Our Crap Midfield

[Thracian]

Our "crap" midfield helped take us top of the league. We passed the ball quickly and with fluency. We scored and made goals from various areas and tested the opposition with our pace. Since then we've lost our way. It's like we're on a massive roundabout in the fog and with no idea which direction to take.

Well, the simple answer is to go forwards. Not just the driver but all the "passengers" as well. Play as a unit, press the play, dominate the ball and carry as much goal threat as we can cos, right now, we're limp-wristed in terms of goals threat.

For me the most common denominator in our change of fortune is Knockaert. Pearson wants to accommodate him because he's a seemingly exciting talent. But he's also a maverick and a player who has so much personal involvement that he seriously disrupts our flow because he's totally unreadable and everything he does might as easily cost us as to be of benefit.

And, unfortunately, he doesn't pose the goal threat to make an exception. King, we know, can threaten goals and he's easily our most reliable passer - a guality that was so important when we were playing successfully. But we need far more goals threat than that and the second person I'd play in midfield is Schlupp.

Just like King, Schlupp has the ability to control and pass the ball constructively while also being able to score and having some of the pace we've always lacked in the centre. Every time I've seen him play in central midfield he's shown vision and presence.

I'd have Dyer and Konchesky on the left because they shown they can work together and provide a fastish threat from that side. I'd restore the pace and persistence of Nugent and Vardy up front because they have to be marked, they work well together and it would end the hoof-ball option.

Then I'd have Marshall and De Laet on the right.

That would leave the question of who to play centre-back and, with Morgan out, it would seem that Keane, Moore and Whitbread are our only options, assuming St Leger can't return, and if that's not an advert for opting to attack I don't know what is.

The result of this approach would be a much faster, potentially more potent all-round team, one that could stretch the play and a team not disimilar to the one which took us top of the league in the Autumn and which played such attractive, expansive football in doing so.

Yes, it remains flawed in some ways but the games are running out and our only hope of staying in the top six is to attack and to try and win those games. We've no chance of consistently keeping clean sheets.

[SMX11]

Is it me or do our players look so weak in the challenge?

[FoxLAD]

Is it me or do our players look so weak in the challenge?

I agree, They're great midfielders but a little light weight a couple of Stong Midfielders could help get the best out of Drinkwater/King Ect..

[Finn Claw II]

I'd play 4-5-1; I think king, james and DInky are all reasonable footballers but a bit lightweight. Given we can't change that until the end of the season I'd rather play all 3 and drop one of nugent or wood.

James will come good next season

We have good enough footballers all over the park but for whatever reason our mentality is not right, too young, over played, I don't really know

[Monsell1976]

I have to agree, a weak in affective midfield, which lacks creativity is costing us, alot moan about wood and nugents lack of goals recently but look at the shit service there getting, and near enough all good teams get goals from midfield, which compensates for the lean patches all strikers go through, drinkwater, James and king don't offer enough goals to make us a good side. They are weak and get bullied by the physical teams, which is why I think we do poorly against weaker teams, who are big battlers with limited skill, but dominate our more technical footballers, definitely an area that needs a massive overhaul if we are to be successful.

[kingfox]

James is probably the worst midfielder i've seen down here

[marbelladave]

Our "crap" midfield helped take us top of the league. We passed the ball quickly and with fluency. We scored and made goals from various areas and tested the opposition with our pace. Since then we've lost our way. It's like we're on a massive roundabout in the fog and with no idea which direction to take.

Well, the simple answer is to go forwards. Not just the driver but all the "passengers" as well. Play as a unit, press the play, dominate the ball and carry as much goal threat as we can cos, right now, we're limp-wristed in terms of goals threat.

For me the most common denominator in our change of fortune is Knockaert. Pearson wants to accommodate him because he's a seemingly exciting talent. But he's also a maverick and a player who has so much personal involvement that he seriously disrupts our flow because he's totally unreadable and everything he does might as easily cost us as to be of benefit.

And, unfortunately, he doesn't pose the goal threat to make an exception. King, we know, can threaten goals and he's easily our most reliable passer - a guality that was so important when we were playing successfully. But we need far more goals threat than that and the second person I'd play in midfield is Schlupp.

Just like King, Schlupp has the ability to control and pass the ball constructively while also being able to score and having some of the pace we've always lacked in the centre. Every time I've seen him play in central midfield he's shown vision and presence.

I'd have Dyer and Konchesky on the left because they shown they can work together and provide a fastish threat from that side. I'd restore the pace and persistence of Nugent and Vardy up front because they have to be marked, they work well together and it would end the hoof-ball option.

Then I'd have Marshall and De Laet on the right.

That would leave the question of who to play centre-back and, with Morgan out, it would seem that Keane, Moore and Whitbread are our only options, assuming St Leger can't return, and if that's not an advert for opting to attack I don't know what is.

The result of this approach would be a much faster, potentially more potent all-round team, one that could stretch the play and a team not disimilar to the one which took us top of the league in the Autumn and which played such attractive, expansive football in doing so.

Yes, it remains flawed in some ways but the games are running out and our only hope of staying in the top six is to attack and to try and win those games. We've no chance of consistently keeping clean sheets.

I feel you are a bit 'one eyed' on this. Knockaert was an important part of the ""crap" midfield" that took us top of the table.

Fluent attacking play that moved the ball quickly and positively was doing the job rather nicely and Knockaert as the 'joker/wild card' was doing just fine.

It all went wrong when NFP changed our fluent attacking style in an attempt to be more 'solid' and defend our position as definite promotion candidates. I can even tell you exactly when that happened, 27th October, 3.00pm.

We set up negatively, our fullbacks were held back and Knockaert and Dyer given onerous defensive duties in front of them, Designed to negate Palace's wingers it did nothing of the sort, it just invited them on to us, and with none of our players breaking from the back or midfield we had no option but to hoof the ball forward, to pretty much zero effect.

That was it, the season changer right there, remember we were the home side and we bottled it totally. Sure it took a few more games for our new style to become totally obvious but after more dreadful, negative tactics against Watford, Leeds and Millwall the writing was really on the wall.

[flowwolf]

James played well last night. Was all over the pitch and won quite a lot of challenges. Drinkwater on the other hand... Perhaps it is the way we play under NP that there is one player we give the ball to again. Other teams shut him down or he goes off form and it shuts our midfield down too. This is such a shame because we looked a different team when playing with 2 genuine wingers and not just going through 1 player only a couple of months ago. Knockeart needs to pull his socks up too. He was utterly awful last night.

Funny how players like knockeart and Wood come here and play like prem players from the off but after a few weeks with Pearson turn to shit overnight. You don't have to be inspector Frost to work it out.

[dedlock]

Our crap midfield played quick, passing football on the 7 game unbeaten run pre Palace & Watford .

We set up negatively for those games,got our just deserts but then had 1 defeat in 7 and went on another 7 game unbeaten run.

O.K.,our form was less convincing in those later runs but we got the results.

The conundrum is why we have not been able to bounce back post Peterboro' .

The personnel ,particularly in midfield, is the same.

Inexperience,in my view, probably explains the loss of form.

An older head or two,or a vocal leader may help.

[marbelladave]

Our crap midfield played quick, passing football on the 7 game unbeaten run pre Palace & Watford .

We set up negatively for those games,got our just deserts but then had 1 defeat in 7 and went on another 7 game unbeaten run.

O.K.,our form was less convincing in those later runs but we got the results.

The conundrum is why we have not been able to bounce back post Peterboro' .

The personnel ,particularly in midfield, is the same.

Inexperience,in my view, probably explains the loss of form.

An older head or two,or a vocal leader may help.

From the Palace game to the new year we won just 4 of 13 games, for a team that had just won 7 on the bounce that is quite a turnaround.

Lack of experience/leadership could well be an issue, but our our negativity, particularly against the better sides, was so predictable and all consuming that I think it was a long way past mere inexperience.

[brockmyster]

Looking at our 4 CMs id have to say:

Wellens, love the guy but hes past his best has to go

Drinkwater, Really dont rate him wouldnt care if he went infact hope he does

James, good young player hes only going to get better

King, He's shown his quality time and time again but i think hes being played in the wrong role

Id look for next season to have a hard hitting one added who is basically a **** all game, and wouldnt mind someone like barkley on loan to add a bit of creativity

[Col city fan]

I think our midfield is our Achilles heel.

Then again, I've thought this all season.

We have little creative flair nor real steel in the centre.

Pearson's biggest failing IMO is sorting this problem out, especially away from home.

I'm fed up of saying this. To me it's been obvious all season.

[marbelladave]

I think our midfield is our Achilles heel.

Then again, I've thought this all season.

We have little creative flair nor real steel in the centre.

Pearson's biggest failing IMO is sorting this problem out, especially away from home.

I'm fed up of saying this. To me it's been obvious all season.

No, what has been obvious all season is that, given their head, our midfield took us to the top of the table with the 'useless' strikeforce of Nugent and Vardy.

Sorry Col, I know your views and I guess you are pretty fed up with mine. Neither of us have anything new to offer to the debate other than pointing out to some of the obvious idiocy from some of the hard of thinking that post on here.

We will never know who's (if either) view is right but sadly it is getting to the point where I no longer care. We are not going to make the playoffs as the life and energy of the side has been drained away and sadly, the same is now happening to me.....

[muzzy1981]

I think our midfield is our Achilles heel.

Then again, I've thought this all season.

We have little creative flair nor real steel in the centre.

Pearson's biggest failing IMO is sorting this problem out, especially away from home.

I'm fed up of saying this. To me it's been obvious all season.

Spot on, too many similar cm's in the squad. Wellens, James, Drinks and king are not true defensive or attacking players.

However, James could be a defensive mid for us...not sure though. We are massively lacking in an izzet/koren type player could this be knocky? If he passed more?

[Ely fox]

Am I the only fan that doesn't rate Drinkwater? He seems to be scared of heading the ball and making a tackle plus he gives the ball away a lot of late. He was better at the start of the season but since the Bristol city game he has been rubbish!

[theessexfox]

Am I the only fan that doesn't rate Drinkwater? He seems to be scared of heading the ball and making a tackle plus he gives the ball away a lot of late. He was better at the start of the season but since the Bristol city game he has been rubbish!

I think when we play well he looks good, otherwise he sticks out as being bang average.

[Thracian]

I feel you are a bit 'one eyed' on this. Knockaert was an important part of the ""crap" midfield" that took us top of the table.

Fluent attacking play that moved the ball quickly and positively was doing the job rather nicely and Knockaert as the 'joker/wild card' was doing just fine.

It all went wrong when NFP changed our fluent attacking style in an attempt to be more 'solid' and defend our position as definite promotion candidates. I can even tell you exactly when that happened, 27th October, 3.00pm.

We set up negatively, our fullbacks were held back and Knockaert and Dyer given onerous defensive duties in front of them, Designed to negate Palace's wingers it did nothing of the sort, it just invited them on to us, and with none of our players breaking from the back or midfield we had no option but to hoof the ball forward, to pretty much zero effect.

That was it, the season changer right there, remember we were the home side and we bottled it totally. Sure it took a few more games for our new style to become totally obvious but after more dreadful, negative tactics against Watford, Leeds and Millwall the writing was really on the wall.

Although Knockaert was a sub in his first few matches I'd agree he had an effect although that effect wore off somewhat when people sussed him out, meaning his presence started becoming more risky than productive. But it's a big point you make about the defensive duties and, indeed, that may be key to our whole demise.

Mention has been made of us never improving anyone and this could well be why. Instead of concentrating on what players are good at and sharpening/expanding those skills to make them even more effective, Pearson wants to turn everyone into a defender once we've lost the ball and that often leaves players out of their natural habitat and lacking the sharpness to do their main job properly.

Even worse it's cost us vital goals at times with the likes of Vardy and Knockaert, among others i'm sure, actually making crucial mistakes in defensive areas that cost us.

No-one's suggesting attacking players become idle when we lose the ball but the idea of having everyone attacking and defending as one unit only works when everyone joins in and compresses the play.

But our central defenders, our full-backs on occasions and even a couple of our central midfield players hardly join in at all as attackers.

So really, there should be no need for the likes of Nugent, Knockaert, Vardy, Dyer et al going racing all over the place burning up their energy defending and I ask the question whether this is the real reason no-one improves here - we want players to be Jacks of all trades instead of masters of their own.

Yes, I've seen the all-for-one-one-for-all approach work with everyone moving forwards and backwards in unison. Leeds under Revie were outstanding, Liverpool's greatest teams could do it and Manchester United have also shown the necessary flexibility. But there's no chance with Leicester, none whatsoever.

[Corky]

Am I the only fan that doesn't rate Drinkwater? He seems to be scared of heading the ball and making a tackle plus he gives the ball away a lot of late. He was better at the start of the season but since the Bristol city game he has been rubbish!

When he pings the ball around quickly he's fine and the team flows.

However, he tends to hold on to the ball too long and often goes backwards. But we play through him virtually all the time so it's going to impact either way.

[i luv u foxes]

I agree, They're great midfielders but a little light weight a couple of Stong Midfielders could help get the best out of Drinkwater/King Ect..

[i luv u foxes]

Great midfielders? You are surely not being seriously they are average midfielders with knockaert being above average at the moment and king being above average when on form not great

[shade]

Our "crap" midfield helped take us top of the league. We passed the ball quickly and with fluency. We scored and made goals from various areas and tested the opposition with our pace. Since then we've lost our way. It's like we're on a massive roundabout in the fog and with no idea which direction to take.

Well, the simple answer is to go forwards. Not just the driver but all the "passengers" as well. Play as a unit, press the play, dominate the ball and carry as much goal threat as we can cos, right now, we're limp-wristed in terms of goals threat.

For me the most common denominator in our change of fortune is Knockaert. Pearson wants to accommodate him because he's a seemingly exciting talent. But he's also a maverick and a player who has so much personal involvement that he seriously disrupts our flow because he's totally unreadable and everything he does might as easily cost us as to be of benefit.

And, unfortunately, he doesn't pose the goal threat to make an exception. King, we know, can threaten goals and he's easily our most reliable passer - a guality that was so important when we were playing successfully. But we need far more goals threat than that and the second person I'd play in midfield is Schlupp.

Just like King, Schlupp has the ability to control and pass the ball constructively while also being able to score and having some of the pace we've always lacked in the centre. Every time I've seen him play in central midfield he's shown vision and presence.

I'd have Dyer and Konchesky on the left because they shown they can work together and provide a fastish threat from that side. I'd restore the pace and persistence of Nugent and Vardy up front because they have to be marked, they work well together and it would end the hoof-ball option.

Then I'd have Marshall and De Laet on the right.

That would leave the question of who to play centre-back and, with Morgan out, it would seem that Keane, Moore and Whitbread are our only options, assuming St Leger can't return, and if that's not an advert for opting to attack I don't know what is.

The result of this approach would be a much faster, potentially more potent all-round team, one that could stretch the play and a team not disimilar to the one which took us top of the league in the Autumn and which played such attractive, expansive football in doing so.

Yes, it remains flawed in some ways but the games are running out and our only hope of staying in the top six is to attack and to try and win those games. We've no chance of consistently keeping clean sheets.

I agree with most of this but fundamentally it doesn't seem to be the personnel that's stopped us playing the intricate and quick passing game we were, the attitudes seem to have changed. swaggers been replaced by head down frustrated foot stamping.

[marbelladave]

Although Knockaert was a sub in his first few matches I'd agree he had an effect although that effect wore off somewhat when people sussed him out, meaning his presence started becoming more risky than productive. But it's a big point you make about the defensive duties and, indeed, that may be key to our whole demise.

Mention has been made of us never improving anyone and this could well be why. Instead of concentrating on what players are good at and sharpening/expanding those skills to make them even more effective, Pearson wants to turn everyone into a defender once we've lost the ball and that often leaves players out of their natural habitat and lacking the sharpness to do their main job properly.

Even worse it's cost us vital goals at times with the likes of Vardy and Knockaert, among others i'm sure, actually making crucial mistakes in defensive areas that cost us.

No-one's suggesting attacking players become idle when we lose the ball but the idea of having everyone attacking and defending as one unit only works when everyone joins in and compresses the play.

But our central defenders, our full-backs on occasions and even a couple of our central midfield players hardly join in at all as attackers.

So really, there should be no need for the likes of Nugent, Knockaert, Vardy, Dyer et al going racing all over the place burning up their energy defending and I ask the question whether this is the real reason no-one improves here - we want players to be Jacks of all trades instead of masters of their own.

Yes, I've seen the all-for-one-one-for-all approach work with everyone moving forwards and backwards in unison. Leeds under Revie were outstanding, Liverpool's greatest teams could do it and Manchester United have also shown the necessary flexibility. But there's no chance with Leicester, none whatsoever.

I have spoken about most of these points before, the onerous defensive duties piled on to our attacking players, the negative setup employed from november onwards, the game on game destruction of our creative players abilities and energies, all these things have been painfully obvious over the last few months.

For me the pivotal moment of the season game in late october when, with us top of the league we somehow made the decision to stop playing our assertive, passing football and switch to a cautious, rigid system that was supposed to tighten things up defensively.

I'll say that again, 'tighten things up defensively', we were top of the league, why FFS......

[Corky]

I have spoken about most of these points before, the onerous defensive duties piled on to our attacking players, the negative setup employed from november onwards, the game on game destruction of our creative players abilities and energies, all these things have been painfully obvious over the last few months.

For me the pivotal moment of the season game in late october when, with us top of the league we somehow made the decision to stop playing our assertive, passing football and switch to a cautious, rigid system that was supposed to tighten things up defensively.

I'll say that again, 'tighten things up defensively', we were top of the league, why FFS......

I know, we were hardly leaking goals when at the top, it's frustrating because we were sweeping teams aside up until Bristol City but have gone too negative and it's hard to fathom why.

And it wasn't just the big wins like Ipswich and Huddersfield, the wins against Hull, Huddersfield away, Bristol City home, Sheffield Wednesday were all comfortable and could've been greater, very few issues defensively balanced with good attacking play.

[frozenfox]

I just think our midfield is and has been for a good while weak and ineffective. James is probably the worst midfielder i've seen down here yet the vast number of Pearson bummers herald his return like he's our gifted one. We simply do not have a midfielder who is prepared to stick a boot in, we need a Savage/Lennon type of character and as long as we keep on gratefully accepting these man United rejects we'll never be a premiership team.

Our problems start and finish with the likes of Drinkwater and James going absent for 80 minutes of the game. What i don't understand is why we can't blood some of our youngsters, they can't possibly be as bad as what we have now?

Spot on

[ThurnbyLodgeFox]

James and Danns midfield for me. Danns (hard tackling strong midfielder with a bit of spark) and James (composed for a young lad and a quality player, our best midfielder)

but Pearson's pride or whatever comes first so it won't be changed