Leicester_Numan Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 Pointing fingers at Sven is retarded, regardless of whether we like our owners it was them that let him spend the money. It's not like he held them at gunpoint and said "Matt Mills, five million, now." He did the old finger in the pocket trick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crisp monster Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 Why couldn't we have just got some multi billionaire bloke from Leicester to have bought us? (joke) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesmilner Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 lerner at villa wavers theirs , £71 million since oneill left , £20million plus this financial year ! hope they do the same for city , its possible to squash it . and the finger needs to be pointed at andrew neville not sven ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deucalion Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 So my pretty basic understanding of this is, the owners will have £85 million worth of shares in the club, on top of their initial outlay of £39 million and the £17 million to repurchase the stadium. This amounts to £141 million in 'shares' in the club. The club is clearly not worth this. The only way they can make the club worth this is by the club making a profit by being in the Premier League or by making the club worth more than £141 million and then selling. The most realistic way of King Power making any money is by taking a percentage of profits from a sustained period in the Premier League, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benji Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 That is the worrying part! Only on a short term. If we went bust the day after converting debt to equity then they'd fall down the pecking order as shareholders (although by paying off all this third party debt there may be few people left to satisfy). Clearly though they're going all out for promotion, using that to reduce the overall debt and then get an exit, realising the money through the value of shares sold. Personally I think it can only be good that they're here for the long term, if just from an investment perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjslcfc Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 In essence, by changing their debt into equity aren't they effectively wiping away what we owe them and turning it into shares in the club? If so, that is great news and does really give an even bigger impression that the Thais want to stay here for a while, if at least to have a few years in the premier league and get profits from there. Remember, to them we are very useful for marketing their brand as well, and our club being in the premier league would be invaluable to them with the exposure it receives worldwide and the vastly increased revenues, not only in TV rights but also in attendance etc et..., we would see if we were to make the premier league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sw_fox Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 Oh come on people, we have good owners that seem to be doing the right thing for the club. How many other championship clubs have owners that have invested as much into their club (training ground, buying the stadium outright and at the same time backing our manager financially), while at the same time respecting the club and its fans. It could be a whole lot worse, we could have all this debt and have no wealthy owners, or we could have owners like the owners of Cardiff City who want to meddle with everything including the clubs colours, name and heritage! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deucalion Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 Oh come on people, we have good owners that seem to be doing the right thing for the club. How many other championship clubs have owners that have invested as much into their club (training ground, buying the stadium outright and at the same time backing our manager financially), while at the same time respecting the club and its fans. It could be a whole lot worse, we could have all this debt and have no wealthy owners, or we could have owners like the owners of Cardiff City who want to meddle with everything including the clubs colours, name and heritage! I think we owe them a debt of gratitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaspa Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 I think we owe them a debt of gratitude. What do you suggest we do to show it? I think a go and visit Thailand chant Amazing Thailand, its fvcking great, visit with your mates . . . . Its much better than Malaysia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluetintedspecs Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 As I stated in the stadium thread, investing in a Football Club is primarily NOT a sound financial investment, the levels our owners are continuing to invest into the club is very reassuring in my eyes. They are clearly looking long term and genuinely appear to not only want to see our great club back in the Premiership, they want us to succeed there,build our fan base and ultimately the size of our stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vale Blue Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 The business side of things is absolutely fascinating which is a shame seeing we're meant to be a football club, !! Well the conversion of loans into shares is precisely why the FFP was set up. Owners were happily building up debts and then claiming the interest at higher rates than they could get anywhere else. Therefore, all the risk was taken on by the club and not the owners, Glazers the biggest example. It is reassuring to some extent that the liability is with our owners in the form of shares but we are effectively trading insolvently. The value of the shares totally outstrips the value of the club. O.k they have got the stadium/site for a song at 17million but still it is a financial mess. The short and curlies are very much in the grasp of our owners. The FFP which starts next season will be an allowed loss of 12million and during 2011/12 our wage bill I believe was over 27million, although that will have changed, without promotion something will have to change in order to comply unless the reissue of shares carries on infinitum. The apparent generosity is fantastic, hopefully, but the catastrophic lack of business sense relating to LCFC should not be overlooked I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col city fan Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 As I stated in the stadium thread, investing in a Football Club is primarily NOT a sound financial investment, the levels our owners are continuing to invest into the club is very reassuring in my eyes. They are clearly looking long term and genuinely appear to not only want to see our great club back in the Premiership, they want us to succeed there,build our fan base and ultimately the size of our stadium. This... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 The business side of things is absolutely fascinating which is a shame seeing we're meant to be a football club, !! Well the conversion of loans into shares is precisely why the FFP was set up. Owners were happily building up debts and then claiming the interest at higher rates than they could get anywhere else. Therefore, all the risk was taken on by the club and not the owners, Glazers the biggest example. It is reassuring to some extent that the liability is with our owners in the form of shares but we are effectively trading insolvently. The value of the shares totally outstrips the value of the club. O.k they have got the stadium/site for a song at 17million but still it is a financial mess. The short and curlies are very much in the grasp of our owners. The FFP which starts next season will be an allowed loss of 12million and during 2011/12 our wage bill I believe was over 27million, although that will have changed, without promotion something will have to change in order to comply unless the reissue of shares carries on infinitum. The apparent generosity is fantastic, hopefully, but the catastrophic lack of business sense relating to LCFC should not be overlooked I think. Great post couldn't of summed it up any better than this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Year Of The Fox Posted 2 March 2013 Author Share Posted 2 March 2013 Was being the operative word, but sadly not for us Sorry mate my sarcasm doesn't come across well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seenitall Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 If they hadn't panicked 13 games into last season they may well have got their £100m already - but they did and they didn't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greatness_Since_1884 Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 My mate texted me a question about this that I couldn't answer. So I thought I'd put it on hear. The question was: If King Power own 100% of the club, which I think I'm right in saying they do, then surely they own 100% of any potential shares? In ordinary circumstances, if a companies worth is £1m and a creditor is owed £200k, then that debt could be converted into 20% equity. But in this case, if they already own 100%, how can thy convert any debt into more equity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vale Blue Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 My mate texted me a question about this that I couldn't answer. So I thought I'd put it on hear. The question was: If King Power own 100% of the club, which I think I'm right in saying they do, then surely they own 100% of any potential shares? In ordinary circumstances, if a companies worth is £1m and a creditor is owed £200k, then that debt could be converted into 20% equity. But in this case, if they already own 100%, how can thy convert any debt into more equity? Hi mate, I believe they will have to reissue more shares which they can then sell to themselves.In simple terms if you have 100million shares at 1 quid each the value of the company is 100million quid in your eyes. In reality its value is what someone will pay for it or if on stock exchange, what the market says it is worth. So if for instance we needed another 100 million quid, the owners would have to reissue another 100million shares and sell those to themselves for 1quid each. Now that all seems well and good but you now have 200million shares and the value of the company hasn't changed from the first issue, so 100million has been chucked away. I think that's about right anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 I almost forgot we had a match today with all this going on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benji Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 Hi mate, I believe they will have to reissue more shares which they can then sell to themselves. In simple terms if you have 100million shares at 1 quid each the value of the company is 100million quid in your eyes. In reality its value is what someone will pay for it or if on stock exchange, what the market says it is worth. So if for instance we needed another 100 million quid, the owners would have to reissue another 100million shares and sell those to themselves for 1quid each. Now that all seems well and good but you now have 200million shares and the value of the company hasn't changed from the first issue, so 100million has been chucked away. I think that's about right anyway Yes. Providing the new shares are allotted to the current entity with all the shares. So ownership won't change, just share capital which has its main effect on the eventual exit or sale to new investors. If anyone is really interested (and providing the entities are UK), just jump on companies house and buy the latest annual returns for a few quid / any subsequent SH01 forms (new allotments). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munshi Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 Am I the only one who doesnt understand even one part of whats going on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox in the North Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 Nope me too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5waller5 Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 You can butter this is all you like, but it still worries me. Because you don'\t understand it. It's not buttering it up - it's telling you the facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5waller5 Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 The loans converted to shares as well as the stadium on our books as an asset - will the FFP worriers now give up banging that drum??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 Am I the only one who doesnt understand even one part of whats going on? Na you are not the only 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonthefox Posted 2 March 2013 Share Posted 2 March 2013 Because you don'\t understand it. It's not buttering it up - it's telling you the facts. So were 85.4 million in debt and thats ok is it?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.