FIFA, World Cup - Qatar '2022'

[Manwell Pablo]

I thought the whole thing was rigged.

 

I'm slowly thinking that Russia may not be a dreadful pick, though.

 

Small matter of widespread racism and football violence as well. 

[bovril]

Small matter of widespread racism and football violence as well. 

 

There's plenty of football violence in Brazil, and certainly racism in Italian and Spanish football. People wouldn't be so worried about those two countries.

 

I think Russia is still kind of seen as the 'enemy', it's a bit unknown and quite vast. The cities they've chosen are nice and Russia has the financial clout and know-how to put on a great tournament. The biggest problem will be the cost of going.

But yeah, this Qatar thing is a giant balls up.

[bovril]

I also think the multiple host thing could be good, if they get it right.

[Lionator]

Russia would've been good if the next one was held in Australia. Contrasting conditions/area's of the world.

[oxford blue]

Manwell Pablo  quote above: "They're damned if they do damned if they don't, unless they come up with some way of protecting fans and players from fifty degree heat." 

 

At the time of the bidding process, the Qataris had this sorted:

 

"While addressing the European Club Association (ECA) that held its 10th General Assembly in Doha recently, Secretary General of the 2022 Supreme Committee, Hassan Al Thawadi, used the chance to further drum home that heat will not be a problem when the world gather in Qatar for the World Cup. Although respected stadium designer like John Barrow of Populus, has insisted that air cooling techniques were unsuitable for larger areas, Qatar officials insist that their plan was on track.

 

"Populus weren't working on our cooling technology. We've got a prototype coming very soon. It's our commitment, absolutely. New and revolutionary technologies will keep both players and spectators cool in open-air stadiums, delivering on one of our legacy promises of delivering an environmentally friendly and sustainable FIFA World Cup.

 

"From the beginning, we pledged to share the know-how behind these second-generation cooling systems with countries with similar summer climates to our own. We want to be able to expand mega-event hosting and leave a legacy of opportunity for nations and parts of the world that have not previously had the opportunity to host such events, due to climate concerns," he noted.

 

He further admitted that several of the planned stadiums will have modular components that will be disassembled following the tournament and donated to developing nations in need of sporting infrastructure. The cooling is not going to be limited to the playing pitches alone. The Qatar 2022 committee is planning an all encompassing cooling projects that will also ensure that the entire stadium neighbourhood is enjoyed by fans."

 

 

 

Empty promises?

[Dan]

They probably used all their budget buying the World Cup from FIFA anyway

[Kitchandro]

Manwell Pablo  quote above: "They're damned if they do damned if they don't, unless they come up with some way of protecting fans and players from fifty degree heat." 

 

At the time of the bidding process, the Qataris had this sorted:

 

"While addressing the European Club Association (ECA) that held its 10th General Assembly in Doha recently, Secretary General of the 2022 Supreme Committee, Hassan Al Thawadi, used the chance to further drum home that heat will not be a problem when the world gather in Qatar for the World Cup. Although respected stadium designer like John Barrow of Populus, has insisted that air cooling techniques were unsuitable for larger areas, Qatar officials insist that their plan was on track.

 

"Populus weren't working on our cooling technology. We've got a prototype coming very soon. It's our commitment, absolutely. New and revolutionary technologies will keep both players and spectators cool in open-air stadiums, delivering on one of our legacy promises of delivering an environmentally friendly and sustainable FIFA World Cup.

 

"From the beginning, we pledged to share the know-how behind these second-generation cooling systems with countries with similar summer climates to our own. We want to be able to expand mega-event hosting and leave a legacy of opportunity for nations and parts of the world that have not previously had the opportunity to host such events, due to climate concerns," he noted.

 

He further admitted that several of the planned stadiums will have modular components that will be disassembled following the tournament and donated to developing nations in need of sporting infrastructure. The cooling is not going to be limited to the playing pitches alone. The Qatar 2022 committee is planning an all encompassing cooling projects that will also ensure that the entire stadium neighbourhood is enjoyed by fans."

 

 

 

Empty promises?

 

No one is a saint here. Whether they promised that or not it's up to FIFA to determine whether it was realistic and it's also up to them to take the World Cup off them if it was deemed that the content of their bid was just a web of lies.

 

There is no way that Qatar can defend some of the things that make their country unsuitable for the world cup. I don't think FIFA are under any illusions about the Qatar bid, and they will have known that it was by far the worst bid on the table.

 

However, crucially, the brown envelope on top of said bid was by far the heaviest.

[One Legged Beaver]

Would the 2021 Confederations Cup have to be held in the Winter as well? If so that could mean a few top teams losing players then if they allow them to go, or possibly even a Winter break in 2021 also...

[Captain...]

Would the 2021 Confederations Cup have to be held in the Winter as well? If so that could mean a few top teams losing players then if they allow them to go, or possibly even a Winter break in 2021 also...

 

Good point that, it is almost like they haven't thought any of this through.

 

Has it been mentioned that they will automatically qualify as a top seed, a team ranked 103, 

[fleckneymike]

FIFA is corrupt shocker.

[Vlad the Fox]

The top nations should break away from FIFA and form their own governing body and tournament.

[Manwell Pablo]

Manwell Pablo  quote above: "They're damned if they do damned if they don't, unless they come up with some way of protecting fans and players from fifty degree heat." 

 

At the time of the bidding process, the Qataris had this sorted:

 

"While addressing the European Club Association (ECA) that held its 10th General Assembly in Doha recently, Secretary General of the 2022 Supreme Committee, Hassan Al Thawadi, used the chance to further drum home that heat will not be a problem when the world gather in Qatar for the World Cup. Although respected stadium designer like John Barrow of Populus, has insisted that air cooling techniques were unsuitable for larger areas, Qatar officials insist that their plan was on track.

 

"Populus weren't working on our cooling technology. We've got a prototype coming very soon. It's our commitment, absolutely. New and revolutionary technologies will keep both players and spectators cool in open-air stadiums, delivering on one of our legacy promises of delivering an environmentally friendly and sustainable FIFA World Cup.

 

"From the beginning, we pledged to share the know-how behind these second-generation cooling systems with countries with similar summer climates to our own. We want to be able to expand mega-event hosting and leave a legacy of opportunity for nations and parts of the world that have not previously had the opportunity to host such events, due to climate concerns," he noted.

 

He further admitted that several of the planned stadiums will have modular components that will be disassembled following the tournament and donated to developing nations in need of sporting infrastructure. The cooling is not going to be limited to the playing pitches alone. The Qatar 2022 committee is planning an all encompassing cooling projects that will also ensure that the entire stadium neighbourhood is enjoyed by fans."

 

 

 

Empty promises?

 

Well if they did that I'd be fine with them having it

 

I suspect there is more chance of Ian Watkins winning baby sitter of the year though

 

 

Good point that, it is almost like they haven't thought any of this through.

 

Has it been mentioned that they will automatically qualify as a top seed, a team ranked 103, 

 

That's fair enough I think, not really an issue

[Kitchandro]

 

Well if they did that I'd be fine with them having it

 

 

I wouldn't. A bit of air conditioning shouldn't disguise the fact they're a terrible nation, not a footballing country, and they bribed FIFA to win it.

[Manwell Pablo]

I wouldn't. A bit of air conditioning shouldn't disguise the fact they're a terrible nation, not a footballing country, and they bribed FIFA to win it.

 

 

define "terrible nation" 

 

It is actually quite an up and coming footballing nation, the national league's pretty good especially given the size of it, down to the money in it, loads of big name players have gone to play in Qatar at some point, a couple of the clubs have bigger stadiums than us and they get good attendances. 

 

I agree with you on the last one they probably did, but then Russia probably did as well by all accounts and whoever get's it after Qatar probably will too. Blame FIFA for that, shower of shit.  

[Kitchandro]

define "terrible nation" 

 

It is actually quite an up and coming footballing nation, the national league's pretty good especially given the size of it, down to the money in it, loads of big name players have gone to play in Qatar at some point, a couple of the clubs have bigger stadiums than us and they get good attendances. 

 

I agree with you on the last one they probably did, but then Russia probably did as well by all accounts and whoever get's it after Qatar probably will too. Blame FIFA for that, shower of shit.  

 

One that is openly against homosexuality, drinking, and pretty much everyone who's not Muslim.

 

Do me a favour, an up and coming football nation?  I bet very few people could name one of their teams, I've never seen Qatar play and they certainly haven't qualified for a World Cup before.

[Manwell Pablo]

One that is openly against homosexuality, drinking, and pretty much everyone who's not Muslim.

 

Do me a favour, an up and coming football nation?  I bet very few people could name one of their teams, I've never seen Qatar play and they certainly haven't qualified for a World Cup before.

 

The Homosexuality thing fair enough is wrong, but not really something I think can overly affect a decision to play a major sporting event in that country, FIFA isn't the LGBT portal after all it's not here to fix the worlds morale issues, as I've said racism and violence is rife in Russia, and Brazil has some vile parts and is dangerous at night,  it's murder rate is through the roof something I'd place higher on a list of modern problems than gay rights, I've done all that without mentioning South Africa as well which has it's own rather glaring huge issues but managed to pull off hosting the World Cup.

 

I don't think not having loads of pubs so the British can't get tanked up is a reason to deny them the world cup either and your just being ignorant and over the top with the last one, it might have one or two funky laws about publically worshiping other gods than Alah but I think they'll be relaxed if they hope to host a World Cup succesfully, they certainly aren't "against" non muslims.

 

Erm, whether you like it or not, their league is up and coming, it's certainly got more about it than the South African one. Players like Raul and Niang currently play their trade there, not to be scoffed at (I think it even made it onto FIFA 13 ). The exploits of their national team are always going to be hampered by the country's size though and should imagine they wont do very well but then I don't think a country should be denied the world cup because their national team isn't in the top 50 in the world, it should be about the best hosting facilities (which imo is where their bid actually falls down)

 

If they can pull it off at the right time of year and no one's going to die of heat exhaustion then it's fine by me. But as that's never going to happen, I'm not. 

[The Doctor]

The whole Qatar campaign has been a farce from the beginning. How it could get awarded to a country who have never been ranked in the top 50 countries in the rankings and that has never qualified is beyond me. And then looking beyond that is the very strict laws which are almost definitely going to be pushed to the limit, upsetting both the locals and and the travelling supporters from around the world.

 

The experience could well be ruined as well for the supporters who don't make the trip, I know me and my friends like a good BBQ and a couple of the drinks on the balcony etc before the big matches which won't be possible now.

 

The only positive I can really think of is that it may help the Qatar government to implement more lenient and less discriminative laws in the future, although this is probably only a very slim chance that will happen.

 

A country where the "government" style is an Emir (an absolute Islamic Monarchy) has no chance of introducing any lenient laws. 

[The Doctor]

I don't think not having loads of pubs so the British can't get tanked up is a reason to deny them the world cup either and your just being ignorant and over the top with the last one, it might have one or two funky laws about publically worshiping other gods than Alah but I think they'll be relaxed if they hope to host a World Cup succesfully, they certainly aren't "against" non muslims.

 

Converting from Islam carries the death penalty, as does being an atheist. Judaism isn't considered a valid religion by them and any non-Muslim religions have restrictions placed upon them in worshipping - they certainly are against non-muslims.

[Manwell Pablo]

Converting from Islam carries the death penalty, as does being an atheist. Judaism isn't considered a valid religion by them and any non-Muslim religions have restrictions placed upon them in worshipping - they certainly are against non-muslims.

 

Yes but, as you more than likely know, that is akin to our laws about being able to shoot a Welshman at midnight on the 4th of March with a bow and arrow in Sherwood forest, it's a law, no ones actually ever been executed for it in their independent history.

 

Jews, it's the middle east, it's a political issue with Isreal (would be quite amusing if they qualified)

 

And yes, as I said, there are some slight restrictions on worshiping other religions in public but as I say they'll probably be relaxed, well they'd better or the whole thing will be a disaster. But they aren't against non muslims, Christianity is a registered religion and thousands of Christians live there pretty much un oppressed if it was that hard being a non Muslim in Qatar I'm sure they'd leave as nothing is stopping them. 

 

Now if you compare the amount of racially motivated attacks and crimes occurring in the United Kingdom and Qatar on the other hand, it would show we are the intolerant society, not them. 

[MC Prussian]

Yes but, as you more than likely know, that is akin to our laws about being able to shoot a Welshman at midnight on the 4th of March with a bow and arrow in Sherwood forest, it's a law, no ones actually ever been executed for it in their independent history.

 

Jews, it's the middle east, it's a political issue with Isreal (would be quite amusing if they qualified)

 

And yes, as I said, there are some slight restrictions on worshiping other religions in public but as I say they'll probably be relaxed, well they'd better or the whole thing will be a disaster. But they aren't against non muslims, Christianity is a registered religion and thousands of Christians live there pretty much un oppressed if it was that hard being a non Muslim in Qatar I'm sure they'd leave as nothing is stopping them. 

 

Now if you compare the amount of racially motivated attacks and crimes occurring in the United Kingdom and Qatar on the other hand, it would show we are the intolerant society, not them. 

That's not really a fair comparison at all and VERY far-fetched, to be honest.

First of all, you're comparing a tiny Arab country with the UK that hosts a population 30 times bigger.

Naturally, just in sheer numbers, you'll always have a higher amount of attacks in the UK than in Qatar - unless they stop, of course.

 

Secondly, there's still the issue of the amount of attacks officially reported - be it to the police or in other, official stats.

If you look at homosexuality in Africa, for example, you'd be surprised by the things anti-homosexual movements and people get away with that is hardly reported over here.

[Manwell Pablo]

That's not really a fair comparison at all and VERY far-fetched, to be honest.

First of all, you're comparing a tiny Arab country with the UK that hosts a population 30 times bigger.

Naturally, just in sheer numbers, you'll always have a higher amount of attacks in the UK than in Qatar - unless they stop, of course.

 

Secondly, there's still the issue of the amount of attacks officially reported - be it to the police or in other, official stats.

If you look at homosexuality in Africa, for example, you'd be surprised by the things anti-homosexual movements and people get away with that is hardly reported over here.

 

No it's not, do it proportionally on population. Simple enough

 

You've lost me there it doesn't even seem to make sense to me so you might want to try and explain that better, but there is no problem with widespread crime not being reported in Qatar, Qater is incredible safe the crime index actually shows the rates of crime to be very similar with your namby pamby netural state in fact 

[The Doctor]

Yes but, as you more than likely know, that is akin to our laws about being able to shoot a Welshman at midnight on the 4th of March with a bow and arrow in Sherwood forest, it's a law, no ones actually ever been executed for it in their independent history.

 

Jews, it's the middle east, it's a political issue with Isreal (would be quite amusing if they qualified)

 

And yes, as I said, there are some slight restrictions on worshiping other religions in public but as I say they'll probably be relaxed, well they'd better or the whole thing will be a disaster. But they aren't against non muslims, Christianity is a registered religion and thousands of Christians live there pretty much un oppressed if it was that hard being a non Muslim in Qatar I'm sure they'd leave as nothing is stopping them. 

 

Now if you compare the amount of racially motivated attacks and crimes occurring in the United Kingdom and Qatar on the other hand, it would show we are the intolerant society, not them. 

 

Those so called laws are over-written by the passing of acts criminalising murder - While the laws did exist, they are repealed by the passing of new acts: it's not legal to murder anyone in any way in the UK. In Qatar however these laws exist and haven't been repealed by the passing of new acts. It's not legal to shoot a scotsman in york with a bow and arrow, but being an apostate or an atheist in Qatar carries the death penalty. They aren't as bad as Saudi Arabia or Iran, but they are firmly anti non-muslim, more lenient to "people of the book" (Christians) but still discriminate by law against any non-muslims.

[MC Prussian]

No it's not, do it proportionally on population. Simple enough

 

You've lost me there it doesn't even seem to make sense to me so you might want to try and explain that better, but there is no problem with widespread crime not being reported in Qatar, Qater is incredible safe the crime index actually shows the rates of crime to be very similar with your namby pamby netural state in fact 

You said 

"Now if you compare the amount of racially motivated attacks and crimes occurring in the United Kingdom and Qatar on the other hand, it would show we are the intolerant society, not them. "

which implies that you are comparing the sheer amount of those attacks in Qatar with the ones in the UK, which is not really fair at all - given the higher amount of people living in the UK for that matter.

 

Also, racially or sexually motivated attacks don't have to manifest themselves in sheer physical attacks, a regime of oppression also works by shunning LGBT people from the public sector, general employment, acceptance in society, general discrimination etc.

 

The amount of crimes being so low in Qatar is not at least a consequence of them using Arab/Islamic law which is by nature a lot stricter in terms of sentencing and punishment. Naturally, who wants to get caught assaulting someone or sexually abusing someone or stealing in Qatar when he knows how drastic the sentences are?

 

By the way, we have some of the most lax laws in the world. No death penalty, lax jurisdiction. No comparison to Qatar at all.

[Manwell Pablo]

Those so called laws are over-written by the passing of acts criminalising murder - While the laws did exist, they are repealed by the passing of new acts: it's not legal to murder anyone in any way in the UK. In Qatar however these laws exist and haven't been repealed by the passing of new acts. It's not legal to shoot a scotsman in york with a bow and arrow, but being an apostate or an atheist in Qatar carries the death penalty. They aren't as bad as Saudi Arabia or Iran, but they are firmly anti non-muslim, more lenient to "people of the book" (Christians) but still discriminate by law against any non-muslims.

 

I'm pretty sure murder has always been a criminal act, these laws allow stupid exceptions, a bit like the one that states the Gary Linekar can walk his sheep through Leicester town center because he has the key to the city.  But In any case that's not really the point. Nobody has been found guilty of  it and executed in 40 plus years it's pretty safe to say it's a law that's not being enforced and therefore, totally irrelevant to this discussion and it is not a reason why they shouldn't host a football tournament.   

 

Perhaps you could tell me what they actually do to the Sikhs, Buddists, and Hindu's who reside in Qatar then who also remain their willingly despite the fact they are free to go anywhere they want. For a rogue state the oppresses all that are not Islamic there seem to be quite a lot of non Muslims living there quite happily according to the population figures.....

[Manwell Pablo]

You said 

"Now if you compare the amount of racially motivated attacks and crimes occurring in the United Kingdom and Qatar on the other hand, it would show we are the intolerant society, not them. "

which implies that you are comparing the sheer amount of those attacks in Qatar with the ones in the UK, which is not really fair at all - given the higher amount of people living in the UK for that matter.

 

Also, racially or sexually motivated attacks don't have to manifest themselves in sheer physical attacks, a regime of oppression also works by shunning LGBT people from the public sector, general employment, acceptance in society, general discrimination etc.

 

The amount of crimes being so low in Qatar is not at least a consequence of them using Arab/Islamic law which is by nature a lot stricter in terms of sentencing and punishment. Naturally, who wants to get caught assaulting someone or sexually abusing someone or stealing in Qatar when he knows how drastic the sentences are?

 

By the way, we have some of the most lax laws in the world. No death penalty, lax jurisdiction. No comparison to Qatar at all.

 

Well ok, I meant proportionally, as I'd assume anyone would take as a given as it'd be pointless to do it any other way.

 

LGBT is different, I didn't say LGBT, different matter all together they have shocking laws in relation to that. But as I've said it's not really grounds to not play a football tournament there no country is perfect. 

 

Have you actually looked at Qatars laws, as, as for as I'm aware, they aren't quite in the cut your hand off for stealing an apple bracket and the only thing you can get executed for is espionage (apart from the doctors silly not existent crime) I could be wrong like. Still it's a safe country whether it be down to tough laws or not is an irrelevancy it works.