Question for tradespeople

[Jattdogg]

6 hours ago, danny. said:

The whole industry desperately needs some regulation. You don't need any kind of formal qualification needed to call yourself a trades, other than the schemes for Gas Safe and Electrical work. So I could start advertising that I'm a roofer tomorrow and take on work without having a clue what I'm doing. There needs to be some regulation in terms of practices too, it's insane we have an industry where people can take 10,000s in deposits and stage payments and then just disappear.

Same bollocks exists over here. Word of mouth reviews from neighbours and family have never failed me.  You will get the occasional one but its better than raw dogging it

 

Edited 19 November 2025 by Jattdogg

[splinterdream]

16 hours ago, danny. said:

I’ve got to pick up on that. I don’t have a massive experience with minority ethnic trades other than some windows we had done by an Asian company. They did a terrible job and didn’t speak English on site including in front of us and I was fairly sure it wasn’t great stuff they were saying from their facial expressions and body language. They hated me pointing out the work that was wrong (and it really was bad, like 5cm out in measurements and bodged out of plumb and square to fit). 
 

BUT, the next set of windows we had were all white trades people. They were awful. They came recommended and were so bad they took 14 months snagging, had to replace some windows and doors three times because they couldn’t use a tape measure and actually went out of business shortly after they finished at ours presumably because they sucked at installing windows and wasted so much money everywhere. 
 

I’ve used plasterers, electricians, joiners, plumbers etc who have been white and all shockingly bad at their trades. 
 

It’s not a race thing, the quality of trades in the U.K. is just abysmal. I’m sure some are great but the majority want £500/day for 5 hours of garbage work. Best to do stuff yourself if physically able. 

 

You'd be amazed how much it costs to run a business in the trades

[adam1]

20 hours ago, Parafox said:

Well I'm not risking a ban by going into detail.

Pies and Keys. Terrible combination. Will leave you with all sorts of issues. Stomach cramps etc.

[winteriscoming]

You could try going to builders merchants local to yourself and see if they recommend anyone. 
Some do and some don’t obviously if there’s any issues but it’s worth a try. 

[danny.]

1 hour ago, splinterdream said:

 

You'd be amazed how much it costs to run a business in the trades

Having ran businesses for >20 years I probably wouldn’t. What does that have to do with anything I said though?

[Dahnsouff]

Check a trade works for me. If they are bad, people see it and they lose business, but if they are good people see it, and they get business.

Simple.

[UniFox21]

5 hours ago, danny. said:

The whole industry desperately needs some regulation. You don't need any kind of formal qualification needed to call yourself a trades, other than the schemes for Gas Safe and Electrical work. So I could start advertising that I'm a roofer tomorrow and take on work without having a clue what I'm doing. There needs to be some regulation in terms of practices too, it's insane we have an industry where people can take 10,000s in deposits and stage payments and then just disappear.

There's an equivalent for plumbers, watersafe i think it's called. 

[kenny]

8 hours ago, Grebfromgrebland said:

As @Izzy is doing get a builder to project manage the job and it will run more smoothly. It'll cost a bit more but it's far less hassle and you have one point of contact.

 

There's a good chance the whole team has worked together previously and know how to get things done right.

I was going to say the same. @Izzy is the client, but the main builder is the source of repeat work. So the subbies won't mess them around like they would a homeowner.

 

The issue for most tradesman is that working for a homeowner is a single job that has no follow-on. Working for a main 'builder' is repeat work so will always take preference.

 

And they are disorganised, really disorganised.

[danny.]

18 minutes ago, UniFox21 said:

There's an equivalent for plumbers, watersafe i think it's called. 

Yea, and there are other schemes I believe for a few trades. But as far as I know it’s only gas and electric you need a qualification for? Anything else you can just say you are something and start trading. 

[splinterdream]

1 hour ago, danny. said:

Having ran businesses for >20 years I probably wouldn’t. What does that have to do with anything I said though?

You said that trades want £500 a day.

Yes they do, because as I know, when you break down the costs, that's what you need to earn to make a living. Now some trades are more costly to be in than others, Gas is certainly very expensive. The cost of living situation has just caused business costs to go up and up

[Parafox]

19 hours ago, danny. said:

I’ve got to pick up on that. I don’t have a massive experience with minority ethnic trades other than some windows we had done by an Asian company. They did a terrible job and didn’t speak English on site including in front of us and I was fairly sure it wasn’t great stuff they were saying from their facial expressions and body language. They hated me pointing out the work that was wrong (and it really was bad, like 5cm out in measurements and bodged out of plumb and square to fit). 
 

BUT, the next set of windows we had were all white trades people. They were awful. They came recommended and were so bad they took 14 months snagging, had to replace some windows and doors three times because they couldn’t use a tape measure and actually went out of business shortly after they finished at ours presumably because they sucked at installing windows and wasted so much money everywhere. 
 

I’ve used plasterers, electricians, joiners, plumbers etc who have been white and all shockingly bad at their trades. 
 

It’s not a race thing, the quality of trades in the U.K. is just abysmal. I’m sure some are great but the majority want £500/day for 5 hours of garbage work. Best to do stuff yourself if physically able. 

 

I wasn't referring to ethnicity by colour.

 

More the white Irish that claim ethnic minority status.

 

As mentioned by @adam1 above.

Edited 19 November 2025 by Parafox

[danny.]

4 hours ago, splinterdream said:

You said that trades want £500 a day.

Yes they do, because as I know, when you break down the costs, that's what you need to earn to make a living. Now some trades are more costly to be in than others, Gas is certainly very expensive. The cost of living situation has just caused business costs to go up and up

Well I said for 5 hours actually, most people have to work closer to 8 a day. But if that’s all they work in a day then that’s 10k a month. For trades like a plasterer or joiner the regular overheads are minimal so that’s well above what is needed to earn a living. My point really was, though, that often for that £500 the work is shoddy and no better than DIY standard, in my experience. 

[danny.]

3 hours ago, Parafox said:

 

I wasn't referring to ethnicity by colour.

 

More the white Irish that claim ethnic minority status.

 

As mentioned by @adam1 above.

Fair enough, I apologise for reading into that wrongly. 

[JonnyBoy]

20 hours ago, splinterdream said:

You said that trades want £500 a day.

Yes they do, because as I know, when you break down the costs, that's what you need to earn to make a living. Now some trades are more costly to be in than others, Gas is certainly very expensive. The cost of living situation has just caused business costs to go up and up

 

It is a guess how much most charge, their day rate is wrapped up in an overall quote every time I have used them recently. Could be charging me £500 a day labour for all i know. A lot are funny about offering a full breakdown of their quote. 

[CornwallFox]

We seem to be in a situation where they want to charge doctor or lawyer rates for jobs that hundreds of thousands of them exist to do. They charge like they're scarce when they aren't.

 

Not all of them, of course, so apologies to any that none of this applies to but many are terrible businessmen. You see tradies on social media showing how they've smashed up the bathroom of a non payer, egged on by other tradies, and wonder who they think will use their services. Not that it's right to not be paid but it's hardly a good look for potential customers. 

 

Another thing I saw on social media is a customer had initially agreed to have the work videoed and put on social media, but changed their mind after the job. They posted it anyway and again other tradies supported them and I thought to myself, that's a customer that might have been really happy with your work but now they won't use you again and will give you poor word of mouth reviews. It's stupidity. 

 

Plus, and sorry but it's true, lots of them pretend their spouses work for the company, claim things on expenses that aren't for business, lots take cash in hand, and many basically don't pay their proper taxes. Some will even defend that by saying they don't get holiday pay, well no, you include that in your pricing, it's called running a business. As a PAYE employee, that doesn't make me very impressed. 

 

To reiterate, I'm not saying all tradesmen do these things. I'm saying too many do.

Edited 20 November 2025 by CornwallFox

[Zear0]

19 minutes ago, CornwallFox said:

We seem to be in a situation where they want to charge doctor or lawyer rates for jobs that hundreds of thousands of them exist to do. They charge like they're scarce when they aren't.

 

Not all of them, of course, so apologies to any that none of this applies to but many are terrible businessmen. You see tradies on social media showing how they've smashed up the bathroom of a non payer, egged on by other tradies, and wonder who they think will use their services. Not that it's right to not be paid but it's hardly a good look for potential customers. 

 

Another thing I saw on social media is a customer had initially agreed to have the work videoed and put on social media, but changed their mind after the job. They posted it anyway and again other tradies supported them and I thought to myself, that's a customer that might have been really happy with your work but now they won't use you again and will give you poor word of mouth reviews. It's stupidity. 

 

Plus, and sorry but it's true, lots of them pretend their spouses work for the company, claim things on expenses that aren't for business, lots take cash in hand, and many basically don't pay their proper taxes. Some will even defend that by saying they don't get holiday pay, well no, you include that in your pricing, it's called running a business. As a PAYE employee, that doesn't make me very impressed. 

 

To reiterate, I'm not saying all tradesmen do these things. I'm saying too many do.

Seeing as many are technicians pretending to be engineers it's hardly a surprise.

[Chris_OGrady]

1 hour ago, CornwallFox said:

We seem to be in a situation where they want to charge doctor or lawyer rates for jobs that hundreds of thousands of them exist to do. They charge like they're scarce when they aren't.

 

Not all of them, of course, so apologies to any that none of this applies to but many are terrible businessmen. You see tradies on social media showing how they've smashed up the bathroom of a non payer, egged on by other tradies, and wonder who they think will use their services. Not that it's right to not be paid but it's hardly a good look for potential customers. 

 

Another thing I saw on social media is a customer had initially agreed to have the work videoed and put on social media, but changed their mind after the job. They posted it anyway and again other tradies supported them and I thought to myself, that's a customer that might have been really happy with your work but now they won't use you again and will give you poor word of mouth reviews. It's stupidity. 

 

Plus, and sorry but it's true, lots of them pretend their spouses work for the company, claim things on expenses that aren't for business, lots take cash in hand, and many basically don't pay their proper taxes. Some will even defend that by saying they don't get holiday pay, well no, you include that in your pricing, it's called running a business. As a PAYE employee, that doesn't make me very impressed. 

 

To reiterate, I'm not saying all tradesmen do these things. I'm saying too many do.

If a tradesman came round to your house and quoted you for a job which was say £3k, and you had the opportunity to not pay VAT (an additional £600), would you turn down that offer because it would conflict with your political outlook?

[Zear0]

1 hour ago, Chris_OGrady said:

If a tradesman came round to your house and quoted you for a job which was say £3k, and you had the opportunity to not pay VAT (an additional £600), would you turn down that offer because it would conflict with your political outlook?

Fair point. I've also found taking things from shop shelves and walking straight out to be effective too. 

[Parafox]

1 hour ago, Chris_OGrady said:

If a tradesman came round to your house and quoted you for a job which was say £3k, and you had the opportunity to not pay VAT (an additional £600), would you turn down that offer because it would conflict with your political outlook?

Bank Account

[splinterdream]

4 hours ago, JonnyBoy said:

 

It is a guess how much most charge, their day rate is wrapped up in an overall quote every time I have used them recently. Could be charging me £500 a day labour for all i know. A lot are funny about offering a full breakdown of their quote. 

Generally because customers don't understand how much it costs to run the business. If I quote for a new boiler, why should I break down the quote? If you don't like the price you'll go elsewhere, if i did break down the costs, you'd be like, why are you charging me £500 ! day? Because I need to pay for gas safe reg, ACS certification 5 yearly, analyser calibration, gas sniffer calibration, tools, uniform, diesel, van, van maintenance, van insurance, public liability, training days, holiday, sickness, I.T. equipment and software, pension, telephone costs, advertising, time spent working you arent on the tools, thats before you draw your wages, and lets remember the govt wants their cut.

Edited 20 November 2025 by splinterdream

[CornwallFox]

2 hours ago, Chris_OGrady said:

If a tradesman came round to your house and quoted you for a job which was say £3k, and you had the opportunity to not pay VAT (an additional £600), would you turn down that offer because it would conflict with your political outlook?

I wouldn't claim it was something it wasn't so VAT didn't apply

[CornwallFox]

35 minutes ago, splinterdream said:

Generally because customers don't understand how much it costs to run the business. If I quote for a new boiler, why should I break down the quote? If you don't like the price you'll go elsewhere, if i did break down the costs, you'd be like, why are you charging me £500 ! day? Because I need to pay for gas safe reg, ACS certification 5 yearly, analyser calibration, gas sniffer calibration, tools, uniform, diesel, van, van maintenance, van insurance, public liability, training days, holiday, sickness, I.T. equipment and software, pension, telephone costs, advertising, time spent working you arent on the tools, thats before you draw your wages, and lets remember the govt wants their cut.

Out of interest, what do you reckon the total annual cost of all that is? Just cos I literally have zero idea if the kinds of costs associated.

[splinterdream]

1 hour ago, CornwallFox said:

Out of interest, what do you reckon the total annual cost of all that is? Just cos I literally have zero idea if the kinds of costs associated.

My total expenditure has varied over the years from around £50-£75k I reckon, I’m only a sole trader, but that doesn’t take into account time off where you earn nothing, I’m also an old school gas fitter so trade slows a lot in the summer, I make 2 thirds of my money through the winter. When I started working for myself 14 years ago, many already doing it said you needed to earn £300 a day. It is scary when you break down everything. Lockdown 1 cost me £20k, as my company is Ltd, very little support from the govt, it’s a roller coaster that’s for sure

[LCFCJohn]

For gas and electric, we have guys who are based in our village. There’s something reassuring about seeing their vans round the place and on their own driveways (I am not advocating banging their doors down, but it makes them visible and trustworthy).

 

The biggest issue we had with the electrician was getting him to take payment! 

[LCFCJohn]

On 19/11/2025 at 17:33, Dahnsouff said:

Check a trade works for me. If they are bad, people see it and they lose business, but if they are good people see it, and they get business.

Simple.

Interesting. As per my post above, for gas and electric, we use local guys in our village.

 

But I put in the ‘houses’ thread about getting an extension recently and mentioned in passing that the preferred builder I have found was sourced from CheckaTrade and a couple of people picked up on that and warned against. As far as I was concerned, they have been very helpful and responsive, and have provided a very detailed quote, itemised down to everything you could think of. It has almost made me doubt them even though my own gut instinct is good. I think the best think, which is good practice anyway, is that I will just ask the guy I am in touch with to direct me to any similar jobs done locally.

 

What sort of level jobs have you sourced via there?