Baltimore Riots

[ozleicester]

Surprised that no-one has mentioned these, horrible scenes and just an awful situation where if you are born one side of a line, your life is completely different to someone just 5 miles away.

 

And, given everyone's interest in The Wire, its almost as if we know the place? I would be very interested to hear the opinions of our US foxes and of course Merging Cultures, given that used to be your home?

 

Speaking of The Wire, interesting article from the writer...

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/08/david-simon-capitalism-marx-two-americas-wire?CMP=soc_567

[Jon the Hat]

Surprised that no-one has mentioned these, horrible scenes and just an awful situation where if you are born one side of a line, your life is completely different to someone just 5 miles away.

 

And, given everyone's interest in The Wire, its almost as if we know the place? I would be very interested to hear the opinions of our US foxes and of course Merging Cultures, given that used to be your home?

 

Speaking of The Wire, interesting article from the writer...

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/08/david-simon-capitalism-marx-two-americas-wire?CMP=soc_567

 

Brilliant article, and bang on the money.  He is right to say the power of Capital in the US is way more than anywhere else though.  I really don't see the UK as anything like that market dominated.  The conservatives are WAY closer to the centre than the Republicans.  Interesting insight in how things can move in a relatively short period though, and we clearly do have a disengaged underclass, living on benefits and disconnected from society which we need to solve, we just got there in a different way.

[Guest ttfn]

Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeiiiiiiit (sorry).

[ousefox]

My mates Dad wrote this about the Wire a few years ago. Quite an interesting read if you get the time. http://soc.sagepub.com/content/45/1/152.full.pdf 

[The Railway Man]

Shops have been totally looted.

 

All that's left is Suncream and Father's Day cards.

[ozleicester]

My mates Dad wrote this about the Wire a few years ago. Quite an interesting read if you get the time. http://soc.sagepub.com/content/45/1/152.full.pdf 

 

got to sign in to read?

[ousefox]

got to sign in to read?

Ah shit - must be because my computer is logged into some uni thing somewhere. I'll see if I can find a way round it later.

 

Edit. If anyone is interested, PM me your email and I'll try sending the PDF. It's an academic article called 'The Wire as Social Science-fiction?'

[Buce]

When I saw the thread title, I thought Merging Cultures was kicking-off...

[Guest MattP]

Looks pretty horrific.

 

Some horrid racial overtones to it as well, the scenes outside the baseball stadium of the Orioles were terrible, saw one video where anyone and anyone who was white was being punched, kicked and beaten by a mob, even one girl in a wheelchair in the middle of it ffs.

 

Fair play for the community leaders last night trying to stop the people but it seems it fell on deaf ears.

 

Shame on the BBC as well for describing these things as protests last night on the news, looting, arson and violence is not protest.

[leicsmac]

Looks pretty horrific.

 

Some horrid racial overtones to it as well, the scenes outside the baseball stadium of the Orioles were terrible, saw one video where anyone and anyone who was white was being punched, kicked and beaten by a mob, even one girl in a wheelchair in the middle of it ffs.

 

Fair play for the community leaders last night trying to stop the people but it seems it fell on deaf ears.

 

Shame on the BBC as well for describing these things as protests last night on the news, looting, arson and violence is not protest.

 

The protests were exactly that: marches over the death of a black guy in police custody. 

 

The riots then began when some hotheaded morons decided to use the marches as an excuse to loot, fire and cause violence, with a willing police force to oblige them. And, of course, the moment that happens the original message gets lost because all everyone focuses on is that. I would say it's sad that those idiots do their cause no good but they simply don't give a shit.

[MPH]

The protests were exactly that: marches over the death of a black guy in police custody. 

 

You know some of the officers involved in his arrest were black don't you?

This is not a white on black thing.....

Whilst what happened was terrible to the guy, I hate that people have made this another racial divide.

[lgfualol]

Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeiiiiiiit (sorry).

 

Yea, where's McNutty

[MPH]

Provocative, I know... But let's remember what starts all this....

[leicsmac]

You know some of the officers involved in his arrest were black don't you?

This is not a white on black thing.....

Whilst what happened was terrible to the guy, I hate that people have made this another racial divide.

 

Nope, and nor did I say it was. This isn't about race, as you say. It's about police violence in general, and sometimes innocent people (whatever their skin colour) being on the end of it.

 

image.jpg

Provocative, I know... But let's remember what starts all this....

 

If every single police officer were incorruptible and didn't abuse their power I'd agree with this. Sadly, it's simply not the case.

[MPH]

Nope, and nor did I say it was. This isn't about race, as you say. It's about police violence in general, and sometimes innocent people (whatever their skin colour) being on the end of it.

.

Then why is everyone, including yourself seem very happy to point out that it was because of the death of a black man? Why does it matter what skin color he had? Why even mention his skin color?

And as for him being innocent, he was arrested on gun charges and has a long criminal history.

It's also worth pointing out that this guy had (allegedly) quite an extensive surgical spinal history. Including another back operation less than two weeks before his arrest. If that's true... And I say IF, then he should of been at home recuperating and not committing crime.

[Strokes]

You will have to explain that back surgery thing MPH, im just not sure what you are getting at?

[DANGEROUS TIGER]

You know some of the officers involved in his arrest were black don't you?

This is not a white on black thing.....

Whilst what happened was terrible to the guy, I hate that people have made this another racial divide.

I'm with you all the way on this. Crime is a crime, be they white, or black, perpetrators. The race card comes into play far too often.

[leicsmac]

Then why is everyone, including yourself seem very happy to point out that it was because of the death of a black man? Why does it matter what skin color he had? Why even mention his skin color?

And as for him being innocent, he was arrested on gun charges and has a long criminal history.

It's also worth pointing out that this guy had (allegedly) quite an extensive surgical spinal history. Including another back operation less than two weeks before his arrest. If that's true... And I say IF, then he should of been at home recuperating and not committing crime.

 

I used that term in my first post to illustrate that they felt the need to protest in solidarity over the suspicious death of one of their own demographic - something that many would sympathise with if the demographics were switched round.

 

Regardless of whether or not he was arrested for whatever crime, he died without any kind of due process, and because of that the Baltimore PD has some serious questions to answer. Do you think they would come up with an adequate explanation? The last time I checked, having a rap sheet for whatever crime didn't mean you got to die without ever seeing a courtroom.

 

That's the point I'm making regarding 'innocent' - there are a lot of people dying at the hands of the police in, shall we say, misguided circumstances, without being subject to the due process guaranteed to them. So, yes - in that respect, they are innocent. Certainly innocent enough to not warrant death. And it's a systemic rather than isolated problem.

 

Do you think that every incident of police violence against civilians - leaving skin colour out of it - has been justified in recent times?

[EnderbyFox]

[MPH]

 

You will have to explain that back surgery thing MPH, im just not sure what you are getting at?

 

He died in custody and it has been discovered his spine had snapped. He had been requesting medical attention and the police back at the jail were very slow on getting it for him

[Strokes]

He died in custody and it has been discovered his spine had snapped. He had been requesting medical attention and the police back at the jail were very slow on getting it for him

Ah I see, thanks for clearing that up.

[ronnup]

Then why is everyone, including yourself seem very happy to point out that it was because of the death of a black man? Why does it matter what skin color he had? Why even mention his skin color?

And as for him being innocent, he was arrested on gun charges and has a long criminal history.

It's also worth pointing out that this guy had (allegedly) quite an extensive surgical spinal history. Including another back operation less than two weeks before his arrest. If that's true... And I say IF, then he should of been at home recuperating and not committing crime.

Committing what crime? The arrest documents said he 'looked at the police' and then'ran'.

Crimes?

I think you're naive to assume that you can take race out of the equation I'm afraid. There are real issues in the states regarding inequality in so many different ways.

[ronnup]

https://www.jacobinmag.com/2015/01/when-rioting-is-rational-ferguson/

Also worth a read.

[Guest MattP]

The protests were exactly that: marches over the death of a black guy in police custody. 

 

The riots then began when some hotheaded morons decided to use the marches as an excuse to loot, fire and cause violence, with a willing police force to oblige them. And, of course, the moment that happens the original message gets lost because all everyone focuses on is that. I would say it's sad that those idiots do their cause no good but they simply don't give a shit.

 

When I said 'these things' I meant images of 200 people lotting a pharmay, that's not a protest. The BBC carried that word while showing footage of that.

 

I blame the media for this, they have hyped this up base on race (despite the fact far more white people die in police custody than black) and now if a black person dies in the custody of officers towns are going up in flames and innocent people are having their lives ruined, they should be ashamed.

[MPH]

 

Committing what crime? The arrest documents said he 'looked at the police' and then'ran'.

Crimes?

I think you're naive to assume that you can take race out of the equation I'm afraid. There are real issues in the states regarding inequality in so many different ways.

 

He was carrying weapons when he wasnt supposed to. He knew it too. He had a long criminal history and anyone who has been convicted in the past of any violent crimes isnt allowed to carry a weapon...

In the U.S anyone who runs from the police gives them probable cause to detain them.

And whilst i might be naive for trying to take race out of the equation, that doesnt mean that taking race out of the equation is an ideology thats wrong to aim for... and believe me, having lived in the states now for 5 years im very aware of the racial devide and racial inequalities.