Some Stupid Benefit Sanctions

[Guest]

Well that'll get you the sack but if you could avoid doing that then it could be a good job for you. You'd be in an office, lots of young people, plenty of social opportunities, fairly easy work, requires no qualifications, and you can progress to management and earn decent money.

 

Can't you get him a job at McDonalds Moosey? You must be chief toilet cleaner now.

[The People's Hero]

Can't you get him a job at McDonalds Moosey? You must be chief toilet cleaner now.

I'm not sure if you have an inferiority complex which requires that you constantly try to put others down, or just have an extreme interest in either toilets or McDonald's, but I'm sure there are other forums more suitable for discussing your very particular interests/needs/fetishes.

[Voll Blau]

I've dealt with my fair share of knobs in this job, I've learnt how to insult them but then not have them realise that.

 

No you haven't. You've just learnt how to dish out shit insults.

[Rincewind]

I was doing 2 or 3 hours of swim teaching at the time and there was no reduction in the benefit I received.

The first £10 of earnings is not counted. It may have changed. I think the first week I never informed them because I thought I could do so many hours, Got away with it. Was told any hours I do I had to inform them. It was easier then but now its gone too far the other way. Yhey never seem to get the balance right.

 

Lamby the first rule of customer service is that they are a customer requiring the service you offer, so grit your teeth and nod your head politely, even if they are wrong and being knobheads.Insults will only cause them to seek out your superior to issue a complaint. He, not wishing the company to receive bad publicity as it would reflect on him, with him being senior management, will look for a scapegoat to blame, which is usually the most insignificant and lowest member of the workforce. YOU

So it is not a good idea to insult customers especially if you are a bog cleaner.

[The People's Hero]

The first £10 of earnings is not counted. It may have changed. I think the first week I never informed them because I thought I could do so many hours, Got away with it. Was told any hours I do I had to inform them. It was easier then but now its gone too far the other way. Yhey never seem to get the balance right.

Rincey, what's your view on giving these people food / clothing vouchers instead of cash.

I know bookies/weatherspoons/bargain booze and anywhere selling fags would be a bit put out, but what do you reckon ?

I don't think we've heard your view on this?

[Rincewind]

Despite the media  stories on people on benefits spending money on Booze etc the number is lower than you think.  Yes there is a lot of bad money management but there are also a lot of low paid workers (the biggest percentage) that receive benefits.With the welfare changes it has it many very hard. If you earn over 599 PW a reduction of £14 would be manageable. But if you are receive £200 or less it can have a big impact especially if on minimum wage and your hours are reduced.

Food vouchers? there should be no need for them. They are issued though for foodbanks. Recipients apply for them at social services after proving that their income merits them, then at the FB they are issued enough to last a few days. They can return two or three times after which they are directed to services that can give advice on household management

Even if vouchers are given out there are still other essentials like gas and electric to pay. And where would the vouchers be valid? Tesco?Aldi? or one of the supermarkets where the directors/owners have 'acquaintances ' in government? (any party) Who are then given a set amount for agreeing to run the scheme.

Welfare is supposed to be a safety net to prevent people having to rely on handouts from charity. Now there are gaping big holes in it and more and more people are falling through because of stagnant low wages and rising High Street prices. Councils are running out of the emergency fund set aside to help  the worse off which is adding more to the welfare budget. There are no easy solutions.

[MooseBreath]

What do you mean when you say people are "falling through", Rincey?

[Dr The Singh]

What do you mean when you say people are "falling through", Rincey?

He means, people owe him money and aren't paying up..........so pay the man Moosey!!!!

[Rincewind]

He means, people owe him money and aren't paying up..........so pay the man Moosey!!!!

 

No. This explains it a little. I know its from Shelter but it seems fairly balanced to me.

I have just had a text from some Payday loan Co. Borrow £500 and pay back whatever. It was not on my phone long enough to read it properly. Deleted in less than 5 seconds as soon as I saw what it was.

 

http://blog.shelter.org.uk/2014/06/winning-support-for-a-stronger-safety-net/

[Guest MattP]

I'll stick up for the welfare state any time but you're pretty much the worst advert for it ever.

Be proud of having a job, whatever it is, and realise sometimes you won't get to watch Charlton (Leicester in my case) because earning comes first. I've cleaned up bogs in fast food restaurants for a living before but it's a damned sight better than the month I spent on the dole.

Sometimes you can't always have the things in life you want. What a fvcking revelation eh!

Might start committing benefit fraud seeing as I can't afford to follow England playing cricket in the West Indies next year eh?

Why not! Ten of us going and one of the guys on the trip gets some dole money and gets his shopping for the food bank

He's got Sky, a full time job and is out with us every night

I don't blame Lamby anymore, he's a product of the entitlement culture, will be considered completely normal behaviour in 20 years.

[DANGEROUS TIGER]

The bottom line has to be. If you are unemployed, then earn your dole money. Plenty of community work needs doing. Give people money for nothing, then that's what they will expect out of life.

[Rincewind]

The bottom line has to be. If you are unemployed, then earn your dole money. Plenty of community work needs doing. Give people money for nothing, then that's what they will expect out of life.

I am not against doing community or voluntary work if it is used to gain experience and training to improve chances of finding FULL TIME work.. It is the exploitation I am against

[The People's Hero]

I am not against doing community or voluntary work if it is used to gain experience and training to improve chances of finding FULL TIME work.. It is the exploitation I am against

Where is the exploitation?

These people want free money but expecting them to do a bit of work in return is exploitation?

Can you listen to yourself, man?

[Rincewind]

Wage for working in poundland £6ph 40 Hr= £240

DWP £71 divided by 40 =£1,80 PH approx

Would you be willing to work for the second?

 

If a company want staff why not set the same workers on for the correct going rate for the job.

 

As I said there is nothing wrong in doing voluntary and training schemes if there i a job prospect at the end but using people in order to avoid a proper wage is wrong and in some cases proven illegal. The Minimum wage is £6,31 not £1.80

It is as simple as that.

[broughtonblue]

The bottom line has to be. If you are unemployed, then earn your dole money. Plenty of community work needs doing. Give people money for nothing, then that's what they will expect out of life.

Totally agree, loads of jobs need doing in many communities.

[MooseBreath]

Why haven't you included housing benefit? That's worth another £500pm at least, way more in some cases. Plus you pay income tax if you're working. Put it all together and you're a few quid per week better off by working if you're on minimum wage.

[broughtonblue]

Wage for working in poundland £6ph 40 Hr= £240

DWP £71 divided by 40 =£1,80 PH approx

Would you be willing to work for the second?

If a company want staff why not set the same workers on for the correct going rate for the job.

As I said there is nothing wrong in doing voluntary and training schemes if there i a job prospect at the end but using people in order to avoid a proper wage is wrong and in some cases proven illegal. The Minimum wage is £6,31 not £1.80

It is as simple as that.

It shouldn't back a case of would you be willing to work for it, it should be compulsory. Out of a 5 day week, what is wrong with doing work around the community for two days, leaving three days to look for a job?

[Rincewind]

I can't argue with you lot. I'll leave you to it. You all seem happy agreeing with each other it would be a shame to interupt

[potter3]

Wage for working in poundland £6ph 40 Hr= £240

DWP £71 divided by 40 =£1,80 PH approx

Would you be willing to work for the second?

 

If a company want staff why not set the same workers on for the correct going rate for the job.

 

As I said there is nothing wrong in doing voluntary and training schemes if there i a job prospect at the end but using people in order to avoid a proper wage is wrong and in some cases proven illegal. The Minimum wage is £6,31 not £1.80

It is as simple as that.

 

I don't think anyone is suggesting they work a full 40 hour week for £70, but that's wrong with doing 10-15 hours a week? If they are genuinely looking for a job they should be grateful for the experience, as it could help them land a full time position (at their placement or elsewhere).

[Voll Blau]

People should certainly be strongly encouraged to do voluntary work and stuff that will help them find work, but I do take the point there are people who play the system and don't want to do that. During my brief period of unemployment I found out how easy it would be to play the system if you were so inclined, it is ridiculous.

 

That said if you make working for benefits compulsory there's a danger firms could take advantage of it to get free labour, so it's got to be tightly regulated if that's what you're going to do.

[Guest MattP]

Unlucky Ken, looks like the week of defending the shirker has gone quickly pity takers not calling you up.

Moose raises a great point though, when we discuss what they should be paid for compulsory work, why don't we include housing benefit etc when incorporating thst into their hours? I'd like to hear a decent argument against us not doing so.

[Soar Fox]

Good point regarding people working for their benefit money. Do a bit of community work 10-15 hours per week earning a bit of money. If they don't like it, it still leaves them plenty of time to go out and find a proper job.

[Charl91]

 

You expect to sit on your arse and get paid for it, then automatically get a good job when you click your fingers? Typical of the generation (even though I'm part of it) of nowadays, they want something for doing nothing.

 

I hate that cliche. I don't think it's "typical" by any stretch of the imagination, and I wish people wouldn't perpetuate such rubbish.

 

As for the working for benefits malarky, I've always thought that it would be fair for claimants work an equivalent amount of hours to the amount they would have to put in to a minimum-wage job to earn that amount. I have no problems with job-seekers working for their money, seems perfectly fair to me if they are capable, but it would be disgusting for it to be for less than the minimum wage.

 

I guess I'm technically jobless at the moment. Not going to bother with the job centre though, it's a depressing place.

[Harry - LCFC]

Ridiculous.

 

You're working in order to take a bit of pride in yourself, improve your CV, to show potential future employees that you have the work ethic that they want.

 

You're moaning about £95 a week for 15 hours work, that's the same as what I used to be on.

 

From the age of 16 I've worked a minimum of 15 hours a week, I was working this at the end of secondary school and continued throughout college. At the start of university I was rewarded with an extra 7.5 hours and now work 22.5 hours a week minimum.

 

Once university is finished I'll hopefully get a graduate scheme. Half of the battle in getting a job is the mindset.

 

You expect to sit on your arse and get paid for it, then automatically get a good job when you click your fingers? Typical of the generation (even though I'm part of it) of nowadays, they want something for doing nothing.

 

EDIT: Would just like to add I have friends who have taken temporary jobs and worked long hours in order to gain experience, both of the lads I know have now been taken on full time and have got a wage rise too. Hard work pays off.

 

The Economist has done a study that shows quite the opposite actually.

 

 

What's typical is society falling back on the stereotype of young people being a 'problem'

[Rincewind]

Charl91 That is what I meant about exploitation. What is to stop a company getting rid of some of its workforce then setting unemployed on to do the same work and paying less. Much netter to do voluntary work there are plenty of charity shops that need help and care assistants and helping elderly and disabled and blind people lead a better life. They will gain experience and gain job satisfaction plus it looks good on a CV to do that sort of thing far better than stacking shelves which is not exactly rewarding.

I don't know where I said I was against those out of work doing something in the community while looking for work on JSA. DNO who I volunteer for encourage training with us as do Apex where we use one of their rooms.

It is just the 'being made to'  and doing excessive hours that I find wrong.

Good luck to you Chal I don't blame you for not bothering with it if are able. There is now going to be a five week waiting period for all new claimants. So if you lose your job you will have nothing coming in for at least five weeks maybe longer depending on how long it takes to process thing. . Bit tough on the low to middle  wage earners with a mortgage and a family