Captain... Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Well Sven's been in charge for a while now and has decided to use Ricardo so I guess he's come to a conclusion on that and I'm sure Ricardo is capable of catching the ball when he feels it's a viable option. People are judging his ability to deal with the ball after one game, let's see how he is at these other aspects of goalkeeping when he's got used to his defenders, playing in the championship and with the ball used in the Championship. It's not just one game though, he has been around for years and he has had these problems for years (apart from the last 2 years when he didn't play a game), my concern is the direct style of play by some in the championship will more than likely cause problems. Long high hoofs into the box need a keeper to come out and claim them, I can't see him doing that. I would imagine it would be much easier to train Weale, to get the ball out quicker and set the attacks going, it may require PVA and Naughton to hold back a bit and give him easier options, but a keeper's first priority is to stop goals. I don't know what Sven's plan is and whether we will see a lot of Ricardo in the next few games, but I really hope he doesn't **** up and cost us a goal in a big match, likewise I really hope Weale doesn't either but so far Ricardo hasn't filled me with confidence.
MrSpaM Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Think i'll start judging him when someones actually had a shot on target against him, because i can't remember Derby having any on saturday. Hardly time to start giving him grief when all he had to do on saturday was goal kicks and a couple of punches.
Captain... Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Think i'll start judging him when someones actually had a shot on target against him, because i can't remember Derby having any on saturday. Hardly time to start giving him grief when all he had to do on saturday was goal kicks and a couple of punches. Does the fact that that was all he had to do, and still looked unconvincing doing it not worry you?
marbelladave Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Personally I thought Ricardo had an excellent first half, playing virtually as a sweeper he effectively gave us an extra defender and seemed to bring a measure of composure to our back 4. His distribution was first class, short simple passes set up attack after attack, the comparison with the 'hoofball' we have been living with for a good few years could not be more stark. Second half, under more pressure, he was less convincing, but it is not all down to him. He needs to form a cohesive unit with his centerbacks, something Weale has not yet managed in more than a season and a half. If he can do this, and as an experienced and intelligent player I think he probably can, then I can see him becoming our regular starter. Sure, there are some issues, but mostly that is a case of adapting to the hustle of Championship football, I am hopeful that he will do so and prove to be a very effective keeper for us. For now, a slightly cautious....
Kitchandro Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 I think so many of you are missing the point it's not about whether one is better than the other or deserves the place on performance it's all about style of play, Sven obviously want's a goal keeper for example who is used to passing the ball out quickly to enable quick counter attacks and not only through the CBs but also through fast attacking FBs. I don't see how this is any different to picking one out field player over another because they offer either something different or because they fit the required style of play. This is also why Hobbs and Fryatt were not first choice. If you're happy with Sven and the style of play he's trying to instil in the team then you have to accept his choice of players to interpret that style. As I said before, nobody cares if he can pass it a few yards, people just want a goalkeeper to avoid making howlers. I think it's a bit over the top to suggest that the goalkeeper significantly efects the style of play. At the end of the day Weale can pass it short if instructed to, that is very simple. But if he's under pressure, I'd rather him hoof it clear than take a risk. The goalkeepers job is to keep goal, be solid, and keep it simple. It is not to be an entertainer. Does the fact that that was all he had to do, and still looked unconvincing doing it not worry you? This
lcfcsnow Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Get a grip Kitchen. You want a keeper with no howlers? Good luck, I think every keeper is prone to one. Especially Weale who loves a howler. Two from Weale I could find on YT, but nevermind, it was only Chris Weale so it wasn't his fault. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQDLB6x_ixs Kamikaze Concentration. Not to mention his lack of ability saving long shots. now.
hackneyfox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 As I said before, nobody cares if he can pass it a few yards, people just want a goalkeeper to avoid making howlers. I think it's a bit over the top to suggest that the goalkeeper significantly efects the style of play. At the end of the day Weale can pass it short if instructed to, that is very simple. But if he's under pressure, I'd rather him hoof it clear than take a risk. The goalkeepers job is to keep goal, be solid, and keep it simple. It is not to be an entertainer. Actually there are a lot of people who appreciate the fact that he is confident with the ball and can start an attack quickly by getting the ball out to the fullbacks. Weale scares the shit out of me when ever he has to come out for a ball. Let's wait and see, it's one game ffs. Question Sven and you generally look a fool. If Weale plays this week it will be due to his recent good form not down to Ricardo having had a poor game, Sven has already explained what he was doing. I know it's Valentine's day but some of these love affairs need to stop,
Kitchandro Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Personally I thought Ricardo had an excellent first half, playing virtually as a sweeper he effectively gave us an extra defender and seemed to bring a measure of composure to our back 4. His distribution was first class, short simple passes set up attack after attack, the comparison with the 'hoofball' we have been living with for a good few years could not be more stark. Second half, under more pressure, he was less convincing, but it is not all down to him. He needs to form a cohesive unit with his centerbacks, something Weale has not yet managed in more than a season and a half. If he can do this, and as an experienced and intelligent player I think he probably can, then I can see him becoming our regular starter. Sure, there are some issues, but mostly that is a case of adapting to the hustle of Championship football, I am hopeful that he will do so and prove to be a very effective keeper for us. For now, a slightly cautious.... But you see you've hit the nail on the head there, all he did was play short, simple passes. I don't see that as class, I see that as very basic and straightforward. People are making out as if every time the ball came to Weale he scored an own goal. Are you saying that Weale can't pass it five yards, or that he never has done? As Shrapnel says, he's been around for years and he's always been a liability with crosses, it's got nothing to do with the English game. He's played at the highest level and I've never rated him for the same reasons as we saw on Saturday. He looked very dodgy to me and I think the only reason people are claiming he showed he can do things that Weale can't are being a bit too loyal to Sven.
hackneyfox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 And some are being too loyal to Weale As they have been to Hobbs, Morrison, Berner, Fryatt et al. This team is playing the best football seen by Leicester fans in years, perhaps we shouldn't complain about Sven's tactics.
Len Finsbury Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 I agree with DavieG, Why can't we have two goalkeepers that play differently and offer options? Perhaps against a team where we need to attack fast and hold a high defensive line, Ricardo plays. Same goes for teams who like to shoot early from distance. If a team is known for width and supplying plenty of crosses for the forwards, then perhaps Weale is more suited. Always good to have options. Personally, I enjoyed his quick distribution and positioning in the first half. I think it showed our intentions against Derby.
Kitchandro Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Actually there are a lot of people who appreciate the fact that he is confident with the ball and can start an attack quickly by getting the ball out to the fullbacks. Weale scares the shit out of me when ever he has to come out for a ball. Let's wait and see, it's one game ffs. Question Sven and you generally look a fool. If Weale plays this week it will be due to his recent good form not down to Ricardo having had a poor game, Sven has already explained what he was doing. I know it's Valentine's day but some of these love affairs need to stop, This is why your arguments have no credibility. If you are going to agree with everything Sven does then I have to ask why you bother posting. There is no love affair from me, I'm simply being honest. You just side with Sven. So don't be a hypocrite.
hackneyfox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Weale has been around for years and a lot of it was sitting on a bench in Bristol.
lcfcsnow Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 But you see you've hit the nail on the head there, all he did was play short, simple passes. I don't see that as class, I see that as very basic and straightforward. People are making out as if every time the ball came to Weale he scored an own goal. Are you saying that Weale can't pass it five yards, or that he never has done? He is very often hesitant to, yes. Until this season he would never throw the ball out. Like Hobbs, he has been taught throw the ball out/pass the ball out from defence this season. Both have tried their best to adapt but ultimately, if we're to progress we need players who have mastered simple things like this to suit the way we are playing.
Kitchandro Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 And some are being too loyal to Weale As they have been to Hobbs, Morrison, Berner, Fryatt et al. This team is playing the best football seen by Leicester fans in years, perhaps we shouldn't complain about Sven's tactics. No I'm really not He's simply the keeper in better form. Did you go to Bramall Lane?
hackneyfox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 This is why your arguments have no credibility. If you are going to agree with everything Sven does then I have to ask why you bother posting. There is no love affair from me, I'm simply being honest. You just side with Sven. So don't be a hypocrite. I side with Sven because he sees the players every day, he knows what type of football he wants to play, he quite clearly knows more about the game than ANYBODY on this site. How can anybody question a player after 1 game when we have seen how Mee and PVA have improved.
Kitchandro Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 He is very often hesitant to, yes. Until this season he would never throw the ball out. Like Hobbs, he has been taught throw the ball out/pass the ball out from defence this season. Both have tried their best to adapt but ultimately, if we're to progress we need players who have mastered simple things like this to suit the way we are playing. With amount of time Derby gave us on Saturday I could have kept goal. I could have played one-twos with Bamba in my own box. So could Weale. Ricardo did nothing special at all. Simple things like catching it though (which is the goalkeeper's main job) he was very unconvincing.
lcfcsnow Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 No I'm really not He's simply the keeper in better form. Did you go to Bramall Lane? Not difficult considering Ricardo hadn't played a game. You need to get over your feelings for certain players, you're making yourself a laughing stock. (Again)
hackneyfox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 No I'm really not He's simply the keeper in better form. Did you go to Bramall Lane? Did you read what Sven said about trying out Ricardo in one game and not having dropped Weale? How can you say his form is better when Ricardo has only played 1 game? Weale has let in a lot from distance recently because every manager tells his players to have a pop. I was surprised that Weale was dropped, whatever happens on Friday I will assume that Sven and Faz have done it because they think it is best for the team, not because they love Player A and hate Player B, as som may on here assume.
Kitchandro Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 I side with Sven because he sees the players every day, he knows what type of football he wants to play, he quite clearly knows more about the game than ANYBODY on this site. How can anybody question a player after 1 game when we have seen how Mee and PVA have improved. Still my point stands though doesn't it? This site is about individual opinions. If you are just going to side with Sven why do you bother posting? It's not your opinion. I have formed an opinion of Ricardo over a number of years, not just Saturday. So I'm not judging him on one game at all. And in fact I'm not judging him any more than those people who are sure he's better than Weale after one game. Like I said before, I would be going on about it but people actually trying to say that he was good I find ludicrous. And can I point out I was one who told others not to write off Mee after one poor appearance. Not difficult considering Ricardo hadn't played a game. You need to get over your feelings for certain players, you're making yourself a laughing stock. (Again) Exactly, he hadn't played in 2 years Weale was playing and was in very good form. Did you read what Sven said about trying out Ricardo in one game and not having dropped Weale? How can you say his form is better when Ricardo has only played 1 game? Weale has let in a lot from distance recently because every manager tells his players to have a pop. I was surprised that Weale was dropped, whatever happens on Friday I will assume that Sven and Faz have done it because they think it is best for the team, not because they love Player A and hate Player B, as som may on here assume. Long shots blah blah blah. He saved some long rangers at Sheff Utd that kept us in front, but you've conveniantly ignored that. You've also conveniantly ignored the fact that most of these long distance goals have been in the top corner, and that the defenders have let the players shoot. If Sven has just rested Weale then fine, that's not my point. My point is that some people on here claiming Ricardo had a good game and will be better than Weale. I find that a baffling conclusion after Saturday (and in fact, after his whole career).
hackneyfox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 My opinion is that Sven knows what he is doing a lot better than people who 'jiz' about players and rate them due to playing FM. My opinion is that we are playing the bet football I have seen in years. My opinion is that we play that football due to Sven having seen our original side and thinking it wasn't good enough. Does an opinion only count if it differs from the best manager we have had in years? Every time a new player has come in there aree those who believe that the current incumbant shouldn't be dropped because 'they may improve given enough time, and they did well last season'. Then we get the 'Sven hates him and has done since day 1' 'Sven only wants to play the players he brought in' as if that is shocking. This board is amazingly reactionary at times.
davieG Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 As I said before, nobody cares if he can pass it a few yards, people just want a goalkeeper to avoid making howlers. I think it's a bit over the top to suggest that the goalkeeper significantly efects the style of play. At the end of the day Weale can pass it short if instructed to, that is very simple. But if he's under pressure, I'd rather him hoof it clear than take a risk. The goalkeepers job is to keep goal, be solid, and keep it simple. It is not to be an entertainer. Well I care and I'm sure Sven does throwing and passing the ball out is integral to the style of game Sven wants to play and what's with all these howlers people are predicting? Every goalkeeper is prone to them I seem to remember Weale making a horrible howler that cost us 3 points against Derby last season. It's certainly not over the top either, passing the ball out quickly to fast FBs is vastly different to hoofing it up to Gallagher on the wing, if you don't think that affects the way we play then I despair. Why are you assuming that Ricardo is not capable 'keeping goal, being solid and keeping it simple" ?. I'm sure if there's a need he'll hoof it but he wont panic and do it unnecessarily. All of this doesn't mean the Ricardo is the final solution but he gives a solid indication of the direction Svens heading in. I'm exhausted arguing the point if you all can't see want Svens trying to achieve and obviously don't trust him then that's your problem. I'm out of this debate.
hackneyfox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 If Sven has just rested Weale then fine, that's not my point. My point is that some people on here claiming Ricardo had a good game and will be better than Weale. I find that a baffling conclusion after Saturday (and in fact, after his whole career). He's played 79 times for his country? Could you point out the highlights of Weale's career to me? For me he has warmed a bench at lower league level for a number of years, signed for us, made some blinding saves but dropped some clangers as well. He's at about the right level now, I don't see him ever playing Premier football.
STUHILL Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Not really sure why we are having this discussion after one game?? Can we at least wait until he has anything to do before we judge him as a Leicester player.
hackneyfox Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Well I care and I'm sure Sven does throwing and passing the ball out is integral to the style of game Sven wants to play and what's with all these howlers people are predicting? Every goalkeeper is prone to them I seem to remember Weale making a horrible howler that cost us 3 points against Derby last season. It's certainly not over the top either, passing the ball out quickly to fast FBs is vastly different to hoofing it up to Gallagher on the wing, if you don't think that affects the way we play then I despair. Why are you assuming that Ricardo is not capable 'keeping goal, being solid and keeping it simple" ?. I'm sure if there's a need he'll hoof it but he wont panic and do it unnecessarily. All of this doesn't mean the Ricardo is the final solution but he gives a solid indication of the direction Svens heading in. I'm exhausted arguing the point if you all can't see want Svens trying to achieve and obviously don't trust him then that's your problem. I'm out of this debate. This Every part of it. But apparently if you agree with Sven then you have no opinion of your own.
Jimmy Posted 14 February 2011 Posted 14 February 2011 Kitch the only game you can bring up is Shef U away does that not tell you something? people could list 3 or 4 examples, just from this season of Weale costing us points
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