Watford are a joke

[Babylon]

Udinese & Granada buy them?

 

No they don't, because all of one player were on Udinese's books, and have played for Udinese, apart from Acuna.

 

So Fourth Official is talking shit on that score.

So those teams never purchased a single one of those players for actual money from another team?

[leicsmac]

You may not like that the professional game has moved on from clubs employing players from a 10 mile radius but football has changed and will change further. My point is to highlight the proven quality of the Pozzo's support to their teams over a very long time without resorting to ruinous and reckless financial dealings. They have a sustainable model based on effective scouting and improving young players. Maybe there are some aspects to their dealings which are worth considering? 

 

I have no problem with the sustainability. My worry is the independence of differing football clubs when owned by the same entity. This establishes a rather unsettling precedent. 

[kingfox]

So those teams never purchased a single one of those players for actual money from another team?

 

Nope only Javier Acuna and by the looks of it Cassetti.

 

The rest have been with Udinese since 2010/2011, and have actually played games for Udinese, so they were actual Udinese players, instead of just signing them, then flogging them off to Watford.

[superhorns]

I have no problem with the sustainability. My worry is the independence of differing football clubs when owned by the same entity. This establishes a rather unsettling precedent. 

Well so far the Watford fans are very very happy with the setup. Fantastic football and much reducing debt. I accept supporters from other teams want us to fail but I'm fairly confident they will be disappointed. I'm sure we'll be having a similar discussion in future years.

[Babylon]

Nope only Javier Acuna and by the looks of it Cassetti.

 

The rest have been with Udinese since 2010/2011, and have actually played games for Udinese, so they were actual Udinese players, instead of just signing them, then flogging them off to Watford.

You don't understand, can you not see what's wrong with someone buying a player (doesn't matter when) for say £1m for arguments sake, and then selling said player to a sister club for either free or less than the market value? In fact it doesn't matter whether they bought them or not. If they are trading player under market value to benefit another team they are connected to it's not really right.

 

Ownership of several clubs is not allowed for these very reasons. Just because it's technically not the same person the link is there and everyone knows it.

 

If they can get away with it then fair play to them, but the link up is clearly underhanded and a blatant bending of the rules as the loan issue was. That was stopped and you can guarantee the leagues will look very had at what is happening again this time.

 

And for any Watford fan coming on here spouting crap about us spending money. That wasn't a quite blatant attempt at bending rules, there were no rules on spending money. Had we or if we pumped money into the club in a way that wasn't within the spirit of FFP, or used underhand bending of rules to inflate our balance sheet, then that would be the same thing.

[leicsmac]

Well so far the Watford fans are very very happy with the setup. Fantastic football and much reducing debt. I accept supporters from other teams want us to fail but I'm fairly confident they will be disappointed. I'm sure we'll be having a similar discussion in future years.

 

I hope not. I wouldn't want to see Watford fail because legally they've done nothing wrong, but if other clubs follow this precedent football is going to be changed irrevocably for the worse. Mind you, that might happen anyway given the parlous financial state of many clubs.

[LCFC FOX]

They will be shite anyway, I can't wait to watch them fail the big headed cvnts

[kingfox]

You don't understand, can you not see what's wrong with someone buying a player (doesn't matter when) for say £1m for arguments sake, and then selling said player to a sister club for either free or less than the market value? In fact it doesn't matter whether they bought them or not. If they are trading player under market value to benefit another team they are connected to it's not really right.

 

Ownership of several clubs is not allowed for these very reasons. Just because it's technically not the same person the link is there and everyone knows it.

 

If they can get away with it then fair play to them, but the link up is clearly underhanded and a blatant bending of the rules as the loan issue was. That was stopped and you can guarantee the leagues will look very had at what is happening again this time.

 

And for any Watford fan coming on here spouting crap about us spending money. That wasn't a quite blatant attempt at bending rules, there were no rules on spending money. Had we or if we pumped money into the club in a way that wasn't within the spirit of FFP, or used underhand bending of rules to inflate our balance sheet, then that would be the same thing.

 

Fourth Official, basically was saying, Udinese or Granada buy players from other clubs, then flog them off to Watford for free, but this isn't the case. They have only done it with one player out of about nine, and that's Acuna. Just one player, Fourth Official makes it sound like Udinese have brought every player, from another side then just flogged them off to Watford. That is not true though, Forestieri played for Udinese since 2009, and has had numerous loan spells. Pudil was brought from Genk, but was also loaned out prior to a move to Watford, Anya part of Granada since 2011, Abdi has played 42 times for Udinese, Angella 20 times, Battocchio came through Udinese's youth academy, Ekstrand played 12 times, Faraoni 10 times, Romero been with Udinese since 2009 as well, finally Fabbrini since 2011 & played 21 times. 

 

So on that evidence apart from Acuna, Udinese hasn't brought any player just to sell onto Watford. 

 

Why isn't Ownership of several clubs not allowed? The Pozzo family own Udinese, Granada & Watford outright, so really it is the same person surely?

 

The loan rule wasn't issued last year hence why they got in so many players on loan from abroad, but that isn't Watford's fault it may have been annoying but they didn't break no rules in doing so, in my opinion I blame The FA, Football League or whoever is to blame, for not putting in rules and regulations sooner, and just because Watford took advantage, and people complained, they have now put rules in place. So Watford are just buying these players permanently now, but to say Udinese & Granada are buying a whole host of players then selling them onto Watford, is not the case, when all of one player Watford has brought this summer, has been with Udinese or Granada for a couple of years, have played actual games for those clubs, or have been loaned out to different clubs prior to Watford.

 

The only thing annoying in this current case, is they are getting these players on a free, when realistically some of these could be worth £1 or £2 million. 

[Mack]

They will be shite anyway, I can't wait to watch them fail the big headed cvnts

 

Amen.

Cocky pricks so up their own arses their head has made it's way through their digestive system and appeared back on their shoulders.

Lets see what happens this season, should be interesting.

[superhorns]

Amen.

Cocky pricks so up their own arses their head has made it's way through their digestive system and appeared back on their shoulders.

Lets see what happens this season, should be interesting.

We are just showing appreciation to our owners, manager and players, just about the complete opposite to you lot waiting to pounce on your manager and slag off your owners for addressing your awful debts, get real.

[Babylon]

Fourth Official, basically was saying, Udinese or Granada buy players from other clubs, then flog them off to Watford for free, but this isn't the case. They have only done it with one player out of about nine, and that's Acuna. Just one player, Fourth Official makes it sound like Udinese have brought every player, from another side then just flogged them off to Watford. That is not true though, Forestieri played for Udinese since 2009, and has had numerous loan spells. Pudil was brought from Genk, but was also loaned out prior to a move to Watford, Anya part of Granada since 2011, Abdi has played 42 times for Udinese, Angella 20 times, Battocchio came through Udinese's youth academy, Ekstrand played 12 times, Faraoni 10 times, Romero been with Udinese since 2009 as well, finally Fabbrini since 2011 & played 21 times. 

 

So on that evidence apart from Acuna, Udinese hasn't brought any player just to sell onto Watford.

But they are giving / selling players to Watford that Watford could not afford under FFP rules. You admitted they have done it with one player, what's stopping them doing it with another. It doesn't matter if the players played for Udinese or weren't signed for that exact reason originally. They are giving them players below market value to put it bluntly cheat the rules of FFP.

 

 

Why isn't Ownership of several clubs not allowed? The Pozzo family own Udinese, Granada & Watford outright, so really it is the same person surely?

Clearly they have left enough daylight between the actual owners that it doesn't count under current rules. But the fact they are doing what they are doing shows the link quite clearly for what it is.

 

 

So Watford are just buying these players permanently now, but to say Udinese & Granada are buying a whole host of players then selling them onto Watford, is not the case, when all of one player Watford has brought this summer, has been with Udinese or Granada for a couple of years, have played actual games for those clubs, or have been loaned out to different clubs prior to Watford.

 

The only thing annoying in this current case, is they are getting these players on a free, when realistically some of these could be worth £1 or £2 million. 

Ergo... it's a backhanded way of dealing.

[kingfox]

But they are giving / selling players to Watford that Watford could not afford under FFP rules. You admitted they have done it with one player, what's stopping them doing it with another. It doesn't matter if the players played for Udinese or weren't signed for that exact reason originally. They are giving them players below market value to put it bluntly cheat the rules of FFP.

 

 

Clearly they have left enough daylight between the actual owners that it doesn't count under current rules. But the fact they are doing what they are doing shows the link quite clearly for what it is.

 

 

Ergo... it's a backhanded way of dealing.

 

I was basing my comment on what fourth official said. Which was clearly not really right, one player I don't see anything wrong with that, if they continue in that way, then yes it would be wrong and I will more than likely change my opinion on the current matter, but Fourth Official was making out like Udinese & Granada have brought all these players just to sell onto Watford.

 

The Pozzo family owns those three clubs, Watford needed a buyer, so the Pozzo family came in, they could of well chose a different team and right now they could be doing the same thing with them. Before they owned Watford, they could of loaned players from Udinese to Granada all the time if they wanted to. 

 

It may be a backhand way, but they aren't breaking any rules, that's the point. People will complain that Watford are cheating and all that jazz, but they aren't, because rules don't say that. It's clever what they are doing, because they know they aren't breaking any rules, like I said I don't see them solely as the thing to blame here, I blame the FA or whoever, for not putting good enough rules in place, if they actually thought this through better and placed more rules, people wouldn't be sitting here now moaning. 

[Babylon]

It may be a backhand way, but they aren't breaking any rules, that's the point. People will complain that Watford are cheating and all that jazz, but they aren't, because rules don't say that. It's clever what they are doing, because they know they aren't breaking any rules, like I said I don't see them solely as the thing to blame here, I blame the FA or whoever, for not putting good enough rules in place, if they actually thought this through better and placed more rules, people wouldn't be sitting here now moaning. 

I've not said they are breaking any rules.

 

But it is definitely underhand and the rules will be looked at again to see if they can be changed.

[Super_horns]

Wouldn't that be down to FIFA...which might be asking a lot!

[KFS]

I won't say anything, someone being happy about Lloyd Doyley playing for their football club is hilarious enough.

(Couple pages back)

[hernandez]

I think the part of this that is so wrong isn't the fact that Watford are buying a whole load of players from udinese etc, but the fact that the transfer fees will be extremely low if anything at all therefore this will not effect Watford in terms of keeping within ffp. For example, If Watford are to buy 9 players with a market value of say 1 million pounds each but instead are bought for 1 pound each. After buying these players any other club would have spent excess of 9 million pounds on transfer fees, wages and agent fees so this team would clearly be well over the ffp cap for losing money. Instead Watford get around the ffp rules by only spending 9 pounds therefore having smaller losses and fitting into ffp. They get players of a 9 million pound value for 9 pounds. This here I believe is wrong, an unfair advantage which means there is not a level playing field and making a mockery if the ffp and the football leauge.

To stop this from happening each transfer should be audited to ensure that a fair price is agreed for the transfers between "sister clubs" (in Watfords case the fee itself dosnt matter to the owners however the amount that is reported for losses each year for ffp etc does) a simple fix that whoever changed the limits on loans should have looked at as this is clearly what Watford and other

Clubs in te future will do.

[kingfox]

I've not said they are breaking any rules.

 

But it is definitely underhand and the rules will be looked at again to see if they can be changed.

 

But like I said, they should have brought in these rules sooner, and actually even thought FFP through better. 

 

So right now no rule breaks, means they can do whatever they want. 

 

I won't say anything, someone being happy about Lloyd Doyley playing for their football club is hilarious enough.

(Couple pages back)

 

What a legend he is, might not be the most gifted, well he isn't, but he has been a great servant to that club.

[LeicesterFoxFC]

I'm going to sum this thread up:

 

• Watford are within the rules but the whole system is laughable and in my eyes it is complete and utter cheating as it gives an unfair advantage.
• Watford will not win the league this year, if they do I will streak at our final game of the season. Can't even see them going up.
• They don't seem to care about being a big boy clubs plaything. As I've said before, it's like us buying Tranmere and using the club as a toy.

Farcical club, it's hilarious how little their fans seem to care.

[Babylon]

Wouldn't that be down to FIFA...which might be asking a lot!

Leagues can implement their own rules. For instance the Premier league has slightly different rules on club ownership compared to the FIFA rules.

 

Currently you are outlawed from competing in the same competition. So I doubt you and Udinese could play in the same European competition under UEFA rules (yeah I'm aware you won't care about that ha).

 

Chances are they will do nothing about it as somewhere along the sodding line it will end up in the european court of human rights for blocking freedom of movement for players!!

[Super_horns]

But like I said, they should have brought in these rules sooner, and actually even thought FFP through better. 

 

So right now no rule breaks, means they can do whatever they want. 

 

 

What a legend he is, might not be the most gifted, well he isn't, but he has been a great servant to that club.

Come one.he is one of the Englishmen we do have!

 

[Moosedog]

Udinese have never bought a player for Watford, Cassetti was a free agent after being released from Roma and Acuna was out of contract when he signed for Udinese, he may have been signed with the intention of being given to Watford but he was not bought for them

[LeicesterFoxFC]

Udinese have never bought a player for Watford, Cassetti was a free agent after being released from Roma and Acuna was out of contract when he signed for Udinese, he may have been signed with the intention of being given to Watford but he was not bought for them

 

That makes little to no sense. Same difference.

[harrowhorn]

That makes little to no sense. Same difference.

Yes it does. It means Watford could also have signed them on frees, so we are not getting £1m players for nothing.

[harrowhorn]

I'm going to sum this thread up:

 

• Watford are within the rules but the whole system is laughable and in my eyes it is complete and utter cheating as it gives an unfair advantage.
• Watford will not win the league this year, if they do I will streak at our final game of the season. Can't even see them going up.
• They don't seem to care about being a rich man's plaything. As I've said before, it's like us buying Tranmere and using the club as a toy.

Farcical club, it's hilarious how little their fans seem to care.

The irony is so painful, it seems a shame to point it out.

[Dan]

Truly pathetic that the FL have allowed this to happen. Fvcking disgraceful.