Babylon Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 I don't call being bottom and 7 points away from safety a good season Reality I have in abundance thanks aswell as honesty in that when we play well I praise and when we don't im honest enough to say we haven't played well I rarely go overboard with criticism but my honest thoughts are that this season has been an utter disaster Who called it a good season? Why are you twisting it? It's been a poor and disappointing season... but a disgrace, do me a favour. If we'd held on against Burnley an Everton and not had a dodgy penno against us at Liverpool would the season suddenly have been that much better. Not for me. We're struggling, like we were tipped to struggle by many pundits and other fans and bookies etc. So I fail to see how it's a disgrace when you're just about living up to those expectations.
Fox Ulike Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 For the 1000 time, Cambiasso had to come off. You might not agree but at the end of the day most people realise if a player needs to come of then they need to come off. What's better... 3 at the back or 4 at the back? The logic behind it was there as you can push an extra man forward, what was wrong was making subs to do that... then reverting to the 4. And for the 1,001th time, he didn't have to come off. He was "fatigued" not injured. Kramaric was also fatigued but was not experienced enough to signal this to the bench. Pearson should have realised this and acted accordingly. Anyway... let's not re-open that can of worms yeah?
Mark 'expert' Lawrenson Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 The problem is you're comparing it to previous premier league seasons. What we need to be comparing is the difference between the premier league and the championship, which is still clearly vast looking at the bottom three. Teams coming up seem to be replying on other teams imploding and bad appointments. So it might be mediocre compared to 10 years ago, but the gap is growing ever bigger and will continue to do so with FFP. The league has actually changed over the last few years for me, the quality and the entertainment value has dropped. With more and more teams just focused on grinding out results and happy to pick up 0-0's away etc. With people like Pulis lauded as something amazing. Therefore the 3 relegated teams from last year surely should be doing far better than what they are if there is such a vast difference.
Mark 'expert' Lawrenson Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 The problem is you're comparing it to previous premier league seasons. What we need to be comparing is the difference between the premier league and the championship, which is still clearly vast looking at the bottom three. Teams coming up seem to be replying on other teams imploding and bad appointments. So it might be mediocre compared to 10 years ago, but the gap is growing ever bigger and will continue to do so with FFP. The league has actually changed over the last few years for me, the quality and the entertainment value has dropped. With more and more teams just focused on grinding out results and happy to pick up 0-0's away etc. With people like Pulis lauded as something amazing. By the way agree entirely with the whole of your last paragraph.
Babylon Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 And for the 1,001th time, he didn't have to come off. He was "fatigued" not injured. Kramaric was also fatigued but was not experienced enough to signal this to the bench. Pearson should have realised this and acted accordingly. Anyway... let's not re-open that can of worms yeah? You're the one reopening it and you have no idea how fatigued either of them were. Actually we know one was for sure seeing as he asked to come off. Put it this way... who is likely to be more fatigued, a 22 year old or a 34 year old. For all you know Kramaric thought he could continue, prove to me he couldn't? Where as the 34 year old most decorated Argentinian of all time felt he couldn't. It's a ridiculous argument and with so many genuine reasons to moan throughout the season I find it ridiculous the need to grasp at straws with this one.
Guest Col city fan Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Am I still reading the old 'PL Is mediocre' argument? I really would have thought people would have learnt by now. It appears not..
Babylon Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Therefore the 3 relegated teams from last year surely should be doing far better than what they are if there is such a vast difference. You know it doesn't work like that. One was a champ team, one is doing just fine at the moment and the other imploded with bad appointments last year and this. There is so much money in this league, Hull who stayed up by a point last year have spent the best part of £50m and are still woeful. It's going to get harder and harder to compete.
cc_star Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 The problem is you're comparing it to previous premier league seasons. What we need to be comparing is the difference between the premier league and the championship, which is still clearly vast looking at the bottom three. Teams coming up seem to be replying on other teams imploding and bad appointments. So it might be mediocre compared to 10 years ago, but the gap is growing ever bigger and will continue to do so with FFP. The league has actually changed over the last few years for me, the quality and the entertainment value has dropped. With more and more teams just focused on grinding out results and happy to pick up 0-0's away etc. With people like Pulis lauded as something amazing. Spot on!!!! Therefore the 3 relegated teams from last year surely should be doing far better than what they are if there is such a vast difference. No, all 3 promoted teams have been naive for far too long this season and wanted to not only be competitive, but to win the games.... Whereas teams who will survive are happy to grind out a point Should we have packed the midfield to stifle the opposition and picked up a few more points to be around 18th-15th
Babylon Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Am I still reading the old 'PL Is mediocre' argument? I really would have thought people would have learnt by now. It appears not.. By old prem standards it probably is. Eg. lacking the flair and quality of years gone by. But even the worst teams are littered by £10m players, it's becoming a tough nut to crack without large amounts of cash.
cc_star Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 You know it doesn't work like that. One was a champ team, one is doing just fine at the moment and the other imploded with bad appointments last year and this. There is so much money in this league, Hull who stayed up by a point last year have spent the best part of £50m and are still woeful. It's going to get harder and harder to compete. Our only appearance in the top flight for a decade is showing
Ollie93 Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 The problem is you're comparing it to previous premier league seasons. What we need to be comparing is the difference between the premier league and the championship, which is still clearly vast looking at the bottom three. Teams coming up seem to be replying on other teams imploding and bad appointments. So it might be mediocre compared to 10 years ago, but the gap is growing ever bigger and will continue to do so with FFP. The league has actually changed over the last few years for me, the quality and the entertainment value has dropped. With more and more teams just focused on grinding out results and happy to pick up 0-0's away etc. With people like Pulis lauded as something amazing. I completely agree with this, aswell with the new SKY deal the gap is just going to grow IMO, isn't it something stupid like teams get £5m per game next season just from tv rights?
Fox Ulike Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 You're the one reopening it and you have no idea how fatigued either of them were. Actually we know one was for sure seeing as he asked to come off. Put it this way... who is likely to be more fatigued, a 22 year old or a 34 year old. For all you know Kramaric thought he could continue, prove to me he couldn't? Where as the 34 year old most decorated Argentinian of all time felt he couldn't. It's a ridiculous argument and with so many genuine reasons to moan throughout the season I find it ridiculous the need to grasp at straws with this one. Neither do you. So why is it 'ridiculous' for me to make one choice, but perfect sanity for you to make a different one? Pearson should have told Cambi he had to stay on and find the extra energy from somewhere. So what if he's tired? Tough. We need you, Cambi. Just sit in front of the defence and help keep possession. My opinion is valid, but unprovable one way or the other. SO IS YOURS!
Babylon Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Neither do you. So why is it 'ridiculous' for me to make one choice, but perfect sanity for you to make a different one? Pearson should have told Cambi he had to stay on and find the extra energy from somewhere. So what if he's tired? Tough. We need you, Cambi. Just sit in front of the defence and help keep possession. My opinion is valid, but unprovable one way or the other. SO IS YOURS! No, mine is provable because Cambiasso clearly asked to come off. I saw it with my own two eyes and so did a number of others who pointed it out long before I did in the match thread. So we know for a fact, that he clearly felt unable to continue. You on the other hand base your argument on thinking Kramaric was fatigued but somehow too scared to say he couldn't continue. There is a difference there... one based on actual events and one based on a guess.
Guest MattP Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Am I still reading the old 'PL Is mediocre' argument? I really would have thought people would have learnt by now. It appears not.. It is - our top sides get regularly knocked out of Europe by teams like Fiorentina these days. Remember ten years ago - our fifth place side won the Champions League - now our top ones can't make the last eight. Our mistake was overestimating our own team and not realising what it takes to win games up here as a lower side (big,strong, good on set pieces etc) Burnley are giving survival a crack as they seem to have realised this - it's depressing.
Dan Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Noticed another hallmark of the foaming-at-the-mouth, rattle-tossing "Pearson out" folk in this thread: they tell you what your argument is, instruct you to defend it and then strut away victoriously when you can't. I haven't seen a single person say that Pearson has had an exemplary season or that we've had a problem-free time in the premiership, but this is how your view will be summarized if you try and deliver a balanced and proportioned view on the topic of his sacking. If you even dare to suggest that he still might be a decent option either in the premiership in the unlikely even that we stay up, or in the championship if we go down, you'll be told that you're stupid for agreeing with every formation, substitution, and decision that Pearson has made, as if there's no way you can notice the man's flaws and mistakes but not act like a jilted lover every time his name is mentioned. Everything is a false dichotomy on here; you're either vehemently for or ardently against it and if you're not one, exponents of the other will say you are anyway and then lambast you for holding a fictional position. Spot on. Some of our fans are cringeworthy. Massive at the one who claimed people wouldn't bring their kids because of Pearson's behaviour. If they're put off that easily then football isn't for them.
Ollie93 Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Spot on. Some of our fans are cringeworthy. Massive at the one who claimed people wouldn't bring their kids because of Pearson's behaviour. If they're put off that easily then football isn't for them. Its not Pearsons behaviour they should be worried about, I witnessed a man at Villa away with his daughter, who was about 7, calling Pearson a c**t amongst other things, parenting at its finest...
Guest Col city fan Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 By old prem standards it probably is. Eg. lacking the flair and quality of years gone by. But even the worst teams are littered by £10m players, it's becoming a tough nut to crack without large amounts of cash. Hurrah.... THAT'S exactly the point. The Prem is not full of brilliant teams. What it IS full of is teams who are very strong, fit, with Wily old managers and clubs flush with cash. We romped the Championship last season..Utterly tore it apart. Yet this season, we are a shadow of last year's team. Either Nigel has lost the plot (maybe?) or we have failed to bridge the huge gulf that exists between the two divisions (probably a bit of both). Many people dismissed the idea that the gulf was big, before the season started. And are still doing it now. We sometimes look like boys on a man's game in this division. With clear exceptions (Was and now Huth), we are physically so bloody frail and slow (especially in the middle of the park IMO) that teams have just out fought us. When the physical fitness is combined with skill as well, we were always on a hiding to nothing really. People have under-estimated the PL at their peril.
Guest MattP Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 It's the physicality that's been underestimated. Dame N'Doye can do a job in this league because he's big and powerful - a bloke whose techinal ability was laughed out of the Russian league.
Donut Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 It's the physicality that's been underestimated. Dame N'Doye can do a job in this league because he's big and powerful - a bloke whose techinal ability was laughed out of the Russian league. Hes a decent player. The Premiership still has more technical ability than the Russian league id be confident to say
The Railway Man Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 West Brom V Stoke summed it why we are where we are and why they are where they are. Following on from the point about how strong and big teams are, there's was a game that was just as shit as ours, two sides very average and both devoid of any real quality. But West Brom get the 3 points in typically Pulis fashion - ball tossed into the box and big striker on the end to nod it home, it's shit but it works. The PL is very average these days. Allardyce/Pulis etc have shown everyone how a team can survive in a very ugly way and that's why we're so far behind the rest of Europe as a division.
Eskay Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 I don't think we underestimated anything. I think that gets proved with the old stat about not losing by more than 2 goals etc. The problem I think is simple - NP simply started making some seriously bizarre decisions. Completely the opposite of what he did when he first came back to the club. Last year we knew (mostly) the starting lineup - our strongest XI and our system in each game. Could you say the same now? Stability is what he brought to the club after all of the madness under sousa and sven et al. He just tried to get too smart this year. We talk about other teams doing this that and the other....but ultimately it does not matter...we have been responsible for our downfall. With a sprinkling of bad luck of course. I'll never understand: -playing 4 CM's -making only 1 sub when 1 down against Villa in the FA Cup -Dropping players for absolutely no reason (Albrighton, Knocky, Hamer, Was) -Playing 1 up front and 5 at the back against Hull, Everton. -Waiting to bring on Nugent for the last 10 against Hull. Our best performers from last season IMO - Wes, Kasper, Drinky, Mahrez, Nugent, Vardy, Dyer. Nowhere to be seen either in form and in Dyers case at the club! When the chips are down you go back to basics....How many times have Nuge and Vardy started up top together? Andy King who at least can score a goal, is brought on to protect a lead instead of actually get a goal. I've rambled on a lot here so apologies.....but ultimately our demise has been down to LCFC....not any other club or the quality in the league etc.
Mark 'expert' Lawrenson Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Am I still reading the old 'PL Is mediocre' argument? I really would have thought people would have learnt by now. It appears not.. Quite a condescending attitude. Not everybody has to agree with you, differing opinions etc. You need to possibly learn that.
Silverdaz Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Yes the manangers had a mare but at the end of the day players are not good enough. Np has tried different formations to get various differenrt people into the games but they have not performed so I think the players have to take as much stick as the manager for letting us down this season
MC Prussian Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Neither do you. So why is it 'ridiculous' for me to make one choice, but perfect sanity for you to make a different one? Pearson should have told Cambi he had to stay on and find the extra energy from somewhere. So what if he's tired? Tough. We need you, Cambi. Just sit in front of the defence and help keep possession. My opinion is valid, but unprovable one way or the other. SO IS YOURS! Try telling that a 34-year old defensive midfielder who knows his body inside out and who's never been the quickest in the first place! Cambiasso was clearly knackered and any coach will tell you that it's wiser to take off an exhausted player when needed instead of risking injury troubles that could keep the player out of business longer than necessary.
artursteppe Posted 17 March 2015 Posted 17 March 2015 Who called it a good season? Why are you twisting it? It's been a poor and disappointing season... but a disgrace, do me a favour. If we'd held on against Burnley an Everton and not had a dodgy penno against us at Liverpool would the season suddenly have been that much better. Not for me. We're struggling, like we were tipped to struggle by many pundits and other fans and bookies etc. So I fail to see how it's a disgrace when you're just about living up to those expectations. If we'd held on against Burnley, HELD ON ??????????????????? Burnley were absolute rubbish that day and we 'swanned' through the match like it was 'easy on Sunday Morning'. We should have hammered them. I was fuming all through the match. The performance was an absolute disgrace. That was the day our demise started. Where were you? Didn't you go to the match????????????// The manager and our players are supposed to be professional. If a manager does not understand how important games like that are for a newly promoted side he should never be in a position to manage any professional side. We should have sacked him after that match. Why do you continue to excuse the inexcusable FFS?
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.