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FoxInTheBirstallBox

Teaching

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Just a little advice/story thread

Currently a sous chef with 8 years experience and 25 years old, and seeing how the industry where I work in is slowing I'm thinking of a possible career change and I feel teaching is for me, I have a levels in food tech but not university or teaching experience (only teaching the other chefs how to do things at work) 

Does anyone have any experience in changing into a career in teaching without any current higher education? 

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1 hour ago, FoxInTheBirstallBox said:

Just a little advice/story thread

Currently a sous chef with 8 years experience and 25 years old, and seeing how the industry where I work in is slowing I'm thinking of a possible career change and I feel teaching is for me, I have a levels in food tech but not university or teaching experience (only teaching the other chefs how to do things at work) 

Does anyone have any experience in changing into a career in teaching without any current higher education? 

 

My understanding on teaching is you have to do a degree... so for you it would mean going to University as a mature student.

 

Now it just happens I've just gone through that process myself over the past month or so (albeit in my case to study journalism), so thought I'd give you an insight on this aspect. 

 

Now the slightly disappointing news for you is that the deadline for standard applications to start a course in Sept 2017 has just passed (it was the 30 June). There is the option to make a late application through clearing at this stage - but that doesn't leave you with much time to play with for 2017 entry and it's not a process that can be easily rushed. 

 

Even if you knew what course and University you wanted to apply for now, you'd still need as part of the application;

 

  • full details of your grades including exam board (easy if you know where your certificates are, not so if you don't)
  • to complete a personal statement, where you attempt to show your passion for the chosen course and why you'd be suitable for a place on the course. You have a maximum of 47 lines in order to do this (line spaces count to this as well) and it's not easy to do - it took me 5/6 solid days of tourment to finalise something I was happy with. 
  • to get someone to complete a reference for you*

*suggestion - because I was having difficulty getting everything I wanted into the personal statement, I got the person doing the reference to write about my work experience and how the skills I showed in that environment was well suited to the course I was applying for - this allowed me to focus my personal statement on other areas.

 

So yes, the application is a job in itself - but I hope that hasn't put you off. It's certainly worth checking out the UCAS website because you can search for courses and find lots of information. 

 

In terms of teaching itself, a key consideration for you is to consider who (infants, juniors, seniors?) and what (subject) you want to teach as that will influence the path you take. That may seem obvious - but when I had an interest in becoming a teacher many years ago, I struggled with this aspect. 

 

And one final thing about teaching... if you haven't yet, I'd suggest having a chat with someone who is a teacher to finding out what it's like. My understanding is the strict curriculum content and growing demands outside of the classroom have sucked the enjoyment out of the profession for many. 

 

Whatever you decide - good luck ? 

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1 hour ago, FoxInTheBirstallBox said:

Just a little advice/story thread

Currently a sous chef with 8 years experience and 25 years old, and seeing how the industry where I work in is slowing I'm thinking of a possible career change and I feel teaching is for me, I have a levels in food tech but not university or teaching experience (only teaching the other chefs how to do things at work) 

Does anyone have any experience in changing into a career in teaching without any current higher education? 

This might help.They have a teacher training course and it was where my youngest trained as a chef before going onto Stoke Park and The Belfry.

   https://www.nwhc.ac.uk/courses

 

You may also be interested in this in that it shows that, in the private sector, you can gain qualifications as you go along.

 

 http://www.iscteachertraining.co.uk/for-trainees/routes-into-teaching/

 

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Thankyou guys that's really insightful, may very well look on at the next year's application and take a year really looking into it. I do like what I do and not to sound big headed I am very good at it. I can just see how the industry is slowing down and may need to think long term for a safer career prospects and a retirement package

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I'd really try and get some experience in a school before you commit to this, or at least have a back up plan. There's a reason why around a quarter of newly qualified teacher's since 2011 have already left. 

 

From my experience of working as a TA (was 8 years ago) and seriously considering teaching. It wasn't the behaviour of students that put me off (And I worked in at the time, one of the more violent schools in the country (allegedly) - we made the Daily Mail and had 6 different headteachers in 5 years). It was more the pathetic bureaucracy and the behaviour of Senior Teachers. Schools can be very clicky, petty places where arse-kissing is on a scale I've never seen before. 

 

A lot of people go into teaching with very honourable idealistic attitudes, only to find out the reality is very different. It's not what they expected, they cannot help children in the way they want and most of their time is spent dealing with bad behaviour, mountains of paperwork and having to placate other teachers and use their teaching methods.

 

Good luck though, I hope this doesn't put you off. I also have friends who are teachers who enjoy the job, got experience and knew what to expect.

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27 minutes ago, FoxInTheBirstallBox said:

Thankyou guys that's really insightful, may very well look on at the next year's application and take a year really looking into it. I do like what I do and not to sound big headed I am very good at it. I can just see how the industry is slowing down and may need to think long term for a safer career prospects and a retirement package

 

A lot of teachers thought they had that until the Tories decided otherwise.

 

This might be a useful read:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2017/jul/08/almost-a-quarter-of-teachers-who-have-qualified-since-2011-have-left-profession

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Fox, the current malaise in society won't go on forever. They're be political change and positivity will return. Teachers will be looked after again. It's always a good idea to have more than one stent to your bow so go for it. Look forward with positivity as the people of this country won't let negativity win forever. 

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On 08/07/2017 at 16:43, FoxInTheBirstallBox said:

Just a little advice/story thread

Currently a sous chef with 8 years experience and 25 years old, and seeing how the industry where I work in is slowing I'm thinking of a possible career change and I feel teaching is for me, I have a levels in food tech but not university or teaching experience (only teaching the other chefs how to do things at work) 

Does anyone have any experience in changing into a career in teaching without any current higher education? 

Have you thought of combining your current skills with your inkling to teach? I have a business that delivers training courses on food safety and conducts restaurant inspections. Instead of going for a teacher degree you could maybe angle for an Environmental Health degree, doing it alongside your current job.

 

Its also possible to do vocational qualifications as well.

 

i also do some inspections of private schools and they seem to be the happiest chefs around. Monday to Friday, well paid, no late nights and all the holidays you could ever need! 

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23 hours ago, DJ Barry Hammond said:

 

Sorry @FoxInTheBirstallBox - it seems everyone is pissing on your bonfire! 

 

Out of interest, what was it you wanted to teach and what attracts you to that profession in particular?

It's better to hear the downsides first than hit them yourself before it's too late lol and about a year ago I began to go vegatarian then vegan after seeing what goes on in the industry, but I love what I do and I feel I'm naturally gifted at it. The job I do is Monday Friday 6 till 5 so I get the personal time I enjoy (which is a draw to teaching too, the hours) and if I change job within this industry I know I'll never get these hours again especially with my conflict of interest. 

I have always enjoyed teaching others skills and wanting to inspire people into what i do so I felt that teaching could very well be a perfect fit for me

 

14 minutes ago, Milo said:

Have you thought of combining your current skills with your inkling to teach? I have a business that delivers training courses on food safety and conducts restaurant inspections. Instead of going for a teacher degree you could maybe angle for an Environmental Health degree, doing it alongside your current job.

 

Its also possible to do vocational qualifications as well.

 

i also do some inspections of private schools and they seem to be the happiest chefs around. Monday to Friday, well paid, no late nights and all the holidays you could ever need! 

This sounds like a very attractive option, I work to SALSA certification so I know about quite high levels of food hygiene, I don't suppose you know any companies or courses that could point me in the right direction to get some more information on this please? 

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16 minutes ago, FoxInTheBirstallBox said:

This sounds like a very attractive option, I work to SALSA certification so I know about quite high levels of food hygiene, I don't suppose you know any companies or courses that could point me in the right direction to get some more information on this please? 

It really depends on your end goal - I wanted to have my own business and work for myself so got qualified in what I needed. If you want to work for a local authority, or some private companies you may need more qualifications.

 

To train food hygiene you need a Level 4 (used to be called Advanced) Food Safety qualification and a training qualification

To give yourself more options, I would recommend getting a Level 4 Food Safety and a Level 4 Health & Safety qualification (they kind of go together for what you'll need), as well as the training qualification.

 

If you want to inspect for a local authority, then you'll need both the above and then something called a Higher Certificate in Food Premises Inspection  http://www.ehrb.co.uk/higher_certificate_in_food_premises_inspection.html You can then attach yourself to a local authority and do 6 months log book work, which is shadowing an EHO and then apply for permanent or ad-hoc work.

 

For info, my work is about 50/50. I train a couple of days a week and inspect a couple of days a week. I have my own clients and I also work on a freelance basis for some of the big food hygiene/health & safety companies.

 

You'll know about the SALSA audits, most of the auditors are freelance and have the Level 4 qualifications and maybe the food premises inspection certificate.

 

 

 

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17 hours ago, FoxInTheBirstallBox said:

It's better to hear the downsides first than hit them yourself before it's too late lol

 

The job I do is Monday Friday 6 till 5 so I get the personal time I enjoy (which is a draw to teaching too, the hours)

 

17 hours ago, FoxInTheBirstallBox said:

I have always enjoyed teaching others skills and wanting to inspire people into what i do so I felt that teaching could very well be a perfect fit for me

 

 

It used to be the best job in the world, but there's a reason why me and every single teaching friend has left the profession. Class time, actually doing the job is rewarding and a joy - especially if you work with challenging students.

 

Here's your first downer: those hours you think are so appealing? They don't exist. You'll be in the classroom for the best part of ten to eleven hours a day. Then when you get home you'll be working for two to three hours before collapsing into bed. Enjoy weekends? You can forget them during term time. Like the idea of thirteen weeks a year holiday? Yep, it's a joy to be working for free or having to attend courses during 50% of that. The people that tell you it's such a doddle will never do the job. The people who'll tell you their friend/neighbour/auntie/pet dog only works from 9-3 are liars, or have been misled by liars.

 

More downsides: Workloads, constantly shifting curriculums, internal and external inspection regimes bent on finger pointing and shifting blame, inept management (most were shiny-faced 'yesmen' who now discover they should have said 'no' but it's too late), acadamisation, constant cutback to funding in real terms, diminishing pay from the wage freeze, the scrapping of the decent pension, unqualified staff being given responsibility posts, lack of staff leading to constant turnover of supply staff, support staff laid off, no money for resources (prepare to pay for books, pens and stuff for students from your own pocket)... The list goes on.

 

I'm watching a couple of NQTs currently falling apart over the course of this year, their first in the job. I see them twice a week at karate and they have transitioned from happy, smiley idealists into bitter, borderline alcoholics. Heads of departments will give themselves and their mates the best classes for self-preservation, you will get the anarchic ones used to a succession of supply staff, no self-discipline and no support staff.

 

There are exceptions. There are good schools with supportive structures in place - but you'll be up against a wall of other candidates clamouring to get in. There are bad schools where events have bred an blitz mentality, everyone happy to be in it together. But these are exceptions to the rule. The education system isn't on its knees, it had its legs cut off years ago, it's dragging its bloody stumps across the playground.

 

My advice, FWIW, is to try to get into a private school or find another profession. Sorry, I wish I could be more upbeat. If you do go for it then I wish you all the best, by Christ our kids need decent motivated staff.

 

*other people's opinions are available and equally valid.

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On ‎08‎/‎07‎/‎2017 at 16:43, FoxInTheBirstallBox said:

Just a little advice/story thread

Currently a sous chef with 8 years experience and 25 years old, and seeing how the industry where I work in is slowing I'm thinking of a possible career change and I feel teaching is for me, I have a levels in food tech but not university or teaching experience (only teaching the other chefs how to do things at work) 

Does anyone have any experience in changing into a career in teaching without any current higher education? 

 

Teachers facing another year of pay cap:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-40557378

 

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If things had panned out differently I'd now be in the process of trying to get myself on a SCITT course, having not long got my week's classroom experience to get the one remaining box ticked for me to satisfy the entry criteria.

 

Being in the classroom was great, but although I got a lot of encouragement from both folk on the course and newly qualified teachers that had been through it, everyone kept saying how hard work it was. I kept telling myself that I'm no stranger to graft and all, but when I came to research what it actually meant in practice, I basically had to say 'f*** that'.

 

I therefore remain in my current position, where the odds on me murdering my colleagues before turning the gun on myself grow a tiny bit shorter with every day that passes

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On 08/07/2017 at 16:43, FoxInTheBirstallBox said:

Just a little advice/story thread

Currently a sous chef with 8 years experience and 25 years old, and seeing how the industry where I work in is slowing I'm thinking of a possible career change and I feel teaching is for me, I have a levels in food tech but not university or teaching experience (only teaching the other chefs how to do things at work) 

Does anyone have any experience in changing into a career in teaching without any current higher education? 

Take it from someone who is living it. Don't teach!

 

60 hour weeks where your only paid for 38 (not by choice to be either, it's expected.)

 

Pay is shocking and there is endless paper work. Forget the 'holidays' they are just weeks where you do work from home.

 

Parents think it's your responsibility to discipline their kids, and you end up being a councillor, marriage advisor and psychologist on top of your teaching responsibilities.

 

I wouldn't reccomend the job to anyone. Nothing you do is ever good enough and despite the acomplishment and satisfaction of teaching a child something new, the politics and merry go round far outway any positives of the job. 

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Not that i'm trying to persuade you off teaching, I've looked at it at several times, there seems to be far too many hoops to jump through with education and experience and then meeting grading requirements with students at whatever cost. I know a couple of people who went into Teaching and loved it and a couple of people who went into teaching and have since left. 

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21 hours ago, Daggers said:

 

 

It used to be the best job in the world, but there's a reason why me and every single teaching friend has left the profession. Class time, actually doing the job is rewarding and a joy - especially if you work with challenging students.

 

Here's your first downer: those hours you think are so appealing? They don't exist. You'll be in the classroom for the best part of ten to eleven hours a day. Then when you get home you'll be working for two to three hours before collapsing into bed. Enjoy weekends? You can forget them during term time. Like the idea of thirteen weeks a year holiday? Yep, it's a joy to be working for free or having to attend courses during 50% of that. The people that tell you it's such a doddle will never do the job. The people who'll tell you their friend/neighbour/auntie/pet dog only works from 9-3 are liars, or have been misled by liars.

 

More downsides: Workloads, constantly shifting curriculums, internal and external inspection regimes bent on finger pointing and shifting blame, inept management (most were shiny-faced 'yesmen' who now discover they should have said 'no' but it's too late), acadamisation, constant cutback to funding in real terms, diminishing pay from the wage freeze, the scrapping of the decent pension, unqualified staff being given responsibility posts, lack of staff leading to constant turnover of supply staff, support staff laid off, no money for resources (prepare to pay for books, pens and stuff for students from your own pocket)... The list goes on.

 

I'm watching a couple of NQTs currently falling apart over the course of this year, their first in the job. I see them twice a week at karate and they have transitioned from happy, smiley idealists into bitter, borderline alcoholics. Heads of departments will give themselves and their mates the best classes for self-preservation, you will get the anarchic ones used to a succession of supply staff, no self-discipline and no support staff.

 

There are exceptions. There are good schools with supportive structures in place - but you'll be up against a wall of other candidates clamouring to get in. There are bad schools where events have bred an blitz mentality, everyone happy to be in it together. But these are exceptions to the rule. The education system isn't on its knees, it had its legs cut off years ago, it's dragging its bloody stumps across the playground.

 

My advice, FWIW, is to try to get into a private school or find another profession. Sorry, I wish I could be more upbeat. If you do go for it then I wish you all the best, by Christ our kids need decent motivated staff.

 

*other people's opinions are available and equally valid.

DJ summed it up - that was as depressing as anything I've read on here.

 

But I can understand and sympathise with every word and a few more you could doubtless have written.

 

The atmosphere changed drastically in sports coaching - even the relationship between coach and students became a source of suspicion that was never more than rarely apparent when I was young...either as pupil or trainer.

 

Once a national, regional and county coach I suddenly felt as if I were in a sordid profession where people who were simply trying to help and earn a living were suddenly being viewed as potential predators instead of inspirers.

 

Instead of feeling proud to pass on some skills and aspirational attitudes I couldn't wait to get out and leave what seemed like the warped minds of authority to their own agenda.

 

When I read not so long ago, about all the football coaches involved in their unworthy behaviour, I was seriously shocked because in all my time in so many sports as player and teacher, I was never aware of anything untoward going on, save once when I joined a gymnastics club at Leicester YMCA and some clergyman official there tried his luck and got a mouthful he wasn't expecting.           

 

But the clergyman it subsequently seems clear, was just one of many sports teachers or associates who sought to take advantage of their position, no matter the potential consequences for their charges or colleages.  

 

And as the extent of abuse was revealed I wondered who would willingly want to work in teaching environments and under such distasteful scrutiny as a consequence of people who were there to take advantage rather than encourage people to make the best of themselves?

 

The joy of coaching people disappeared entirely for me.

 

How it affected other right-minded sports teachers in various places I can only imagine.   

 

 

       

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2 hours ago, Thracian said:

DJ summed it up - that was as depressing as anything I've read on here.

 

But I can understand and sympathise with every word and a few more you could doubtless have written.

 

The atmosphere changed drastically in sports coaching - even the relationship between coach and students became a source of suspicion that was never more than rarely apparent when I was young...either as pupil or trainer.

 

Once a national, regional and county coach I suddenly felt as if I were in a sordid profession where people who were simply trying to help and earn a living were suddenly being viewed as potential predators instead of inspirers.

 

Instead of feeling proud to pass on some skills and aspirational attitudes I couldn't wait to get out and leave what seemed like the warped minds of authority to their own agenda.

 

When I read not so long ago, about all the football coaches involved in their unworthy behaviour, I was seriously shocked because in all my time in so many sports as player and teacher, I was never aware of anything untoward going on, save once when I joined a gymnastics club at Leicester YMCA and some clergyman official there tried his luck and got a mouthful he wasn't expecting.           

 

But the clergyman it subsequently seems clear, was just one of many sports teachers or associates who sought to take advantage of their position, no matter the potential consequences for their charges or colleages.  

 

And as the extent of abuse was revealed I wondered who would willingly want to work in teaching environments and under such distasteful scrutiny as a consequence of people who were there to take advantage rather than encourage people to make the best of themselves?

 

The joy of coaching people disappeared entirely for me.

 

How it affected other right-minded sports teachers in various places I can only imagine.   

 

 

       

Could've been worded better :thumbup: 

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Guest Mee-9

My few cents.

 

I've spent the last year working as a teaching assistant at an academy (secondary school) and I am just about to embark on a SCITT next year to become a qualified History teacher.

 

Gaining experience will be the most valuable thing you can do before attempting to become a teacher or a qualified one. You will know within a few days whether you will be cut out to teach or not. Some teachers I have worked with are now these bitter, miserable teachers that Daggers mentions, and they forget why they got into the profession, or even what it was like to be a kid at school. 

 

I went into my job in September with the mindset, "remember what it was like to be a kid," and through this I've been able to get so much respect from the kids. Being polite, well mannered and in a sense just a decent human being to these kids makes so much of a difference. Over the past year I've worked with kids who have huge behavioural problems, special educational needs and to get positive reactions from these sorts of children make the job so worth it. 

 

I see Daggers' points in many ways, the workload doesn't stop. Yeah you seem like you work 9-3:30 or so, but the reality is you'll spend a large portion of your life planning lessons. But yeah, although this seems like a bad thing you'll be inevitably doing this for the benefit of the kids. I also agree with his points on senior management. In schools nowadays there seems to be so many people wearing the same hats, earning fortunes for doing what appears very little. But thats the way education has gone, since the shift to academies, they are now businesses first, schools second it appears in some senses. 

 

The problem at the moment with subjects such as Food Tech, and other subjects classes as Design Technology is that the powers that be don't favour them. At the moment they are subject to a lot of scrutiny and in some senses are trying to be dropped in favour of other subjects. Read up on 'Progress 8' or the EBACC qualification. 

 

The thing to remember is that teaching is a career. If you are passionate and positive, then give it a go. There are many different routes into teaching now, PGCE, SCITT, unqualified teaching etc. You can choose a route which you can help fit around your lifestyle and circumstances.

 

You have to remember like in any job, you'll have bad days. These bad days and lessons will make you a better teacher if you're willing to learn from your mistakes. 

 

My advice is to definitely get experience. Within a year I've gone from being at an all-time low post-university, to taking the steps to becoming a teacher. Something I never thought would happen after my degree grade. 

 

If you need anything mate, drop me a message. 

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On 7/10/2017 at 16:08, Daggers said:

 

 

It used to be the best job in the world, but there's a reason why me and every single teaching friend has left the profession. Class time, actually doing the job is rewarding and a joy - especially if you work with challenging students.

 

Here's your first downer: those hours you think are so appealing? They don't exist. You'll be in the classroom for the best part of ten to eleven hours a day. Then when you get home you'll be working for two to three hours before collapsing into bed. Enjoy weekends? You can forget them during term time. Like the idea of thirteen weeks a year holiday? Yep, it's a joy to be working for free or having to attend courses during 50% of that. The people that tell you it's such a doddle will never do the job. The people who'll tell you their friend/neighbour/auntie/pet dog only works from 9-3 are liars, or have been misled by liars.

 

More downsides: Workloads, constantly shifting curriculums, internal and external inspection regimes bent on finger pointing and shifting blame, inept management (most were shiny-faced 'yesmen' who now discover they should have said 'no' but it's too late), acadamisation, constant cutback to funding in real terms, diminishing pay from the wage freeze, the scrapping of the decent pension, unqualified staff being given responsibility posts, lack of staff leading to constant turnover of supply staff, support staff laid off, no money for resources (prepare to pay for books, pens and stuff for students from your own pocket)... The list goes on.

 

I'm watching a couple of NQTs currently falling apart over the course of this year, their first in the job. I see them twice a week at karate and they have transitioned from happy, smiley idealists into bitter, borderline alcoholics. Heads of departments will give themselves and their mates the best classes for self-preservation, you will get the anarchic ones used to a succession of supply staff, no self-discipline and no support staff.

 

There are exceptions. There are good schools with supportive structures in place - but you'll be up against a wall of other candidates clamouring to get in. There are bad schools where events have bred an blitz mentality, everyone happy to be in it together. But these are exceptions to the rule. The education system isn't on its knees, it had its legs cut off years ago, it's dragging its bloody stumps across the playground.

 

My advice, FWIW, is to try to get into a private school or find another profession. Sorry, I wish I could be more upbeat. If you do go for it then I wish you all the best, by Christ our kids need decent motivated staff.

 

*other people's opinions are available and equally valid.

Agree 100%. In just under a decade I've seen my profession turn to shit. It makes me so angry. The government have serviced the national debt by basically selling off most kids futures- it's quite disgusting. Education is ****ed.

 

I did a calculation the other day and my budget for next year equates to just under £3.00 per child. Record levels of investment? **** off.

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