Ultra Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 There will be a lot of City players and fans unable to see the joke. Care to explain what's funny?
Thracian Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 I'd love for you to explain how "This is not racism whatever has been said" and what you meant by it's not a "big deal" if not to take away from the seriousness of it. Maybe if you clarified then you couldn't accuse me of putting words in your mouth. Your accusation that everyone who disagrees with you is a reactionary on some sort of bandwagon is bizzare considering you know very little about most of the people that disagree with you. I'm not juming on any bandwagon but I happen to believe that racism is unacceptable even on a football pitch. It seems that you think that sometimes racism is acceptable or that if it's said in retaliation it's not racism for some reason. The fact is that IF Tiatto made a racist comment then he chose to make that comment rather then react in any other way. We can argue about whether racism is different to other predjudice but the general consensus in the world (and in football) is that it's not acceptable. I don't think that when black players spearhead the Kick-it-Out campaign they are on a bandwagon, probobly just sick of it. Kicking people and whatever else in football is something most pro's accept is part and parcel of the game but racism (like headbutting or biting) is something that isn't and shouldn't be accepted. The fact is that whatever way you're putting and whatever labels you're trying to put on me your previous posts have given the impression (and not just to me and crazy bandwagon) that you don't think racism is that bad in some contexts. I'm glad you've never been a racist, well done, but tolerating it in others isn't acceptable either in my book. You're right that you can't just make racism disappear but that isn't the point here. You can punish people for it and make it clear it's not welcome in football especially from people who are inevitably (rightly or wrongly) rolemodels for a younger generation. It might not solve it on it's own but it's also only a part of wider programmes to reduce/remove racism in our society...I thought that was something most people were on board with, maybe not. The whole debate is pointless because what's been quoted as having been said wasn't racism - it's only being labelled as racism by people who want to further their campaign. And that's what I have against the campaign in general - if people can't contrive things to act on there wouldn't be a campaign, so campaign supporters just exagerrate anything that's around and make more of it than is deserved. It's just like the dangerous dogs campaign of a few years ago really. Suddenly there were incidents every week and every big dog was suppposed to be dangerous. It's a wonder they didn't move on to having people over 6 foot having to wear a straight-jacket. Being against racism doesn't mean I'm in favour of being manipulated to suit other people's agendas. I practice decency. I don't need some liberal PC brigade telling me what decency is. Freedom is valuable to me, despite the fact it is eroded at every turn, and why have you got the right to punish people who might not wish to play your tune for righteous living I don't know. I can think of a lot more people who need punishing, and punishing properly - like those who stabbed and robbed that helpless white lawyer. That's real racism. Why not go and speak to that lawyer's family and get a real take on righteous thinking. When it really comes to racism you might be surprised at what colour the victims often are. Why not go to Zimbabwe and do an in depth investigation on racism?. Find out some really relevent facts instead of pissing about with a throwaway Tiatto comment.
linekar78 Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 Couldn't agree more. It's patronizing and insulting. People should be chosen on merit, full stop. And in football, from what I can see, they are. It's the most inclusive game imaginable. Look at our team: Aussies, Irish, English, Guinean, Scottish, black, white and shades in between yet they play with a spirit to celebrate. If I'd come off that field and been upset I'd probably have ordered Tiatto a drink and just pointed out that I was unhappy with what he said. Duberry should concentrate on being a footballer instead of a bloody activist. At least until he finds something worthwhile to act upon. You're right on that point, although that's also the reason people, like me, get so upset by racism in football. We can all agree in the meritocracy that is football - simply put if you're good enough it doesn't matter what colour your skin is. A far cry from the dark days of the 1980's when, to pick one example, black player Paul Canoville was abused by his own fans on his debut - not because he was worse than Josh Low - but simply because of the colour of his skin. No-one wants us to return to that situation and so I think you can all put up with people getting worked up about racism wherever it occurs in the game and, more importantly, whether you think it's serious enough or not. Because i'd much rather just get on with the football - and get on with supporting leicester city and our players.
Jimmy Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 1. It wasn't that. 2. I know this because Duberry said it wasn't about his colour or something and i believe "coon" is. 3. How would a Stoke fan know. because it was reported in there local press maybe?
jamfox Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 I'd love for you to explain how "This is not racism whatever has been said" and what you meant by it's not a "big deal" if not to take away from the seriousness of it. Maybe if you clarified then you couldn't accuse me of putting words in your mouth. Your accusation that everyone who disagrees with you is a reactionary on some sort of bandwagon is bizzare considering you know very little about most of the people that disagree with you. I'm not juming on any bandwagon but I happen to believe that racism is unacceptable even on a football pitch. It seems that you think that sometimes racism is acceptable or that if it's said in retaliation it's not racism for some reason. The fact is that IF Tiatto made a racist comment then he chose to make that comment rather then react in any other way. We can argue about whether racism is different to other predjudice but the general consensus in the world (and in football) is that it's not acceptable. I don't think that when black players spearhead the Kick-it-Out campaign they are on a bandwagon, probobly just sick of it. Kicking people and whatever else in football is something most pro's accept is part and parcel of the game but racism (like headbutting or biting) is something that isn't and shouldn't be accepted. The fact is that whatever way you're putting and whatever labels you're trying to put on me your previous posts have given the impression (and not just to me and crazy bandwagon) that you don't think racism is that bad in some contexts. I'm glad you've never been a racist, well done, but tolerating it in others isn't acceptable either in my book. You're right that you can't just make racism disappear but that isn't the point here. You can punish people for it and make it clear it's not welcome in football especially from people who are inevitably (rightly or wrongly) rolemodels for a younger generation. It might not solve it on it's own but it's also only a part of wider programmes to reduce/remove racism in our society...I thought that was something most people were on board with, maybe not. Chill pill any one? For fooks sake we don’t even know what he said? My guess is that is “it’s not about colour†it was ether “you French c@nt†or “you Muslim c@ntâ€Â# If it was the first, then, it’s no big deal. Would you mind if someone called you a English tw=t or even pommy cu[t? by an assie? If it was the second that is out of order (although not racist) and he should be punished. But we don’t know do we, if your gona say anything you should say what was said, then we would not have to speculate? A lie travel half way round the world before the truth can get its boots on.
Dr The Singh Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 Chill pill any one? For fooks sake we don’t even know what he said? My guess is that is “it’s not about colour†it was ether “you French c@nt†or “you Muslim c@ntâ€Â# If it was the first, then, it’s no big deal. Would you mind if someone called you a English tw=t or even pommy cu[t? by an assie? If it was the second that is out of order (although not racist) and he should be punished. But we don’t know do we, if your gona say anything you should say what was said, then we would not have to speculate? A lie travel half way round the world before the truth can get its boots on. Interesting first post Jamfox, and welcome!!!
lcfc_jme Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 If nobody is making a complaint, no-one is investigating and the person "victim" of the "incident" isn't even bothered by it (which he clearly isn't if he doesn't want to make a complaint), then why are people still assuming Tiatto has committed a major crime? Anybody could come out and claim these things after a game, and if they have substance, they will be acted upon, as was proven with the banning of Mijailovic for his racial abuse of McCarthy.. (I am aware that the FA are set to investigate these claims, and I only hope they amount to nothing and Duberry is duely charged with improper conduct for such nonsensical claims )
London_Fox Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 Just to clarify that I totally agree that if there is no proof of what was said then fine, let it drop but my issue is with fans on this board seemingly happy to make excuses for racism or narrowly define it to suit themselves. It's not part of being liberal or PC (and by the way I see nothing wrong with being liberal) to say that comments about someone's background, nationality, race or colour are unacceptable. We don't know what Tiatto said but some people are quick to assume that if something isn't about the colour of your skin then it can't be racism but that's just not true. Race isn't purely defined as black or white. If you want to be pedantic we can call it xenophobia but I don't think that makes it any more acceptable. You talk about "furthering their campaign" like it's some sort of sinister thing to make the world a worst place. I think it's actually quite positive that whenever racism comes up we take it seriously and deal with it. For example when Muzzy was the victim of abuse from fans (specifically Everton ones after the two Leeds fans got stabbed) we were rightly disgusted and outraged, that wasn't about the colour of his skin. Matteratzi's comments to Zidane weren't about the colour of his skin but were still racist. Diao should come forward and make a proper complaint if he wants to make one but let's not also forget that whatever is in his past Duberry is his captain and so has a place to speak out against racism when it's aimed at one of his players. Hopefully things will come out in the open and it can be dealt with properly because these rumours are doing no good for anyone but the attitude of some people on here is still alarming.
Master Fox Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 There will be a lot of City players and fans unable to see the joke. Care to explain what's funny? Errrr...No. Why do I need to explain myself to you? I really don't take things like this too seriously and tend to see the funny side.
Daggers Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 Source FA TO QUIZ DUBERRY OVER ALLEGED RACISM COMMENT 09:40 - 02 November 2006 Stoke City skipper Michael Duberry is to be quizzed by the Football Association after he accused Leicester's Danny Tiatto of racially abusing the Potters' Senegalese midfielder Salif Diao.Duberry claims Tiatto called Diao a French c*** when the Australian defender and Stoke's loan signing from Liverpool clashed during Tuesday's Championship match at the Walkers Stadium. He said: "It wasn't a black or white remark, there was no mention of colour, but it's still racism. "I'm willing to speak out because we all wear the badge to kick it out. We are trying to stamp out that sort of thing. "Tiatto knows what he said. He should be disgusted. He should have been sent off for the comment." The FA revealed yesterday that referee Graham Laws made no reference to the incident in his match report, meaning no further action will be taken unless an official complaint is lodged by Stoke or the players concerned. "Anyone with information in such incidents should bring them to our attention so that any appropriate disciplinary action can be taken," said an FA spokesman. However, Duberry has already said he does not intend to make a formal complaint to the FA, while Tiatto and officials from both Leicester and Stoke City were unavailable for comment yesterday. Diao has also declined to talk about the incident which comes just days after all English clubs took part in the ongoing Professional Footballers' Association campaign to kick racism out of football. Even though the alleged slur made no reference to colour, PFA assistant chief executive Bobby Barnes said the term would still be considered racist and treated as such if a complaint was made. The 43-year-old former West Ham winger, a key figure in the PFA's anti-racism programme, said: "This is a very difficult situation as there has been no formal complaint, so we are just talking about ifs. But if this incident did take place then it would be taken very seriously. "A term does not have to just mention colour to be racist and if this statement was true then it would be considered racist." Barnes admitted that derogatory terms are part and parcel of football games, but there was a line that should not be crossed. He hoped that if the incident did occur then Tiatto would be regretting it. However, Barnes added: "Nobody has heard Danny Tiatto's side of the story. "Football is a passionate game and in the heat of the moment players say things they do not necessarily mean. "There is always going to be sledging in sport, but we can't accept abuse against race, colour or creed." SAM Bangoura was on the score sheet last night as an experienced Stoke side beat Hednesford Town 4-1 in the Staffs Senior Cup at Keys Park. After falling behind after 20 minutes, Stoke took control of the game once Anthony Pulis had levelled seconds later. Martin Paterson made it 2-1 before Bangoura and then Paterson, with his second, wrapped up the game. Personally, I do not accept that this is a racist term.
TheShrew Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 surely c**t is enough to get the point across. No need to be a xenophobe.
gatesheadfox Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 **** hell, is that it? if i was danny i'd not appologise for calling him french. how pathetic
breadandcheese Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 Ha ha, he's not even French, brilliant. I hope they throw the book at Duberry for his wise decision as a a team captain to crucify our player through the media without even the hint of reasoning behind it.
Manwell Pablo Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 How stupid, thats no where near as bad as some of the stuff I've shouted at Tiatto . Diao isn't even French
Fez of Mahrez Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 How stupid, thats no where near as bad as some of the stuff I've shouted at Tiatto . Diao isn't even French :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
TheShrew Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 So we arrive at the conclusion that Tiatto isn't racist, he just didn't pay much attention to the map he was colouring in during geography class.
Fez of Mahrez Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 So we arrive at the conclusion that Tiatto isn't racist, he just didn't pay much attention to the map he was colouring in during geography class. I think you're crediting him with far too much of an education there. Seriously though, how many times has Tiatto been called an Aussie c**t in his career? Almost as many times as he's kicked someone I bet.
Frenzied Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 Source Personally, I do not accept that this is a racist term. It isn't racist at all, as the French aren't a race but a nation. It is, however, prejudiced
Manwell Pablo Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 I think you're crediting him with far too much of an education there. Seriously though, how many times has Tiatto been called an Aussie c**t in his career? Almost as many times as he's kicked someone I bet. Aussie Twat, Aussie C**t, useless bold headed piece of Aussie shit is my faviourate. How is that racist? next we wont be able to refer to Americans to yanks.
breadandcheese Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 I'm confused, who's Tiatto offended again? Diao or the French people? I'm struggling to follow all this. Am I right in thinking Diao is p*ssed off because he was called French. Meanwhile Duberry has turned into Joan of Arc and is fighting for the French.
Fez of Mahrez Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 Ultra will be wanting Tiatto banned, no doubt.
The Don Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 Just to clarify that I totally agree that if there is no proof of what was said then fine, let it drop but my issue is with fans on this board seemingly happy to make excuses for racism or narrowly define it to suit themselves. It's not part of being liberal or PC (and by the way I see nothing wrong with being liberal) to say that comments about someone's background, nationality, race or colour are unacceptable. We don't know what Tiatto said but some people are quick to assume that if something isn't about the colour of your skin then it can't be racism but that's just not true. Race isn't purely defined as black or white. If you want to be pedantic we can call it xenophobia but I don't think that makes it any more acceptable. You talk about "furthering their campaign" like it's some sort of sinister thing to make the world a worst place. I think it's actually quite positive that whenever racism comes up we take it seriously and deal with it. For example when Muzzy was the victim of abuse from fans (specifically Everton ones after the two Leeds fans got stabbed) we were rightly disgusted and outraged, that wasn't about the colour of his skin. Matteratzi's comments to Zidane weren't about the colour of his skin but were still racist. Diao should come forward and make a proper complaint if he wants to make one but let's not also forget that whatever is in his past Duberry is his captain and so has a place to speak out against racism when it's aimed at one of his players. Hopefully things will come out in the open and it can be dealt with properly because these rumours are doing no good for anyone but the attitude of some people on here is still alarming. Wtf are you on about. Calling someone's mum is not racist you prat - I bet you were picked on as a kid, and now like to be the champion of others who get victomised.
Manwell Pablo Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 I'm confused, who's Tiatto offended again? Diao or the French people? I'm struggling to follow all this. Am I right in thinking Diao is p*ssed off because he was called French. Meanwhile Duberry has turned into Joan of Arc and is fighting for the French. Maybe he thought it was Pericard.
Fez of Mahrez Posted 2 November 2006 Posted 2 November 2006 Maybe he thought it was Pericard. .... I can't do it....
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