Hindu equivalent. I will repeat, almost every current major conflict in the world has a strong Islamic element. You seem to be ignoring this point like everyone else.

Also, nowhere did I imply that "all Muslims are bad", infact I made a point of saying the opposite. Strong confirmation bias on your part with that one.

It was mainly aimed at acooling's comment, the implication in what acooling said is that Muslims are bad.

This is the same shit the Mail spreads by continuously running headlines such as Muslim Paedophile gang, or Muslim hate cleric, at no point has the religion of Jimmy Savile or Gary Glitter been mentioned, so why does the religion always have to be in the headline when it is a Muslim incident.

Your list of ongoing conflicts doesn't prove anything, the majority of those conflicts are not religious conflicts, but a number do happen to occur in muslim countries, Libya, Syria, Sudan, Mali, even Iraq had nothing to do with religion just politics.

Look at South and Central America, there is a huge amount of conflicts in Brazil, El Salvador, Peru, Mexico, Colombia, Ecuador, Venezuela, Panama, Nicaragua, Guatemala, Uk and Ireland, Spain's internal conflicts with the Basque, all the problems in Eastern Europe and Soviet Russia in the last couple of decades, all of the afore mentioned countries are predominantly Christian and have had plenty of problems and conflicts in the last few years, that doesn't mean that Christianity, the prevailing religion in all these countries is particularly cvnty.

[Reynard Bleu]

From what I saw tof he war in Afghanistan and also in Iraq, it had little to do with religion and was mostly about power, religion was used to excuse, defend and explain actions, sometimes terrible actions, that spread absolute fear amongst the population, but the ultimate goal is power for powers sake. True Shi'ite and Sunni bang off at each other now and again, but again its mostly because one has the regional power and the other wants its share.

I don't believe the Taliban commanders that were sending their foot soldiers after me and the rest of ISAF saw me as the infidel invader who must be expunged from his country, because more often than not is wasnt his country, no I was in the way of their grab for power, once we are out the Talib will continue their fight until they get the power back.

[flowwolf]

Moosebreath, flowwolf and acooling talking about religion? I might give this thread a miss for a while

Moosebreath, flowwolf and acooling talking about religion? I might give this thread a miss for a while

Your going to miss it twice ?

[flowwolf]

It was mainly aimed at acooling's comment, the implication in what acooling said is that Muslims are bad.

This is the same shit the Mail spreads by continuously running headlines such as Muslim Paedophile gang, or Muslim hate cleric, at no point has the religion of Jimmy Savile or Gary Glitter been mentioned, so why does the religion always have to be in the headline when it is a Muslim incident.

Your list of ongoing conflicts doesn't prove anything, the majority of those conflicts are not religious conflicts, but a number do happen to occur in muslim countries, Libya, Syria, Sudan, Mali, even Iraq had nothing to do with religion just politics.

Look at South and Central America, there is a huge amount of conflicts in Brazil, El Salvador, Peru, Mexico, Colombia, Ecuador, Venezuela, Panama, Nicaragua, Guatemala, Uk and Ireland, Spain's internal conflicts with the Basque, all the problems in Eastern Europe and Soviet Russia in the last couple of decades, all of the afore mentioned countries are predominantly Christian and have had plenty of problems and conflicts in the last few years, that doesn't mean that Christianity, the prevailing religion in all these countries is particularly cvnty.

Maybe the reason the press make the comment that the miscreants were Muslim is because of their holy than you attitude. You know the bile they pump into the heads of their young about how bad the British society is, how our women are all slags how we are all evil for sending our troops to fight in muslim counties and our use of alcohol and gambling all of which they do in secret. . They would rather kill their own children in so called honour murders than have them marry outside their religion. Nobody gives a fvck what religion Jimmy Savile or Garry Glitter were because they never hid behind religion or used it as an excuse in the first place.

Edited 14 November 2012 by flowwolf

[purpleronnie]

oops edit.

Edited 14 November 2012 by purpleronnie

[Captain...]

Maybe the reason the press make the comment that the miscreants were Muslim is because of their holy than you attitude. You know the bile they pump into the heads of their young about how bad the British society is, how our women are all slags how we are all evil for sending our troops to fight in muslin counties and our use of alcohol and gambling all of which they do in secret. . They would rather kill their own children in so called honour murders than have them marry outside their religion. Nobody gives a fvck what religion Jimmy Savile or Garry Glitter were because they never hid behind religion or used it as an excuse in the first place.

And you have all Christians brain-washing all their kids to hate Gays and Abortions, and despise Jews, prohibit contraception and encourage the spread of Aids.

That's right all of them, every single one.

oops edit.

Fvcking muslims

Edit oops: Incidentally it was this link: http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/emma-la-garde-self-centred-trickery-1435234

Edited 14 November 2012 by Captain Shrapnel

[Bellend Sebastian]

A young Muslim woman once gave me some Bombay Mix that was significantly hotter than I expected it to be, and then laughed at my visible discomfort.

If that's not proof of their villainous intent I don't know what is