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Trav Le Bleu

Also In The News - part 3

By Trav Le Bleu, in General Chat

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David Hankey

David Hankey

Posted
Posted

Apparently their Lordships Mandelson & Bliar knew about the dodgy 'Horizon' system but both waived it through.

 

As I have said before it is not just Royal Mail/Post Office personnel who should be investigated but politicians as well.

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grth2004

grth2004

Posted
Posted
On 12/01/2024 at 20:44, David Hankey said:

Apparently their Lordships Mandelson & Bliar knew about the dodgy 'Horizon' system but both waived it through.

 

As I have said before it is not just Royal Mail/Post Office personnel who should be investigated but politicians as well.

Where did you read that ? I struggle to believe Blair knew about it and did nothing but I may be wrong. I think it’s only in the last ten years the truth has been leaking out from what I’ve read. 

Izzy

Izzy

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, grth2004 said:

Where did you read that ? I struggle to believe Blair knew about it and did nothing but I may be wrong. I think it’s only in the last ten years the truth has been leaking out from what I’ve read. 

Tony Blair was warned Horizon IT system could be flawed, documents show

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67941495

WigstonWanderer

WigstonWanderer

Posted
Posted (edited)

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/jan/13/abuse-of-unaccountable-power-at-wicked-heart-of-post-office-scandal
 

This is a similar story to what happened in Australia with RoboDebt where innocent welfare claimants received demands to repay money and several committed suicide due to a rogue computer system and authorities in denial. Imagine how much worse this sort of thing is going to be with AI. Bound to be many more autonomous systems which people will find very difficult to hold to account in the event of problems.

 

Must watch the TV dramatisation.

Edited by WigstonWanderer
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grth2004

grth2004

Posted
Posted
9 hours ago, Izzy said:

Tony Blair was warned Horizon IT system could be flawed, documents show

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67941495

There was no indication at this stage that the Horizon software would lead to wrongful accusations of theft but there were concerns about its reliability and ballooning cost.
 

as I thought , it wasn’t until the last ten years that people started to realise the scale of what was happening. 

David Hankey

David Hankey

Posted
Posted
19 hours ago, grth2004 said:

Where did you read that ? I struggle to believe Blair knew about it and did nothing but I may be wrong. I think it’s only in the last ten years the truth has been leaking out from what I’ve read. 

You will appreciate the 'Horizon' system was introduced by the Royal Mail/Post Office in 1998/9 when New Labour were in power. 

 

That Government sanctioned it's imposition despite having some reservations. Mandelson signed it off and it was soon after that problems with the system began.

 

"The last 10 years is a myth".

 

Don't just take my word for it, my wife was a sub-postmistress from 1992 to 2006.

grth2004

grth2004

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, David Hankey said:

You will appreciate the 'Horizon' system was introduced by the Royal Mail/Post Office in 1998/9 when New Labour were in power. 

 

That Government sanctioned it's imposition despite having some reservations. Mandelson signed it off and it was soon after that problems with the system began.

 

"The last 10 years is a myth".

 

Don't just take my word for it, my wife was a sub-postmistress from 1992 to 2006.

Sorry but just because Labour were in power when it was installed doesn’t mean much to me , it’s when it was discovered it was faulty and was covered up which was a few years later. Probably still a Labour government then Tory , but the main issue was the Post office and Horizon covering it up which was disgusting. Let’s hope the truth comes out now finally. 

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grth2004

grth2004

Posted
Posted
On 12/01/2024 at 20:44, David Hankey said:

Apparently their Lordships Mandelson & Bliar knew about the dodgy 'Horizon' system but both waived it through.

 

As I have said before it is not just Royal Mail/Post Office personnel who should be investigated but politicians as well.

Fujitsu handed £3.6billion in Government contracts on Rishi Sunak's watch - AFTER a court ruled its botched Horizon IT system was at the heart of the Post Office scandal

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Daggers

Daggers

Posted
  • Popular Post
Posted
4 minutes ago, grth2004 said:

Fujitsu handed £3.6billion in Government contracts on Rishi Sunak's watch - AFTER a court ruled its botched Horizon IT system was at the heart of the Post Office scandal

Yeh, but something something Labour something Blair something something Corbyn something something terror something Kid Starver something something as bad as each other something bollocks. 

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grth2004

grth2004

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, Daggers said:

Yeh, but something something Labour something Blair something something Corbyn something something terror something Kid Starver something something as bad as each other something bollocks. 

Actually it was Neil Kinnock 

Daggers

Daggers

Posted
Posted
54 minutes ago, grth2004 said:

Actually it was Neil Kinnock 

Something something fall in sea something can’t eat burgers something something improved education funding someth…damn. It went wrong there towards the end. 

Jon the Hat

Jon the Hat

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, grth2004 said:

Sorry but just because Labour were in power when it was installed doesn’t mean much to me , it’s when it was discovered it was faulty and was covered up which was a few years later. Probably still a Labour government then Tory , but the main issue was the Post office and Horizon covering it up which was disgusting. Let’s hope the truth comes out now finally. 

They all happily ignored it until they couldn't.

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Jon the Hat

Jon the Hat

Posted
Posted
38 minutes ago, ithuriel said:

Do not know if already posted but this popped up on Youtube.

 

As I said before, I think there must have been a culture of believing there was a lot of fraud for them to almost gleefully prosecute so many.  They thought they finally had the evidence to catch the bastards!  I am sure there were some genuine cases in their as well, bound to be with that many people, but to use this as a basis to effectively imply thy should not all have their prosecutions quashed and have to start again is pretty horrendous.

Daggers

Daggers

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Jon the Hat said:

They all happily ignored it until they couldn't.

I’m going to hazard a guess that you’re a fan of the concept of smaller government…and yet here you are suggesting government micromanages. 
 

Blair is and never was a software engineer: “He said the system had been ‘thoroughly evaluated by independent experts’ who pronounced it ‘viable, robust and of a design which should accommodate future technological developments’.” Relying on the advice of experts ≠ ignoring something.

 

Alarm bells began ringing in 2009/2010. There is a clear cut off here over who should have been getting their arse into gear and when they should’ve been doing it. To suggest “they all” bear responsibility is completely wrong. This is on the Tories.

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Otis

Otis

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Daggers said:

I’m going to hazard a guess that you’re a fan of the concept of smaller government…and yet here you are suggesting government micromanages. 
 

Blair is and never was a software engineer: “He said the system had been ‘thoroughly evaluated by independent experts’ who pronounced it ‘viable, robust and of a design which should accommodate future technological developments’.” Relying on the advice of experts ≠ ignoring something.

 

Alarm bells began ringing in 2009/2010. There is a clear cut off here over who should have been getting their arse into gear and when they should’ve been doing it. To suggest “they all” bear responsibility is completely wrong. This is on the Tories.

Labour were in power during 2009 and half of 2010.

 

It's actually on the Post Office. 

Daggers

Daggers

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, Otis said:

Labour were in power during 2009 and half of 2010.

 

It's actually on the Post Office. 

I’d respond to this if I believed you’d understand it.

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David Hankey

David Hankey

Posted
Posted
13 hours ago, grth2004 said:

Fujitsu handed £3.6billion in Government contracts on Rishi Sunak's watch - AFTER a court ruled its botched Horizon IT system was at the heart of the Post Office scandal

I don't understand why you are trying to make this into some party political knockabout.

 

I was attempting to put the facts to you that the system was introduced in 1998/99 and although Bliar had reservations it was still rolled out.

 

Soon after flaws in the system were known but it didn't matter as every sub-postmaster by that time had signed to say they would make up any shortfall irrespective of how that discrepancy had been arrived at. So it has just been a "last 10 years" as you eluded to it has been going on for two decades!!

 

I have said successive Governments and politicians of all shades cannot hold their heads up high.

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Otis

Otis

Posted
Posted
52 minutes ago, Daggers said:

I’d respond to this if I believed you’d understand it.

I understand dates.

Dunge

Dunge

Posted
Posted (edited)

I’m more suspicious of parts of the Conservative Party than the party as a whole for this. More than one Conservative MP tried to take Paula Vannells to task for this, yet from the other hand came an honour. Given that she’s not exactly a wealthy donor*, it suggests more that the left hand doesn’t know what the right is doing.

 

But even then, to me this just wasn’t high enough up the priority list for anyone to do anything about it. It was an inconvenience that government wanted to go away. They didn’t want to have to deal with the fallout of a scandal at the Post Office. It’s only happening now because of an excellently-made drama and a desperate party in an election year.

 

 

*Just figured I’ve made this assertion but don’t know for sure.

Edited by Dunge
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