Democratic Germany leads free-market England in football's recovery

[purpleronnie]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/sep/21/german-english-football-recovery

At their first home Premier League match this season, Chelsea, owned by the Russian oligarch Roman Abramovich, beat Reading 4-2 in front of 41,733 all-seated supporters whose season tickets at Stamford Bridge, apart from a small family area, cost a minimum £750. Last season's champions in Germany's Bundesliga, Borussia Dortmund, began this one by beating Werder Bremen 2-1, watched by 80,645 people, including 24,454 fans in a vast standing area, paying €187 (£148) for their season tickets.

That gulf in price and experience illustrates a profound difference in philosophy between hyper-commercialised, "free-market" English football and the more democratic German approach to what we used to call "the people's game". In both countries, football has been revitalised since the grim end of the 1980s, when 96 Liverpool supporters were killed in English football's worst disaster at Hillsborough, and average crowds in the Bundesliga sank to 17,291.

German football has staged a recovery every bit as remarkable as that of the English game, but without surrendering some of the popular traditions, such as standing areas for fans and cheaper tickets. In 1993, contemplating outbreaks of hooliganism at Bundesliga grounds, the German FA, the Deutscher Fussball Bund, considered following England's lead and making all-seat stadiums compulsory. It decided to keep standing areas, in a statement cherished by the Football Supporters Federation in England: "Football, being a people's sport, should not banish the socially disadvantaged from its stadia, and it should not place its social function in doubt."

Just this year, the English FA told a Commons select committee for culture, media and sport inquiry that it considered issues such as ticket prices to be outside its jurisdiction. The general secretary, Alex Horne, said the FA believed in a "free-market approach" to club ownership.

In Germany, the Bundesliga clubs are still large membership associations, owned and controlled by their supporters, a remarkable adherence to a mutual constitution in this hyper-commercial era. There are exceptions: Wolfsburg and Bayer Leverkeusen have historically been the works teams of Volkswagen and the pharmaceutical company Bayer respectively, and Hoffenheim is owned by a software entrepreneur. The others remain associations, although most have formed a subsidiary company to run the football team itself.

A league regulation, maintained by the clubs, holds that these football companies must be majority owned (50% plus one of the shares) by its member association. So even the mightiest of clubs, the multimillion-pound giants on the European stage Bayern Munich and Dortmund, are majority-controlled by their supporter-members. Bayern, Chelsea's opponents in last season's European Champions League final, have 185,000 members who own 82% of the football company itself; 9% stakes have been sold for vast sponsorship fortunes to the German corporate giants Audi and Adidas.

The way the clubs work in practice varies, but all the member-owned clubs incorporate democracy. Now they are mostly structured like major German companies, with a management board running day-to-day operations, and a supervisory board appointing the directors and overseeing their performance. The members of the supervisory board are elected at an annual general meeting, at which the supporter-members, according to a 50%+1 regulation, have a permanent majority. So, the supporters exercise direct, democratic control over the great German football clubs. The management board is delegated to run the club, it in turn delegates the football decisions to a coach and their staff, and the fans turn up to watch the fruits of their labours.

"Football clubs are social and cultural institutions and not just businesses like any other," says Antonia Hagemann, head of European development at Supporters Direct, which campaigns for more supporter involvement in British football clubs. "Democratic structures mean clubs are run openly and transparently; boards are held accountable, there is a certain stability in place, ownership doesn't change so democratically run clubs tend to follow a longer term vision."

Three years ago, the 50% + 1 rule was challenged by Hannover 96, whose president had visions of Premier League-style stock market flotations, but the Bundesliga clubs solidly upheld it, by 32 votes to Hannover's one (three clubs abstained).

Jens Wagner, a Hamburg representative of the German football supporters group Unsere Kurve, which campaigned passionately for the rule to be maintained, said: "German football is not perfect but we do not want to be like England, where the clubs are owned by one rich man who puts money in. That causes inflation and instability, and it is in the spirit of clubs for there to be democracy."

Since its surprisingly late formation as a fully professional national league in 1963 (England's Football League began in 1888), the Bundesliga has incorporated financial regulations designed to encourage clubs to live within their means and not rack up huge debts. Refined over the years, this German system became the basis for Europe's governing body, Uefa, when it considered introducing its "financial fair play" rules, which require lossmaking clubs to move towards breaking even.

It has not always been adhered to in Germany – Dortmund almost went bust in the late 1990s under the cost of expanding their Signal Iduna Park stadium to the huge capacity that has since been the foundation of the club's more recent success. Last year, the clubs collectively made a €52.5m (£43m) profit, after tax, and reduced their liabilities, while Bayern reached the Champions League final and Bundesliga crowds, averaging 44,293, were the highest in the world.

"The Bundesliga is remaining true to its principles and maintaining its reliance on the factors which have made a decisive contribution to the success of the professional game in Germany in recent decades: stability, continuity and proximity to fans," said Dr Reinhard Rauball, the German league association president.

Many English football supporters, offered no alternative by the Premier League and FA, look to the sporting principles maintained by the Germans with envy and admiration.

[Samilktray]

[act smiley]

The tl;dr is Germany has cake, eats it, still has cake. Predictably.

These articles seem to be trotted out every 6 months, I don't think there's anyone who hasn't read a few. The problem at this point is yes, that's the right way of doing it and yes, we've got something that isn't as good for anyone (except Sky's accountants), but its essentially - how do you get from here to there?

It requires a massive cultural shift, taking the power away from the billionaires currently holding all the cards, stopping the knuckle-dragging types being like that and various other seemingly impossible tasks. You can't just say "oh, if we could stand up it would be all better" because while that's a nice thing to do its also very insignificant when compared to everything else.

But of course that isn't as easy as stating the obvious, which is why the sports journalists don't bother. Which is also part of the problem.

[Captain...]

Great read thanks for that, I would love to go to Germany for a few football matches, everyone says the atmosphere the quality and the price are fantastic.

We really have dug a hole for ourselves in England with the premier league.

Shame really cos it is a great sport.

[Guest]

Interesting read. Shrapnels right in the fact we have dug ourselves a hole here.

The German approach

'Three years ago, the 50% + 1 rule was challenged by Hannover 96, whose president had visions of Premier League-style stock market flotations, but the Bundesliga clubs solidly upheld it, by 32 votes to Hannover's one (three clubs abstained)'

whereas in the UK

'The general secretary, Alex Horne, said the FA believed in a "free-market approach" to club ownership'

[Dan]

It's so true but whilst you've got people who aren't football fans (as much as they want you to believe they are) calling the shots right at the top end, who have more interest in money than the sport, you'll always get the greedy cvnts getting priority.

German football absolutely shits over English and the one thing it doesn't have over ours is the global popularity and amount of money a club can spend, yet their teams seem to be getting stronger in Europe and ours weaker.

[Guest MattP]

Doesn't even mention the fact you can stand up with a beer in your hand either.

If people on here havnt been to a game in Germany do it ASAP, it's a completely different experience going to a game.

[Libertine Dream]

Great read thanks for that, I would love to go to Germany for a few football matches, everyone says the atmosphere the quality and the price are fantastic.

We really have dug a hole for ourselves in England with the premier league.

Shame really cos it is a great sport.

Ive actually been to Dortmund to watch a game, completelt different experience and possibly a more enjoyable one as well. If we can get anywhere close to that in our game I'd be happy but at the moment it seems a world away.

[Mack]

The best players don't play in Germany, nor is it watched that avidly outside Germany apart from by a minority who think their Football is some sort of utopia.

In fact most players who get scouted in the Bundesliga soon end up in the Premier League, La Liga etc.

In addition, even though they have fan part ownership etc the same teams (mostly Munich) win the league over and over again, with the same contenders around them.

[Guest MattP]

The best players don't play in Germany, nor is it watched that avidly outside Germany apart from by a minority who think their Football is some sort of utopia.

In fact most players who get scouted in the Bundesliga soon end up in the Premier League, La Liga etc.

In addition, even though they have fan part ownership etc the same teams (mostly Munich) win the league over and over again, with the same contenders around them.

5 different winners in the last 8 years, we can't match that.

Not saying it's football utopia, it certainly is as close as I have come to it in the stands though.

[Super_horns]

Its been well known for a while Germany has one if not the best value for money regarding its football and relationship between fans and the clubs.

Are the players so hyped up and the hate between different clubs as obvious in the press I wonder?

Been watching the highligts on Channel 4 - most grounds seem full up and often you get fans mixing with each other...

[Mack]

5 different winners in the last 8 years, we can't match that.

Not saying it's football utopia, it certainly is as close as I have come to it in the stands though.

And in the last 12 years Munich have won it 8 times. Depends how you read the stats.

[Guest MattP]

And in the last 12 years Munich have won it 8 times. Depends how you read the stats.

That can't be true as Dortmund have won it 3 times since 2000 and Wolfsburg, Stuttgart and Bremen have.

[21st Century Fox]

And in the last 12 years Munich have won it 8 times. Depends how you read the stats.

00–01 FC Bayern Munich

01–02 Borussia Dortmund

02–03 FC Bayern Munich

03–04 SV Werder Bremen

04–05 FC Bayern Munich

05–06 FC Bayern Munich

06–07 VfB Stuttgart

07–08 FC Bayern Munich

08–09 VfL Wolfsburg

09–10 FC Bayern Munich

10–11 Borussia Dortmund

11–12 Borussia Dortmund

[Vacamion]

Money controlling the game leads eventually to Nani putting a life size statue of himself in his lounge, which in no universe I can think of is a good thing.

However, I think we won't ever adopt the German model whilst those at the top of our game grow fat on Sky money, the fans all demand unrealistic splurges on crap foreign players and smaller clubs sink deeper into the financial mire.

Look at Leeds - on the telly right now - a great club but run terribly in recent years, to the extent that they would rather charge loads (and have a half empty ground) than cater to their fanbase.

We are, as a footballing country, stuck with what we have now.

[Voll Blau]

Don't get me wrong in Germany you've still got sponsored bowl stadia, odd kick off times etc.

The difference is they still give a **** about the man who turns up and pays his 10 euros or whatever to see the game.

They don't seek to dictate the "matchday experience" over there, they just let the fans get on with it because they realise the fans know best!

You can have all the twats poncing around with MBAs you like trying to work out what their "target demogrpahic" want from their day at the football in this country, but if they just bothered to have a quick glance at what's going on over there they'd be on to a winner straight away.

[Haydos]

The best players don't play in Germany, nor is it watched that avidly outside Germany apart from by a minority who think their Football is some sort of utopia.

In fact most players who get scouted in the Bundesliga soon end up in the Premier League, La Liga etc.

In addition, even though they have fan part ownership etc the same teams (mostly Munich) win the league over and over again, with the same contenders around them.

Who are all the German players in England? Huth....Podolski. That's all I can think of. Khedira, Ozil and Trochowski are the only ones in La Liga. Nice try though.

I'm sure you just make things up to suit your argument most of the time.

[BlueSi13]

Who are all the German players in England? Huth....Podolski. That's all I can think of. Khedira, Ozil and Trochowski are the only ones in La Liga. Nice try though.

I'm sure you just make things up to suit your argument most of the time.

To be fair not many Germans seem to enjoy playing outside Germany, similar attitude to English players really.

Having lived in Germany (Munich) for quite a stretch i can confirm the fan structure is fantastic in the Bundesliga, however my team was 1860 Munich and the matchday experience was pretty piss poor and the ticket prices were rather steep. But then again they were on the verge of going under at the time so i couldn't blame them.

Also i noticed that seemingly, if it wasn't in the Bundesliga, nobody gave a shit. Not Bundesliga 2 and i don't think i ever heard 3. Fussball-Liga mentioned once.

I don't think anyone can deny that English football had to change, however i think its also pretty clear that we went too far. We have given far too much control to those who seek to regulate and turn the sport into the biggest money making machine they can, and damn those who are left behind or those who feel like the stadium is not a welcome place for them to vocally support their team. These people aren't exactly going to give that power back anytime soon.

The best way we as a nation fight back is by no longer purchasing the product. Don't go to matches, stop buying merchandise, and stop paying for sky sports. The down side of this is that we will probably lose many a club, however the upside is that we may get our game back. Tough call.

[Kitchandro]

Can't really argue with any of this, most football fans would love what the German fans have.

It's hard to ever see that happening though.

It's possible we might get standing back a long way in the future, but it's hard to see how ticket prices will go down and crowds go up. People like football too much to starve themselves completely of it. It's unrealistic to expect everyone to just stop watching it live and on TV.

[Jordan]

I know Borussia Dortmund floats stock on German exchanges... I'm trying to buy some shares for my younger brother as a gift (he follows the Bundesliga closely, particularly BVB). Unfortunately, I'm unable to buy shares via my bank's brokerage, and setting up a brokerage account elsewhere would cost fees that are ridiculous relative to the 70 Euros or so of shares that I'd want to purchase.

Do any of you that follow German fußball closely--particularly BVB--and/or know a little about how the German stock exchanges work have any ideas or advice on how I can purchase some stock in the club?

[Rocket-Ron]

And when was the last time a Germany team won anything out of their domestic league?

[purpleronnie]

what's your point?

[Rocket-Ron]

That the FA need there clubs to be successful in Europe to back up there claim to be the best league in the world.

Don't get me wrong I think football in this country is going to have to go for drastic changes sooner or later and it wouldn't surprise me if the likes of France and Germany will start being the top leagues in Europe. A little like ourselves and Spain did from the Italian league back in in the 90's.

[C-man]

And when was the last time a Germany team won anything out of their domestic league?

I think they're getting stronger. I can see Bayern going further than any English club this year, which would strengthen their co-efficient position even further. Since overhauling Italy to take 3rd (and the fourth CL spot that comes with it) they have gone 13+ co-efficient points clear of Italy and now sit only 4 points below England, that in spite of Chelsea's win last season.

I'm not too sure what's happening with the PL - it's obviously of a higher quality throughout than the Bundesliga (in general) - but teams just can't seem to defend when it comes to playing in Europe.

As for Germany being some sort of footballing utopia - I think that's the term someone used earlier - well, it's not. Yes, fans are more organised and are very protective over their right to stand, drink, smoke (and create an actual atmosphere) but they face increasing pressure from the DFB who want to make it a 'safer experience' for match-goers. Make no bones about it, their FA (DFB) think that our FA have got a lot spot on. It seems Associations are run by morons worldwide! I know Dortmund fans who were forced to pay €53 to watch VfR Aalen (2nd division) in the Cup 2nd round a couple of weeks ago. The same Dortmund fans who paid €94 to watch Hamburg earlier this season.

You can look at Bayern and remark how wonderful it is that their cheapest season ticket is €96, but you'll be dead before you get one and those members who go to the odd game are fleeced to compensate the club.

It's more fun than English football, everything about a match day is better. Just don't believe that it will last forever.

[C-man]

Alemannia Aachen (relegated to 3rd tier last season) declared insolvent today. The latest in a long line of disasters in the lower reaches of German football.

The grass isn't always greener...