Is the defending in the Premier League getting worse or is the attacking getting better?

[theessexfox]

With the record number of PL goals conceded (and scored) in 2012, and just watching game after game of poor defending on MOTD, is it that the defending in the Premier League is getting worse, or is the attacking force getting stronger?

[Vardinhio]

Defending worse, so many defenders these days are being asked to score from open play. Never used to be like that.

[BoneDog]

The standard of defending does seem to be at a low point at the moment.

There are only two possible reasons. The defences are not as good as they used to be, or the defenders are doing alot of Goals Galore acca's and making mistakes on purpose. The jury's out.

[Tielemans63]

Think it's a bit of both to be honest.

[AKCJ]

Mostly defending getting worse but the level of attacking talent has dropped, too.

[Dan]

Defending worse, not a question. It's proven in Europe by the fact there was what, three clean sheets in total from four English sides in six games each in the CL? And even they were against sides like Montpellier.

The attacking isn't what it was and the defending's not even close. The league's massively over-rated for me and if the same players played in France without the hype I genuinely believe they wouldn't get much more attention that the current Ligue 1. People will question me on this but you take away the hype, do you not find the PL to be over-rated? I honestly don't think Man City/Chelsea going out of the CL was a fluke either.

There are so many things wrong with the PL it annoys me. I hate what it's turned into, as I do believe at one stage it genuinely was the one.

[Guest shearfox]

Defending worse, not a question. It's proven in Europe by the fact there was what, three clean sheets in total from four English sides in six games each in the CL? And even they were against sides like Montpellier.

The attacking isn't what it was and the defending's not even close. The league's massively over-rated for me and if the same players played in France without the hype I genuinely believe they wouldn't get much more attention that the current Ligue 1. People will question me on this but you take away the hype, do you not find the PL to be over-rated? I honestly don't think Man City/Chelsea going out of the CL was a fluke either.

There are so many things wrong with the PL it annoys me. I hate what it's turned into, as I do believe at one stage it genuinely was the one.

You are boring

[Dan]

You are boring

You're massively interesting with your three word replies. The irony is sensational.

[Jimothy]

One thing that is certainly getting worse is the amount of players expecting the linesmen to defend for them. Just watched Agger for Liverpool standing a full 2 yards behind the rest of his backline, looking straight at Milner as he's not only got Agger himself playing him on but Glenn Johnson too, throws his arm up in the air claiming offside. As the goal goes in you can see him look towards the linesman. He's looking straight at Milner as Milner collects the ball with Johnson playing him on, but appeals anyway, loses track of Dzeko and it's a goal. I saw Rio Ferdinand earlier in the season against Villa absolutely lambast the linesman for not giving offside when the player in question (Weimann) was behind Ferdinand, so Ferdinand had no idea if he was offside or not. Those are just two off the top of my head from this season, but you see defenders do it all the time. Seem to remember a Forest defender claiming for offside as Andy King knocked the ball past him on the way to scoring in the 3-0 win a couple of seasons ago. Unbelievable!

Just wrote all that and thought of another one. If you watched the Newcastle Chelsea highlights yesterday, Newcastle had a shot and it squirmed through to land at Cisse's feet, who went on to tamely sidefoot the ball into Cech's hands. Whilst he was shooting, supposedly world class John Terry stopped dead in the middle of the box about a yard behind Cisse and threw his arms up in the air screaming offside. Just carry on, try and stop him, the linemans not going to help you. Don't know if they're coached to do that, or if they are just lazy, but it does my head in.

[Dan]

It's heat of the moment but you'd think professional footballers would have learned by now to play to the whistle and that's borderline ridiculous really considering you'd naturally just think they'll do their best to get the ball even if the whistle is blown.

It's either appalling coaching or defenders being almost arrogant.

[Happy Fox]

Interesting does this correlate with the competitiveness or quality? I think the prem is more competitive now at both ends of the table and is becoming more championship esque in that regards whereas the quality has diminished and is shifted more to technique in La Liga and the Bundesliga.

[Super_horns]

The attacking players are just so much better than the defenders I feel.

Even most of the full backs are noted for their attacking play rather than defensive work.

[Dan]

Interesting does this correlate with the competitiveness or quality? I think the prem is more competitive now at both ends of the table and is becoming more championship esque in that regards whereas the quality has diminished and is shifted more to technique in La Liga and the Bundesliga.

I disagree. When's the last time a genuine outsider came top 3?

[Soar Fox]

You are boring

What an insightful comment that is.

Now get yourself to bed chap, school in the morning.

[Dan]

What an insightful comment that is.

Now get yourself to bed chap, school in the morning.

Laughable, eh, doesn't even bother explaining himself.

I'm often criticised for being harsh on the PL but... I don't actually want it to fail, no chance, I'd love to have genuine faith it's the best league in the world but it's a very poorly run league IMO and the Bundesliga shits on it.

[ozleicester]

I think it is actually a very positive long term return on the chnages made years ago (to 3 points for a win) we now have a generation of players and managers that understand winning is much more valuable than just playing out a draw.

for those that remember the 70s we played defensively and hoped to get a goal, now, its more, score goals and try to hold them out.

Dare i say... well done to the FA and FIFA?

[DB11]

They are more expected to be ball players, as in midfielders, so there's no putting their body on the lines etc.

[Bayfox]

I think the standard on a whole, in the Premier League is at a low ebb, to be honest, not picking on Man Utd in particular but Nani and Anderson are no Ronaldo and Scholes/Keane.

Apart from Aguero, RVP and Kompany I'm not sure how many World Class players there are in the PL at the minute.

Part of the defending issue is as mentioned above, to many hands in the air expecting a Linesman to save them running and a lack of real technique, by that I mean a lot of CB's in this country can win a header and muscle a player, but no real ability to time a tackle.

Also I think this trend of trying to have full backs that play like Cafu and Roberto Carlos leaves teams exposed.

Chuck in the fact that the keepers that we used to think as decent, Reina, Hart, Given ( i know he isn't 1st choice) but all seem to be making errors and chucking them in.

[pSinatra]

I think you can add the fact that football is quickly becoming a non-contact sport. Not helped by players going down like a sack of spuds if the slightest of contact is made. As for the 18 yard area, all a player has to do is make his way into the area knowing that nobody will be able to touch him & if a tackle is attempted.......throw yourself to the floor!!

I'm tired of clips being scrutinised by pundits & commentators looking for the slightest of contact. "Was it a penalty? There was definitely contact!!". Maybe there was but the manner in which some players go down is nothing less than cheating. The old-fashioned centre-back (Elliott, Walsh, Taggart) has no place in modern football. I used to love a good, hard tackle where the ball was won & the man sent flying. Perfect!! That would now be a dangerous tackle & would receive at least a yellow card. I'm not suggesting studs flying everywhere - just for footballers to grow a pair.

If the attacker can be bothered to stay on his feet & not dive around, he has greater opportunity at a chance on goal than ever before. The attacking isn't getting better. The defending is being restricted.

[Dan]

I think you can add the fact that football is quickly becoming a non-contact sport. Not helped by players going down like a sack of spuds if the slightest of contact is made. As for the 18 yard area, all a player has to do is make his way into the area knowing that nobody will be able to touch him & if a tackle is attempted.......throw yourself to the floor!!

I'm tired of clips being scrutinised by pundits & commentators looking for the slightest of contact. "Was it a penalty? There was definitely contact!!". Maybe there was but the manner in which some players go down is nothing less than cheating. The old-fashioned centre-back (Elliott, Walsh, Taggart) has no place in modern football. I used to love a good, hard tackle where the ball was won & the man sent flying. Perfect!! That would now be a dangerous tackle & would receive at least a yellow card. I'm not suggesting studs flying everywhere - just for footballers to grow a pair.

If the attacker can be bothered to stay on his feet & not dive around, he has greater opportunity at a chance on goal than ever before. The attacking isn't getting better. The defending is being restricted.

Couldn't agree more. I'm quite modern in my views on how I like the game to be played but I cannot stand any of this bollocks and using the most ridiculous technicalities to favour the 'fouled'. Someone gets a clip and goes flying and rolling around simulating, yellow card for the fouler, free kick for the one who made it out to be worse than it is, who's the real evil? I think a lot of the absolute basics in football are handled dreadfully myself.

[Guest MattP]

Defending worse, not a question. It's proven in Europe by the fact there was what, three clean sheets in total from four English sides in six games each in the CL? And even they were against sides like Montpellier.

The attacking isn't what it was and the defending's not even close. The league's massively over-rated for me and if the same players played in France without the hype I genuinely believe they wouldn't get much more attention that the current Ligue 1. People will question me on this but you take away the hype, do you not find the PL to be over-rated? I honestly don't think Man City/Chelsea going out of the CL was a fluke either.

There are so many things wrong with the PL it annoys me. I hate what it's turned into, as I do believe at one stage it genuinely was the one.

Think that's pretty much spot on.

[Leicester_Loyal]

We always hear how the Prem is more competitive than ever, but Utd have got a records points total this season, winning 21/26 games (I think). This shows, to me, that it has never been so easy for the top team.

[Guest shearfox]

You're massively interesting with your three word replies. The irony is sensational.

I think I owe you an apology, I just get fed up with some of the bashing of the PL and you are one of the ones that are always negative. I believe it is the most entertaining league and certainly the best supported. It's not whether the football is the best or whether the league is competitive there is just something special about the PL that no other league has or can have.

[Jimothy]

One thing that is certainly getting worse is the amount of players expecting the linesmen to defend for them. Just watched Agger for Liverpool standing a full 2 yards behind the rest of his backline, looking straight at Milner as he's not only got Agger himself playing him on but Glenn Johnson too, throws his arm up in the air claiming offside. As the goal goes in you can see him look towards the linesman. He's looking straight at Milner as Milner collects the ball with Johnson playing him on, but appeals anyway, loses track of Dzeko and it's a goal. I saw Rio Ferdinand earlier in the season against Villa absolutely lambast the linesman for not giving offside when the player in question (Weimann) was behind Ferdinand, so Ferdinand had no idea if he was offside or not. Those are just two off the top of my head from this season, but you see defenders do it all the time. Seem to remember a Forest defender claiming for offside as Andy King knocked the ball past him on the way to scoring in the 3-0 win a couple of seasons ago. Unbelievable!

Just wrote all that and thought of another one. If you watched the Newcastle Chelsea highlights yesterday, Newcastle had a shot and it squirmed through to land at Cisse's feet, who went on to tamely sidefoot the ball into Cech's hands. Whilst he was shooting, supposedly world class John Terry stopped dead in the middle of the box about a yard behind Cisse and threw his arms up in the air screaming offside. Just carry on, try and stop him, the linemans not going to help you. Don't know if they're coached to do that, or if they are just lazy, but it does my head in.

Clint Hill the latest to stop dead in the centre of the penalty box as Michu tucks the ball away, rather than actually attempting to stop Michu. I swear is contagious.

[Guest MattP]

I think I owe you an apology, I just get fed up with some of the bashing of the PL and you are one of the ones that are always negative. I believe it is the most entertaining league and certainly the best supported. It's not whether the football is the best or whether the league is competitive there is just something special about the PL that no other league has or can have.

Best supported?

If you count a load of Thais wandering round across the other side of the World pretending to support Liverpool or Man Utd.

German is the best supported league by FAR.