Managers who are thought of as great who you don't rate part 1

[Kilworthfox]

I don't get it!

Arsene Wenger is IMO not this great manager that the majority raves about. He is a self indulgent German / Frenchman who has 1 philosophy and only 1 philosophy to have a side produced of unknown young players which he brings through the ranks. A great manager is a successful manager given the resources he has had available. Wenger has millions available but what does he actually achieve? 2 league wins, no European cups. Success is measured in trophy's, it is all well and good playing pretty football and getting everyone to say that Arsenal play nice football which is pretty on the eye, however unless it has the backbone to secure trophy's then it is all for nothing.

I respect the job he has does bringing through players and getting them to a very good or world class standard, but this is not his job! He is not the Academy director is he? He is the manager of the Arsenal 1st team and with that come the responsibility to win trophy's as they are London's premier team in terms of history of winning trophy's.

He has had 13 years to build a wonderful team who you could say that they were a great side like Man U in the 90's or Liverpool in the 80's but there has been no sustained success.

Also the guy has no class! If there is a blatant decision that goes against him or his team then he is outraged with the officials even when in the wrong. He can not discipline his prima donas and he does not have the guts to buy a world class player with a proven record even if they would improve his side.

The thing that really gets me is this Youth development programme which comes before any success.

[davieG]

I don't get it!

Arsene Wenger is IMO not this great manager that the majority raves about. He is a self indulgent German / Frenchman who has 1 philosophy and only 1 philosophy to have a side produced of unknown young players which he brings through the ranks. A great manager is a successful manager given the resources he has had available. Wenger has millions available but what does he actually achieve? 2 league wins, no European cups. Success is measured in trophy's, it is all well and good playing pretty football and getting everyone to say that Arsenal play nice football which is pretty on the eye, however unless it has the backbone to secure trophy's then it is all for nothing.

I respect the job he has does bringing through players and getting them to a very good or world class standard, but this is not his job! He is not the Academy director is he? He is the manager of the Arsenal 1st team and with that come the responsibility to win trophy's as they are London's premier team in terms of history of winning trophy's.

He has had 13 years to build a wonderful team who you could say that they were a great side like Man U in the 90's or Liverpool in the 80's but there has been no sustained success.

Also the guy has no class! If there is a blatant decision that goes against him or his team then he is outraged with the officials even when in the wrong. He can not discipline his prima donas and he does not have the guts to buy a world class player with a proven record even if they would improve his side.

The thing that really gets me is this Youth development programme which comes before any success.

It would be interesting to know how his millions compare with the other big teams who have also had little success. As for class and being outraged I think he learnt all that by copying Ferguson.

But you're right he really should have won more.

[Daggers]

He's no Brian Clough.

[dandannieldanok]

We should hire him as youth coach.

[Corky]

Don't understand all the hype about him to be honest. Plays one way and that's it. Can't (or won't) mix it up at all.

[Webbo]

Arsene Wenger at Arsenal;

* Premier League: 1997-98, 2001-02, 2003-04

* FA Cup: 1997-98, 2001-02, 2002-03, 2004-05

* FA Community Shield: 1998, 1999, 2002, 2004

Hardly a failure.

[Corky]

Arsene Wenger at Arsenal;

* Premier League: 1997-98, 2001-02, 2003-04

* FA Cup: 1997-98, 2001-02, 2002-03, 2004-05

* FA Community Shield: 1998, 1999, 2002, 2004

Hardly a failure.

I don't think anyone's called him a failure, he is a brilliant manager, but I think some go over the top with him.

[ASH17LCFC]

49 games unbeaten ?!!

Are you some kind of idiot ? Has Man Utd, Chelsea or Liverpool ever won the league but remain unbeaten through out ?

Arsenal have won the double twice and how many other teams apart from Man Utd have ?

Arsenal have also reached a champion league final and came up against the best Barca team in years.

Henry probally the best player to ever grace the Premiership and who found him playing on the wing in Italy ...

IDIOT

[lildave3]

I wouldn't go as far as Kilworth, but I question what he's done since 03-04. The core of that team moved on and he replaced them with tat.

[ASH17LCFC]

I wouldn't go as far as Kilworth, but I question what he's done since 03-04. The core of that team moved on and he replaced them with tat.

Who beat 5-2 again ? Who played who off the park again ? Who beat the champions of europe ?

I admit Arsenal aren't the same side of old but last season they untill March where on for the Premiership.

Arsenal will win the Champion league this year.

[sdb]

unbelievable. he's won tonnes, spent relatively little, moulded some of the best players in the world over the last 10-15 years and plays sexual football with relatively young players without crazy contracts. enhanced the premier league massively, even if he can be a bit of a tit.

[Fez of Mahrez]

All this moaning about youth has only really started this season. Last year they got close and it wasn't quite to be. Doesn't tarnish his success over the years just because they have lost a couple more games than expected so far this season.

[ASH17LCFC]

All this moaning about youth has only really started this season. Last year they got close and it wasn't quite to be. Doesn't tarnish his success over the years just because they have lost a couple more games than expected so far this season.

What he said.

[Miquel The Work Geordie]

Thing with Arsenal is that at the minute, they don't have many players that I would label as "world class." Also, as LD3 has pointed out, Wenger seems to have replaced the side of 03/04 with players that, whilst the may be decent, cannot compare to their predescessors.

Lehmann > Almunia

Pires > Nasri

Henry > Adebayor

Bergkamp > Van Persie

And so on.

[Corky]

Thing with Arsenal is that at the minute, they don't have many players that I would label as "world class." Also, as LD3 has pointed out, Wenger seems to have replaced the side of 03/04 with players that, whilst the may be decent, cannot compare to their predescessors.

Lehmann > Almunia

Pires > Nasri

Henry > Adebayor

Bergkamp > Van Persie

And so on.

I think that's a fair comment. Wenger is thinking of the future of the club, but it seems to be at the expense of immediate success. He needs to spend money, or Arsenal could go trophyless for another couple of years.

[Miquel The Work Geordie]

I think that's a fair comment. Wenger is thinking of the future of the club, but it seems to be at the expense of immediate success. He needs to spend money, or Arsenal could go trophyless for another couple of years.

How many years have Arsenal been in a "transitional" period though? Seems like forever.

With the Emirates comes the funds to buy top class players for success domestically, as well as on the continent, and Wenger seems reluctant to do so.

[Tommeh]

the way I see it is that their 97/98 team was one of the very best but the golden boys of that team were eventualy replaced by 03 which lead to another great team I.e

Adams - Campbell

Winterburn - Cole

Overmars - Pires

Bergkamp - Henry

And so on but like others have said Wenger never really replaced Campbell, Pires and in particular Vieira, what a massive loss he was.

These days they are far too lightweight especially in midfield, they've had some bad luck with players like Van Persie and Rosicky speding far too much time out injured but the back up to these players like song, Bentdner, Eboue etc. Simply arn't good enough.

So to put it simply they peaked in 04 after the unbeaten run and have never really looked the same since the moved to the Emirates, I'd actually go as far as saying that if they were still at Highbury they'd have been a much greater force these last 4 seasons.

[Joe.]

Agreed with Wenger being overrated. Well, not so much overrated, because what he's achieved with Arsenal in the past is very admirable, but for them to progress now I think they need somebody new at the helm who'll install a new apporoach.

Let's face it, the way Wenger's running things at the moment Arsenal aren't going to win much anytime soon. The other three big clubs are improving their squads all the time with more established players, whereas Wenger's trying to groom 14 year old Ivorian goat farmers to be world beaters.

If you looks at the success they had (particularly in 03/04), they could rely on experience from the likes of Seaman, Adams, Keown, Parlour, Pires, Vieira, Ljungberg Henry etc, but now they have very few players who fit this kind of calibre.

[Tevez]

Since when was Pires world fooking class?!?!

[lildave3]

Who beat 5-2 again ? Who played who off the park again ? Who beat the champions of europe ?

I admit Arsenal aren't the same side of old but last season they untill March where on for the Premiership.

Arsenal will win the Champion league this year.

Whop lost to Stoke, Fulham, Villa and Man City? There's probably more aswell.

[Kilworthfox]

Are you some kind of idiot ?

IDIOT

Everyone knows the answer to that question Ash

Wenger is not shit, but over rated!

His in stubbornness to change his footballing philosophy is having a detrimental effect on Arsenals success, any manager worth their salt should move with the times, and Wenger is stuck in his own worldly rut with his Youth system.

IMO he should have won a lot more and certainly should no be lagging behind the top 4

[hairy]

Wenger has suffered with funds to buy new players in recent seasons. The money they have spent on the new stadium has drained the kitty. Simple as that.

The problem they now have is they keep losing which reduces attendances and therefore revenue whilst their debt payment stays the same. The summer could be very interesting in terms of transfers for Wenger, assuming he makes it that far.

[Kilworthfox]

Wenger has suffered with funds to buy new players in recent seasons. The money they have spent on the new stadium has drained the kitty. Simple as that.

The problem they now have is they keep losing which reduces attendances and therefore revenue whilst their debt payment stays the same. The summer could be very interesting in terms of transfers for Wenger, assuming he makes it that far.

The attendances are 60K every week. Wenger has money to spend the clubs board have said this for seasons but he chooses not too He is sticking with his plan of bedding in youngsters which is not looking like winning him any trophies this season.

[Simi]

I must admit I'm getting slighty annoyed at the media with the constant line of "Are these kids ready" "In two years they will be world class" "The kids aren't ready yet" "They haven't got the depth".

The same lines are coming up season after season now, nothing has been done about it.

[Phube]

I'll just say MON >>>>> Wenger! By a country mile!