act smiley Posted 13 November 2010 Posted 13 November 2010 I hate the argument that over the course of their lives graduates will earn x-times more than non-graduates and should therefore pay even higher tuition fees. There's already a system for that called income tax. Precisely. As for the penalty on paying loans back immediately, I honestly can't think of one reason why this can even be considered fair. Actually, there is a decent argument here - its to prevent those who are financially in a pretty decent position being able to max their loans and drop them into investments (as one guy I know did, back in the day) or someone who gets a good job being able to essentially cut off thousands in debt thanks to having a higher paid job, regardless of whether its actually better for society. Having said that, it is a little bit "cut off the nose to spite the face", in my eyes, but I can see where the argument comes from. Also, for all the arguments about the number of people who roll up to a course and still aren't sure about what they want to do surely it would make sense for some unis to offer american style flexible 4 year courses? Surely makes sense to offer that flexibility within a wider subject area as a variety option, given the big financial gamble people are now being made to make ?
dave the caveman Posted 13 November 2010 Posted 13 November 2010 but they don't actually provide anything useful careerwise. The sciences, engineering, mathematics, law, medical courses etc. those degrees and the students studying them are useful to society because they are preparing for a career which benefits the country. We need people studying the effects of climate change, the quality of energy sources, developing new pharmeceuticals, becoming doctors, accountants. lawyers etc. These all impact upon every day life. Arts degrees don't. Oh and can i just point out that though the tuition fees are rising, the salary at which you have to start paying it back is as well. Did you read the rest of my post, or indeed any of my other posts? As I said not many people do those courses anyway. To argue that all tuition fees should rise because a minority of people study subjects which in your opinion do not do anything for society, is an argument that doesn't even get to its feet, never mind stand up. Plus I think you're underestimating the value of art somewhat. It's not just analysing old paintings, it's film, photography, media, culture, journalism, retail etc etc, most of which you're probably a consumer of in some way or another. Whether or not a degree in these areas really produces competent and worthwhile professionals is open for debate, but the same could be said of most other subjects. At the end of the day if you want to live in a country where functionalilty is the only thing of value, why not pack your bags and head to North Korea? Your view of where our society should be heading seems to belong more in 632af than it does 2010.
Bellend Sebastian Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-11829202 Silly sausage of the week award goes to this chap. I can see why he's angry though, he seems to have the hair of a tramp in his mid 40s. If only he'd bought himself some decent conditioner, perhaps none of this would have happened. Edit: Just noticed his name - I wonder if he's related to William Woollard, who used to present Top Gear in the days when it was more about cars and less about being a twat
Jon the Hat Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-11829202 Silly sausage of the week award goes to this chap. I can see why he's angry though, he seems to have the hair of a tramp in his mid 40s. If only he'd bought himself some decent conditioner, perhaps none of this would have happened. Edit: Just noticed his name - I wonder if he's related to William Woollard, who used to present Top Gear in the days when it was more about cars and less about being a twat An excellent and timely opportunity to show that getting caught up in a crowd of protestors does not take away your personal accountability. Lock him up for 5 years, it is by pure fluke he didn't kill a police officer. If a tory party worker had thrown a fire extinguisher off the roof off Millbank the media would be all over it. For some reason this guy is getting a very easy ride.
Bellend Sebastian Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 An excellent and timely opportunity to show that getting caught up in a crowd of protestors does not take away your personal accountability. Lock him up for 5 years, it is by pure fluke he didn't kill a police officer. If a tory party worker had thrown a fire extinguisher off the roof off Millbank the media would be all over it. For some reason this guy is getting a very easy ride. In fairness I think that's because he was fortunate enough not to maim or kill anyone as much as who he happens to be. Are Tory party workers prone to that sort of thing?
Jon the Hat Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 In fairness I think that's because he was fortunate enough not to maim or kill anyone as much as who he happens to be. Are Tory party workers prone to that sort of thing? I guess that depends who is waiting down below!
Jon the Hat Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 According to the BBC Students are occupying Universities as some kind of protest. It is the pub landlords I feel sorry for.
Bellend Sebastian Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 I guess that depends who is waiting down below! Ultra wearing a hat with a big bullseye on the top?
FoxyPV Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 Ultra wearing a hat with a big bullseye on the top? Use a piano to make sure you hit him. Plus it would be cartoon gold
Benji Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 Law is an arts degree and I wouldn't say lawyers benefit the country at all. let me just contribute by saying, fk you
mancunianfox Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 Law is an arts degree at very few universities or colleges in the country. Most Law graduates are awarded an LLB and not a BA.
Jon the Hat Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 So the Police are penning Students in in Whitehall. So the idiots who attacked Millbank tower a few weeks ago have given the Police the evidence they need to stop other students deomstrating peacefully. Well done you. Good work.
mancunianfox Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 So the Police are penning Students in in Whitehall. So the idiots who attacked Millbank tower a few weeks ago have given the Police the evidence they need to stop other students deomstrating peacefully. Well done you. Good work. It is sad, and it is a tactic that just doesn't work either. Police presence on most demonstrations is very similar to the treatment of football supporters by the police. Plenty of games I have been to where I get the feeling that one or two officers might be helping trouble along...(and this is an exception rather than the rule). Either way the policing of large crowds of people is something that really needs to be looked at in this country.
Daggers Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 So the Police are penning Students in in Whitehall. If they all look like the Woodward boy it's because they've confused them for a flock of sheep.
Bluefoxtim Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 I do Human Geography and am looking at going abroad next year to do voluntary work along the lines of community planning. I've stayed at home and taken the maximum loan out and because I've been in part-time employment, my student loan hasn't been touched. You could argue that I've simply taken money off tax payers and a lot of that money will be leaving the country, but at least some of it will be going to a good cause rather than lining the pockets of landlords and the local pub! People can argue until they're blue in the face about degree choices, but I never considered not going to Uni. I don't have a clue at what I'm going to do long-term and really, I only did the subject because I enjoy it. No courses are a waste of time. If the student is enjoying it, what's the problem? 90% of the people moaning at 'fake' subjects haven't been to University, yet they have had the exact opportunity as anybody else to do something 'worthwhile'.
FoxyPV Posted 24 November 2010 Posted 24 November 2010 Fuck everything. I'm starting a commune. Fucking hippie
Finnegan Posted 25 November 2010 Posted 25 November 2010 Fucking hippie Hell no. We're an anarcho-syndicalist commune. We take it in turns to act as a sort of executive officer for the week. But all the decisions of that office have to be ratified at a special bi-weekly meeting, by a civil majority in the case of purely internal affairs.
Zingari Posted 25 November 2010 Posted 25 November 2010 No you're not !! You're a bunch of layabouts who have read too much Chomsky shite and not enough Tommy Walsh practical stuff !! I bet there's not one on yah as can stop a tap dripping or fix a shelf to a studded wall !! No doubt you'd all flap about and have to call in a proper man to do the job . pfft
Finnegan Posted 25 November 2010 Posted 25 November 2010 I've got a power tool regardless. Well, a hand screw driver anyway.
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