A cashless, ticketless society...

[SkidsFox]

7 hours ago, Parafox said:

My bugbear is Chinese takeaways and our local chippy (owned by Chinese). There's none that I use (only 2 or 3) that will accept card payments. I do wonder if it's some sort of tax avoidance scam as cash payments can be hidden.

Not saying it's only Chinese places BTW. Hand car washes never take card payments, in my experience. 

It does seem strange. I even know Chinese takeaways that only take cash in the shop, yet sell online via Deliveroo or Justeat. Maybe they have a Chinese bank setup that isn't geared up for card payments, yet can work with the online delivery folk?

[Dahnsouff]

Pandemics make it more likely and sensible, although I see the strain it places on the elderly or more vulnerable.

[marbles]

Went to a concert a few years ago.  Paid for the tickets online a month in advance.  Once I paid, it asked for me to enter a number from a state issued ID - I used my DL number.

When I went to the concert, I didn’t have to carry my phone or wallet.  Only my ID (which you are required by law to carry).  They scanned it and in I went.

 

I see the system working like that eventually.  

[marbles]

6 hours ago, dsr-burnley said:

Physical security is very different between cash and cards/phone. If someone steals £10 notes from my pocket, the amount I can lose is limited to the value of the notes. With the contactless devices now available, I could lose a lot more than that if I lose my phone or cards. 

Don’t know how it is where you live - but in the states, a simple call to my bank will have the money put back in my account.

So, if your cash is stolen it’s gone for good.  If your card is stolen, it’s a phone call.

[davieG]

10 hours ago, grobyfox1990 said:

Yeh it makes a lot of sense tbf. Cash can be stolen and is expensive to handle and process. Only negative with card only is you have to declare it all 

Plenty of money is stolen online and probably bigger numbers.

[StanSP]

20 hours ago, Captain... said:

Happy with it being the default, but there always needs to facilities in place for people who don't have the necessary technology or a back up plan when there are technical issues.

Pretty much this. 

 

Sensible all round. 

[BKLFox]

8 hours ago, dsr-burnley said:

Physical security is very different between cash and cards/phone. If someone steals £10 notes from my pocket, the amount I can lose is limited to the value of the notes. With the contactless devices now available, I could lose a lot more than that if I lose my phone or cards. 

But any perp would need to have your face or pin to be able to make a purchase with your phone, if they take your wallet you have lost the cash instantly and they can use the chip n pin on your card to their hearts content, until blocked.

i will assume that anyone carrying cash for a night out will also carry their card unless they taking serious cash with them, in which case it wouldn’t just be a tenner lost.

[Soup]

9 hours ago, foxes21 said:

 

 

 

Give the man a gun and he can rob a Bank, but give a man a Bank and he can rob the world.

 

Central Bank Digital Currency (CBDC) is coming worldwide and if we accept it then I fear for our future generations. CBDC will be introduced as an alternative to the inflated, depreciating currencies (in particular the world reserve currency) and everyone will of course jump on it. 

 

Rishi Sunak recently revealed the govts plans to look into CBDC as did Jerome Powell of the federal reserve. Infact most countries around the world are planning to implement CBDC.  

 

Here is why CBDC is a major concern:

 

Central Bank Digital Currency will allow the govt to insert programmable smart contracts through the API into the banking systems digital wallet, to stop you from paying for activities that are deemed 'socially harmful' eg: buying too much oil. I wonder if the elite class will suffer from the same restrictions and be forced to stop flying around in their private jets . The issue here is who gets to deem what is socially harmful? These programmable smart contracts are virtually limitless in terms of control. Oh you were at a protest last weekend the govt don't agree with? Didn't comply with our latest regulation/mandate? Let's just freeze your wallet. Sorry according to our smart contracts you've reached your limit on meat consumption this week, unfortunately we can't process your payment (meanwhile Prince Charles is eating a grass fed steak). Please spend the digital tokens we just transferred to your account within the next 30 days. But only in shops within a 10 mile radius.

 

It's basically the Chinese social credit score system on steroids . There are some positives however, as it would help reduce crime, fraud, create automated money laundering checks, etc. 

 

But ultimately it will be a rule for thee not for me system like no other and whilst we're making all these sacrifices, the CEOs, billionaires, royals, politicians and most powerful amongst us will continue to pollute and do as they please. Meanwhile, we will be at the mercy of this new financial system.

 

The BRIC countries plans to develop a new reserve currency and challenge the US Dollar, will only make this transition to CBDC quicker.

 

9 hours ago, He aint bald said:

Some of that could be implemented nowish if there was a will, as in the China examples but in an intergrated system, shiit, the potential is scary 

 

Probably a cashless society will just trample its way in though, with little thought to things like

 

The tracking and data collection which is already happening.... 

 

Security safeguards, tish and pish, loads will get life savings stolen (happens now where I am with murders and kidnappings to buy time to drain accounts) or more lijely in my case, drunkenly spent.

A ring fenced central account where you transfer into a current virtual fund and set limits, in an actual physical bank like place, might be an idea.

 

Accessability. some might be aware that I dont want to be chained to expensive life style gadgets, simple cards or devices for swiping etc please

 

EDIT  suppose the CDBC thing make make emptying accounts harder if you or the kidnappers are trying to spend it on unhealthy stuff,. Could save Man U in the future though if they pay for a football AI overwatcher?

 

 

 

 

 

Both very interesting posts guys. For me the way it's being rushed through and seemingly happening without any real conversation about it is concerning. 

 

But I'll not worry about that today, the sun is shining and as yet I don't think there's any plans to digitise that 🙂

[grobyfox1990]

50 minutes ago, davieG said:

Plenty of money is stolen online and probably bigger numbers.

I was about why shops wouldn’t accept cash, stolen from the tills, expensive to handle it and process 

[The Syrup]

My dad bought one of those SumUp card payment keypads for his market stall that he has a couple of days a week. Seems a growing number of people are going to markets and car boots without cash these days. They only cost about £25 to buy and take 1.6% per transaction as a fee. Sales at his stall have gone up a lot since he has the option of card payments.

[Monk]

7 hours ago, SkidsFox said:

It does seem strange. I even know Chinese takeaways that only take cash in the shop, yet sell online via Deliveroo or Justeat. Maybe they have a Chinese bank setup that isn't geared up for card payments, yet can work with the online delivery folk?

Maybe or maybe they just don’t pay any tax

[davieG]

1 hour ago, grobyfox1990 said:

I was about why shops wouldn’t accept cash, stolen from the tills, expensive to handle it and process 

Aye, fact is your money's not 100% safe wherever you keep it. The world is full of shysters.

 

I say that as I've just received a fake email with a link to my bank credit card, looked very genuine even including the warning that the bank would never send an email with a link to your account.

[Parafox]

8 minutes ago, davieG said:

Aye, fact is your money's not 100% safe wherever you keep it. The world is full of shysters.

 

I say that as I've just received a fake email with a link to my bank credit card, looked very genuine even including the warning that the bank would never send an email with a link to your account.

How much did you inherit from your rich 3rd cousin in Capetown?

[fuchsntf]

21 hours ago, Sampson said:

If you go to some European countries like Sweden or the Netherlands they are essentially cashless societies already, cash points have been done away with and most places actively refuse to take cash nowadays.

 

It’s inevitable really. I guess the biggest argument from the governments point of view is it makes it harder to get away with tax dodging and undeclared cash in hand work. Though I’m not sure if that outweighs the challenges it causes the elderly and vulnerable.

The Problem is...für companies leading the way, are still Technical inept, in producing Amy decent backup, or decent Customer service...

The society isnt as Advanced as some will have us,especially...

A).inwards in Technical competence at normal secure system-maintainance

B) outwards in any secure,comfortable,helpfull service...

 

Pushing it,hoping it will eventually work, is how politicians work...Not how One should integrate science/Technology into the Status quo for their dependant

ways of living...

I mean ffs, Not every School, or Child have Access to modern techbnology,or leave Scholl understand how to confirm & become the average user....

Same false misconception,that majority of society can do home office....

I myself spend most  my Working life & pastime..( Except Adventure getting lost-travels&expeditions) .in Technical test-research & technical troubleshooting.

Outside ex  Work Collegues most of my friends/family/aquaintances, had/have nothing to do with even Bank/home-pc/ I-phones/ etc...

My Wife no interest, my 4 children however all in Technical jobs, using Technical IT-equipment at work, in home direct or indirect..

Whether Africa,Asia or Europe, One can walk down the street go into a Building & find a dozen, 50,100 Technical-nous group of people, go into the Next 2 Building Or Cross the street One find a dozen,50,100, who are just Not associated or Rub up to anyy Technical use or even conflict..

Even Big city busy streets...!  Amazing what One often comes when telephoning or visiting....end-used areas.

Or People who actually have the best phones,But outside basics...have/use no 2nd extra set-ups...Then 10Yards further hip-kids & grannies who know-everything.

 

Too many know-alls, looking but Not seeing...

[SpacedX]

22 hours ago, rachhere said:

Not a fan. In general I hate how reliant society is becoming on phones these days. Like many I am sure we have several systems at work which can't be accessed without phone authorisation, and of course we have to provide our own phones... It's quite frustrating when you are trying to access your teaching material  (having already had to login to the computer) and the system is asking you to use google authenticate to verify your identity first...yet you are in a lecture room with no phone reception and very unreliable wifi. 

I feel your pain. Periodically, having to validate your access to systems through a password sent by SMS and you can't get reception in the basement/bowels of an old building constructed in 1923. Unfortunately, since universities are subject to something in the region of fifty cyber attacks/hacking attempts a day, these security measures are essential. 

[davieG]

40 minutes ago, Parafox said:

How much did you inherit from your rich 3rd cousin in Capetown?

I think I was had!