Chef - describes a visit to Leicester "as one of the most frightening experiences of my life".

[Nick]

No, you are incapable of providing the thoughts behind your accusations because there are none. It is conditioned behavior.

No its not

It's because you are being racist.

You're racist because you state that all asian areas are shit holes, you're oppressive because any potential new member from such a demographic won't want to post here because they'll have to deal with your oppressive, narrow minded ignorance.

You're a tool.

That's not conditioned behaviour that's just a response to you making offensive racist statements.

And I know how you like me to sum everything up with an image:

[acooling08]

I don't know if I am racist against Asians.

Because on the one hand I tend to get on with intergrated Asians fairly well just like I would with any white person. I can appreciate Asian doctors, dentists, pharmacists etc for how they contribute to the country. I will sit next to an Asian on a bus or whatever without a second thought.

But on the other hand witnessing Melton Road, or prayer time at a Leicester mosque triggers some sort of hateful response... I feel like we are being colonised, invaded and overun by imported Asian poverty. And to be honest it frightens and disgusts me how our city (and increasingly county) is being transformed in this way.

I also wonder if racist is an in-built genetic characteristic, or the result of socialisation and upbringing - or both.

[Mack]

Just watch you don't hit their cow as you reverse off the driveway and whatever you do, don't touch the basket on the front lawn. Especially if there's a flute near it.

That's a cow? I thought it was the mother in law!

[Nick]

I don't know if I am racist against Asians.

Because on the one hand I tend to get on with intergrated Asians fairly well just like I would with any white person. I can appreciate Asian doctors, dentists, pharmacists etc for how they contribute to the country. I will sit next to an Asian on a bus or whatever without a second thought.

But on the other hand witnessing Melton Road, or prayer time at a Leicester mosque triggers some sort of hateful response... I feel like we are being colonised, invaded and overun by imported Asian poverty. And to be honest it frightens and disgusts me how our city (and increasingly county) is being transformed in this way.

I also wonder if racist is an in-built genetic characteristic, or the result of socialisation and upbringing - or both.

I think you've answered your own question.

But at least you are starting to ask the right questions.

[sphericalfox]

I don't know if I am racist against Asians.

Because on the one hand I tend to get on with intergrated Asians fairly well just like I would with any white person. I can appreciate Asian doctors, dentists, pharmacists etc for how they contribute to the country. I will sit next to an Asian on a bus or whatever without a second thought.

But on the other hand witnessing Melton Road, or prayer time at a Leicester mosque triggers some sort of hateful response... I feel like we are being colonised, invaded and overun by imported Asian poverty. And to be honest it frightens and disgusts me how our city (and increasingly county) is being transformed in this way.

I also wonder if racist is an in-built genetic characteristic, or the result of socialisation and upbringing - or both.

It's probably because your parents told you to be a racist.

[Rincewind]

Make your own mind up.

Racism is usually defined as views, practices and actions reflecting the belief that humanity is divided into distinct biological groups called races and that members of a certain race share certain attributes which make that group as a whole less desirable, more desirable, inferior or superior.^[1][2][3]

The exact definition of racism is controversial both because there is little scholarly agreement about the meaning of the concept "race", and because there is also little agreement about what does and doesn't constitute discrimination.^[4] Some definitions would have it that any assumption that a person's behavior would be influenced by their racial categorization is racist, regardless of whether the action is intentionally harmful or pejorative. Other definitions only include consciously malignant forms of discrimination.^[5] Among the questions about how to define racism are the question of whether to include forms of discrimination that are unintentional, such as making assumptions about preferences or abilities of others based on racial stereotypes, whether to include symbolic or institutionalized forms of discrimination such as the circulation of ethnic stereotypes through the media, and whether to include the socio-political dynamics of social stratification that sometimes have a racial component. Some definitions of racism also include discriminatory behaviors and beliefs based on cultural, national, ethnic, caste, or religious stereotypes.^[3][6]

Racism and racial discrimination are often used to describe discrimination on an ethnic or cultural basis, independent of whether these differences are described as racial. According to the United Nations convention, there is no distinction between the terms racial discrimination and ethnic discrimination, and superiority based on racial differentiation is scientifically false, morally condemnable, socially unjust and dangerous, and that there is no justification for racial discrimination, in theory or in practice, anywhere.^[7]

In politics, racism is commonly located on the far right due to the far right’s common association with nativism, racism, and xenophobia.^[8] In history, racism has been a major part of the political and ideological underpinning of genocides such as The Holocaust, but also in colonial contexts such as the rubber booms in South America and the Congo, and in the European conquest of the Americas and colonization of Africa, Asia and Australia. It was also a driving force behind the transatlantic slave trade, and behind states based on racial segregation such as the USA in the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries and South Africa under apartheid.^[9] Practices and ideologies of racism are universally condemned by the United Nations in the Declaration of Human Rights.^[10]

[lavrentis]

The left wing brigade that shout racist at everything makes me sick almost as much as the racists themselves

[Rincewind]

There are racists and anti-racists. They do not have to be affiliated with any particular political party.

I am a moderate. There is no political party for me.

[Guest]

Wow. Just, wow.

[Jordan]

Well, there was only one path this thread was ever going to take...

[davieG]

Leicester is a bit of a shit hole we've gone from being one of the cleanest cities in the country to a dirty characterless one but I doubt it's down to a few 'Asians'.

Are they the ones that drop their litter on the ground and spit out their chewing gum that plasters the pavements without a second thought are they the ones that pull down fences, rip up saplings daub paint over anything that doesn't move and entertain themselves by wanton vandalism and many other selfish acts that makes Leicester the shit hole it's become. If we're getting into stereotyping people then I'd say probably not.

[purpleronnie]

Just wondered what people constitute a shithole, people seem to tag practically every town as one but will state other towns outside of the UK as great cities, I guarentee you if you got those same 'great cities' and placed them in the UK people will automatically say they're now shitholes. There seems to be a large proportion of people who are incapable of praising their home towns or any town they visit. Believe me coming back from the states and other countries I can say we really don't have many shitholes....Maybe these people who claim we do should get out more....or realise they have had a very sheltered life.

[MPH]

You do surprise me ! my post went over your head, I had you down for a little more intelligence than that ?

I've long given up on asking you to back up your accusations. I now genuinely believe that you don't actually have the power of independent thought. You've been conditioned to react in the way that you do, and you do it without even knowing why. You are brainwashed.

Some very childish responses in here

[davieG]

Just wondered what people constitute a shithole, people seem to tag practically every town as one but will state other towns outside of the UK as great cities, I guarentee you if you got those same 'great cities' and placed them in the UK people will automatically say they're now shitholes. There seems to be a large proportion of people who are incapable of praising their home towns or any town they visit. Believe me coming back from the states and other countries I can say we really don't have many shitholes....Maybe these people who claim we do should get out more....or realise they have had a very sheltered life.

Well I used the term shit hole in comparison to what it used to be and that was without litter, chewing gum and the vandalism so prevalent today, I'm not comparing it to other Cities I'm sure they have similar problems.

Just this morning I was in a park in the children's play area with my son and grandson and there were 3 drinks cans lying around not 10 yards from a litter bin and this was in a predominantly 'white area'

[Guest]

Leicester is a bit of a shit hole we've gone from being one of the cleanest cities in the country to a dirty characterless one but I doubt it's down to a few 'Asians'.

Are they the ones that drop their litter on the ground and spit out their chewing gum that plasters the pavements without a second thought are they the ones that pull down fences, rip up saplings daub paint over anything that doesn't move and entertain themselves by wanton vandalism and many other selfish acts that makes Leicester the shit hole it's become. If we're getting into stereotyping people then I'd say probably not.

I disagree that Leicester is a shit hole. I think it's a farily clean pretty nice city.

The problem with letter and grafiti is down to a change in council policy. Leicester used to have the best grafiti squad in Britain often asked by other cities to advise. Litter is down to lazy people but with unemployment so high I think that people could be paid the minimum (or if tory voters prefer - get their job seekers allowance) for a few hours of street cleaning.

[MooseBreath]

You're racist because you state that all asian areas are shit holes

This is what it comes down to really. You think it's racist to point out a fact if the fact can be considered derogatory. I don't. You think we should be careful what we say for fear if upsetting anyone, I think the only way we'll ever make progress is by confronting the truth. You think it's 1970 and you're pioneering anti-racism, I realise it's 2012 and we're well past the point where simply shouting racist at every opportunity is going to get us anywhere. Your views are outdated, mine are forward thinking.

[davieG]

I disagree that Leicester is a shit hole. I think it's a farily clean pretty nice city.

The problem with letter and grafiti is down to a change in council policy. Leicester used to have the best grafiti squad in Britain often asked by other cities to advise. Litter is down to lazy people but with unemployment so high I think that people could be paid the minimum (or if tory voters prefer - get their job seekers allowance) for a few hours of street cleaning.

So you accept that all that shit exists then so it's not clean.

My point was that it's dirty because of it's inhabitants and in all probability the ones dropping litter, chewing gum and vandalising are no more likely to be Asian than white.

[The Doctor]

Moose and Cooling's 101 Good Uses For An Ethnic

1. Driving buses and the like in the 1950s (labour shortage need)

2. Giving their lives in our wars (cannon fodder need)

3. Production and service of Britains most popular foods e.g curry (good after a beer need)

4. Support for the airline industry (repatriation need - alternatively just stick 'em in a boat if flights get too expensive)

5. Making us feel better about ourselves (because we're not one of them)

6. Errr, thats it.

- I'd doubt the two of 'em think there's that many uses.

The left wing brigade that shout racist at everything makes me sick almost as much as the racists themselves

You're such a racist lav

[Rincewind]

MooseI

t's true you are not racist according to your definition of the word, but to the dictionary and a lot of other people you have the basic attributes that defines the word. I'll throw out a challenge, look up the definition of the word and if you or anyone else find matches with your statements about other races that match the definition of the word will you concede that you have racist tendancies. If you can prove that your remarks do not match then I for one will not class you as a racist. Can't say fairer than that.

[21st Century Fox]

Let's have a look in Moosey's big bag of facts....

[lavrentis]

You're such a racist lav

I don't know, they are the sort of people that don't see the irony when they go KILL ALL RACISTS!!!11!

[MooseBreath]

MooseI

t's true you are not racist according to your definition of the word, but to the dictionary and a lot of other people you have the basic attributes that defines the word. I'll throw out a challenge, look up the definition of the word and if you or anyone else find matches with your statements about other races that match the definition of the word will you concede that you have racist tendancies. If you can prove that your remarks do not match then I for one will not class you as a racist. Can't say fairer than that.

Defining racism is an interesting subject. I don't consider a dictionary to be the ultimate authority on such a subject, nevertheless the dictionary.com definition is thus:

rac·ism

   /ˈreɪsɪzəm/ Show IPA

noun

1.

a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.

2.

a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.

3.

hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

Number 2 is a product of number 1 so can be disregarded. Number 1 itself I would consider to be extremely old fashioned and in line with the Nick, Fif et al line of thinking. The idea that inherent differences amoung various human races don't determine cultural or individual achievement in some cirumstances and to some extent is ludicrous, but to some it seems that the mention of these differences constitutes racism when to me it obviously does not.

Number 3 is closer to my definition. I would add that the hatred or intolerance needs to be justified by the protagonist only by race itself. Saying you hate Vietnamese people because you think they are all dishonest is not racist because the reason for the hatred is not their race but because of your perception that they are all dishonest. For it to be racist you would need to hate them simply for the fact that they are Vietnamese.

[Rincewind]

Let sleeping dogs lie.

[skinnydipper]

Defining racism is an interesting subject. I don't consider a dictionary to be the ultimate authority on such a subject, nevertheless the dictionary.com definition is thus:

rac·ism

   /ˈreɪsɪzəm/ Show IPA

noun

1.

a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.

2.

a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.

3.

hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

Number 2 is a product of number 1 so can be disregarded. Number 1 itself I would consider to be extremely old fashioned and in line with the Nick, Fif et al line of thinking. The idea that inherent differences amoung various human races don't determine cultural or individual achievement in some cirumstances and to some extent is ludicrous, but to some it seems that the mention of these differences constitutes racism when to me it obviously does not.

Number 3 is closer to my definition. I would add that the hatred or intolerance needs to be justified by the protagonist only by race itself. Saying you hate Vietnamese people because you think they are all dishonest is not racist because the reason for the hatred is not their race but because of your perception that they are all dishonest. For it to be racist you would need to hate them simply for the fact that they are Vietnamese.

Re your Vietnamese example the statement is racist within the category of the first definition that you provided.

But as you think that definition is outdated it's hardly surprising that you don't consider it to be so.

I'm guessing that you're not too shocked at how you're perceived though.

Generalised statements are pretty unintelligent anyway. In this country we have plenty of benefits cheats, ergo it could be said that "all English are lying cheating scumbags" To my mind such a comment would be made by a thick racist.

[MooseBreath]

Re your Vietnamese example the statement is racist within the category of the first definition that you provided.

But as you think that definition is outdated it's hardly surprising that you don't consider it to be so.

I'm guessing that you're not too shocked at how you're perceived though.

Generalised statements are pretty unintelligent anyway. In this country we have plenty of benefits cheats, ergo it could be said that "all English are lying cheating scumbags" To my mind such a comment would be made by a thick racist.

If the first definition is correct then the field of elite sprinting is extremely racist against the Japanese. Clearly it is a nonsensical definition.

I agree that generalised statements are unintelligent but that doesn't make them racist.