Gary speed - RIP

[Captain...]

If true the media are only partly to blame because the buying public obviously make it worth their while as I've no doubt that their sales increase as a result.

I wonder if it would have been different if he was aware of the respect he had achieved and now being displayed if it had been more visible. The football world is prolific and very quick at condemning the bad side of the game and vociferous in their pursuit of rivalries but not quite so public and strong in showing their respect for players of other clubs etc. Perhaps we can all learn a lesson form this and be a bit more tolerant and appreciative of our rivals.

RIP Gary Speed thought are with your family.

The thing is would he still have this respect if this story came to light? I don't want to speculate on what it may or may not be, but if there is a story then it seems likely that it was something pretty bad and probably true if it made him end his own life. Maybe he has battled with depression and this story pushed him over the edge, or maybe there is something so terrible in his past that if it came out he would lose everything.

The thing is how did he know there was a news story coming out about him?

Steve Coogan said something a few days ago in reference to the current inquiry into the media.

They tell the girls, they will make them look "tawdry and awful and sluttish" but promise not to do so if they speak to the paper.

It's a ruse - that they can't publish a story unless the person speaks to them, it's a bluff. Often the information they've got is gained by blagging a couple of details and, in the case of girl I was seeing in 2005, they tried to entice her to sell her story using information that was in messages that I'd left for her and she'd left for me. At the time I didn't understand why they knew that.

They knew that information hadn't been gained legally so they had to get her to confirm it.

2.32pm: Coogan continues about News of the World's Singh.

He said on the phone I want to help you, I begged him not to put in some of the more lurid details, he said if I confirm certain aspects then more lurid details would be left out of the story. So I confirmed certain details and he gave me his word that more embarrassing part would be omitted. After that my manager received a phone call from Coulson that they were going to put everything in the paper.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/blog/2011/nov/22/leveson-inquiry-steve-coogan-live

Basically journalists phone you up getting you to confirm something they have discovered illegally in return for keeping some details private, by agreeing to this you are giving them the confirmation they can print it, because you have told them it is true.

Just wondering if Gary Speed had a similar phone call on Saturday night? Part of me really wants the whole incident to be laid to rest in a dignified manner, and this story about Speed to not exist. For the sake of his family could you imagine losing a loved one then finding out a few days later that he was not the man he seemed to be, it would be devasting. If the papers do have a hand in all of this then they need to be exposed and shamed, they will have blood on their hands and not for the first time, unfortunately this could see Speed's name and family dragged through the gutter press.

[Reynard Bleu]

The impact of suicide on those close family members you leave behind must be almost unbearable but I can't believe that if a man is so disturbed and desperate as to take his own life that he is commiting a selfish act. He must have been so confused and felt so helpless that he saw no other way to escape. Suicide is rarely an rational act, its an act borne of desperation and fear and of feeling trapped, alone and unable to seek help from those around you. Its easy to sit in your armchair and say its a selfish act because ofthe imapct you see it having on others, but I suspect that selfishness was the last thing on his mind as he took his life. Poor man. Despite all the apparent trappings of (reasonable) success, he could find nobody to help him deal with whatever drove him to kill himself. Its a wretcehd business for everyone concerned.

[somebum]

Just another line that people may not be going down, although it seems he died by hanging, that does not rule out Erotic asphyxiation - so perhaps it was an accident anyway.

[HEGGSY]

SSN reporter just broke down when speaking about Speed horrible ....RIP Gary

[Kitchandro]

The impact of suicide on those close family members you leave behind must be almost unbearable but I can't believe that if a man is so disturbed and desperate as to take his own life that he is commiting a selfish act. He must have been so confused and felt so helpless that he saw no other way to escape. Suicide is rarely an rational act, its an act borne of desperation and fear and of feeling trapped, alone and unable to seek help from those around you. Its easy to sit in your armchair and say its a selfish act because ofthe imapct you see it having on others, but I suspect that selfishness was the last thing on his mind as he took his life. Poor man. Despite all the apparent trappings of (reasonable) success, he could find nobody to help him deal with whatever drove him to kill himself. Its a wretcehd business for everyone concerned.

Well said, I don't think it's right to judge if you've never been in that situation.

[Kitchandro]

If it's true that the press were going to print something about him then they should be held accountable for his death. I'm sick to the back teeth of the media destroying peoples lives for a quick buck and then leaving them to pick up the pieces! I'm sure we've all done things we're not proud of, but that doesn't give the media any right to report personal things to the world. I'm all for freedom of speech - but a bit of bloody common sense and respect wouldn't go a miss either! There are some stories that need to be told, but I very much doubt this to be one of them.

If he took his life cause of a news story then he must have been so desperately ashamed or terrified. It is just so tragic.

RIP Gary.

I agree to some extent, but not in all circumstances.

For example should we have gone on thinking Ryan Giggs was a great guy and role model instead of who we know he is now? I think people should know things like that.

[Captain...]

I agree to some extent, but not in all circumstances.

For example should we have gone on thinking Ryan Giggs was a great guy and role model instead of who we know he is now? I think people should know things like that.

Has it changed your life in any way to know that he had an affair, other than to have some ammo to sling at him should he ever play against us? I would be much happier to believe there were more nice people in the world and be wrong than know the sordid details of everybodies private life.

Likewise with Speed there is nothing to gain from destroying the reputation of a someone who has died, all it will serve is to heap misery on his family, they could probably cope with the news in private, it may even give them answers to explain why this happened and help them deal with the grief, but it won't be in private it will be all over the press and on the terraces, it would be devasting if there is a news story so bad to make him take his life and if there is it will come out.

[somebum]

Agree with everything being said about depression. I have struggled with it for the past decade and in my discussions with people I have come across people who I can instantly bond with as we speak about it, but there are some very ignorant people out there also - just as I was once. Not many people understand how low you are feeling to be walking alone down a dark street and be secretly hoping somebody would come along and blow your brains out just to end it because you do not have the guts to do it yourself. I thought Collymore's comments on it yesterday summed it up brilliantly. Most people have felt down but when the downward spiral becomes a hopeless alley of despair and you cannot visualize coming out alive at the other end, you know you are in the darkest realms of this terrible mindset.

I have often said that "when I get all the things I want in life maybe i will not suffer" but hearing what may have happened to Speed concerns me that he had everything. Either he had some horrendous news in the hours before his death or his death was an accident as I suggested earlier... it's a terrible state of affairs.

[foxfanazer]

I guess it depends on whether you've empathy towards others or not. I tend to cry over these things because I can imagine what the family members are going through, etc, etc. Also, you don't know the personal circumstances of people replying to the thread... perhaps they've been affected by a similar thing. Totally agree with you, although I have never met him I shed a tear when the minutes silence/applause for him happened at the Swansea game. I think the pain he must of suffered from the depression more upsetting than the death itself, to feel that hopeless and desperate terrifies me. He came across as a strong willed guy with high ambitions so if he can do that it goes to show it can happen to any one of us. Thoughts go to everybody his death has hurt. RIP Gary Speed

Incidentally, I often cry during the minute's silence on 11/11 too, because I reflect on what others have put themselves through in the past and the sheer number of young lives lost through war.

What you find OTT others may see as gesture of compassion and understanding.

[EnderbyFox]

Edited 28 November 2011 by EnderbyFox

[foxfanazer]

I guess it depends on whether you've empathy towards others or not. I tend to cry over these things because I can imagine what the family members are going through, etc, etc. Also, you don't know the personal circumstances of people replying to the thread... perhaps they've been affected by a similar thing. Totally agree with you, although I have never met him I shed a tear when the minutes silence/applause for him happened at the Swansea game. I think the pain he must of suffered from the depression more upsetting than the death itself, to feel that hopeless and desperate terrifies me. He came across as a strong willed guy with high ambitions so if he can do that it goes to show it can happen to any one of us. Thoughts go to everybody his death has hurt. RIP Gary Speed

Incidentally, I often cry during the minute's silence on 11/11 too, because I reflect on what others have put themselves through in the past and the sheer number of young lives lost through war.

What you find OTT others may see as gesture of compassion and understanding.

I guess it depends on whether you've empathy towards others or not. I tend to cry over these things because I can imagine what the family members are going through, etc, etc. Also, you don't know the personal circumstances of people replying to the thread... perhaps they've been affected by a similar thing. Totally agree with you, although I have never met him I shed a tear when the minutes silence/applause for him happened at the Swansea game. I think the pain he must of suffered from the depression more upsetting than the death itself, to feel that hopeless and desperate terrifies me. He came across as a strong willed guy with high ambitions so if he can do that it goes to show it can happen to any one of us. Thoughts go to everybody his death has hurt. RIP Gary Speed

Incidentally, I often cry during the minute's silence on 11/11 too, because I reflect on what others have put themselves through in the past and the sheer number of young lives lost through war.

What you find OTT others may see as gesture of compassion and understanding.

[Kitchandro]

Has it changed your life in any way to know that he had an affair, other than to have some ammo to sling at him should he ever play against us? I would be much happier to believe there were more nice people in the world and be wrong than know the sordid details of everybodies private life.

Likewise with Speed there is nothing to gain from destroying the reputation of a someone who has died, all it will serve is to heap misery on his family, they could probably cope with the news in private, it may even give them answers to explain why this happened and help them deal with the grief, but it won't be in private it will be all over the press and on the terraces, it would be devasting if there is a news story so bad to make him take his life and if there is it will come out.

No, but I don't like frauds. Why should someone be revered when they don't deserve it? It's wrong.

I don't know anything about Speed's situation so I won't speculate on that. In any case it's a different circumstance as he's died, possibly because of these things in the media. Giggs is still alive and rightly has to live with the shame of what he's done.

I don't think you could judge the public or the media for humiliating Giggs. Like I said, I don't know about Speed.

Edited 28 November 2011 by Kitchandro

[The Year Of The Fox]

Rumour has it that he was gay and a paper (not mentioning any name but sure you can guess) was going to reveal it.

The most tragic thing for me about all this is, that if he could see all these tributes pouring in from across the world, he would've realised that he had so many people on his side.

Its also a shame people only speak out and tell them how much someone was respected when they're dead

[Bert]

That video is horrible. But Georgie looks mega at the end.

[Finnegan]

Given almost every tabloid has run pretty passionate tributes to the man today, it really runs my blood cold to think one of them running some trash might have been the catalyst.

I almost hope it's not the case, really.

[Super_horns]

One of the best goalscoring midfielders in the Premiership during his long and successful carrer.

The number of tributes just show how popular Gary Speed was as a man.

Such sad news and ofcourse main thoughts go to his family and friends.

[Fox92]

I know he was mates with Gary Speed. He spoke so open then, that was horrible to watch.

But Georgie looks mega at the end.

Georgie always looks mega. Didn't Dec finish their relationship? Idiot.

[Simmo86]

Bryn

Not nice that! Thought he was going to go at half 6 this morning when he was interviewing Larry Grayson.

Fair play to him for sticking through it.

[StanSP]

That was horrible watching the clip of Bryn breaking down .

[Narborough_fox]

[Bilo]

That is heartbreaking. Just shows how much the bloke was loved, if only he knew.

[Captain...]

No, but I don't like frauds. Why should someone be revered when they don't deserve it? It's wrong.

I don't know anything about Speed's situation so I won't speculate on that. In any case it's a different circumstance as he's died, possibly because of these things in the media. Giggs is still alive and rightly has to live with the shame of what he's done.

I don't think you could judge the public or the media for humiliating Giggs. Like I said, I don't know about Speed.

I can and I do.

If you were a famous person with a shameful secret and you saw what happened to Giggs the way he was plastered all over the papers the way despite all his money and wealth he couldn't keep it out the press how his reputation was destroyed in a matter of days. Then you got a phone call from someone telling you that you were about to be exposed and you imagine everything that happened to Giggs happening to you and to your family. That is going to make things much harder to deal with it may even send someone over the edge.

So yes I do judge the public and the media because they feast on such juicy morsels of gossip, the media feed it to us and we lap it up, it's disgusting.

We don't know yet if there was a story about Speed, but that still doesn't stop us speculating, because we love it.

[Finnegan]

I don't really want to watch people breaking down and crying. Watching Savage really choked me up.

I'm going to choose to watch captain fantastic how he was at his very best. (Well, at full back!) Best game I've ever been to, we were all incredible that day.

Edited 28 November 2011 by Finnegan

[Kitchandro]

I can and I do.

If you were a famous person with a shameful secret and you saw what happened to Giggs the way he was plastered all over the papers the way despite all his money and wealth he couldn't keep it out the press how his reputation was destroyed in a matter of days. Then you got a phone call from someone telling you that you were about to be exposed and you imagine everything that happened to Giggs happening to you and to your family. That is going to make things much harder to deal with it may even send someone over the edge.

So yes I do judge the public and the media because they feast on such juicy morsels of gossip, the media feed it to us and we lap it up, it's disgusting.

We don't know yet if there was a story about Speed, but that still doesn't stop us speculating, because we love it.

I think the truth is important though. If people can't handle the truth being exposed they shouldn't be so disrespectful to those who love them, as Giggs was.

I'm not saying the media aren't a-holes. But there are some people who bring the humiliation on themselves and they can't blame anyone else for that.

If you committed a crime, it may do more harm to you and your families life if you were caught, but does that mean you should get off scot-free because it may be harmful to your family?

I'm not saying Speed deserved to be publicly ruined because I have no idea what he did or if he indeed did anything. Giggs though, it's his fault and no-one elses, he can't complain the media have stitched him up.

Of course we the public speculate, it's our natural feeling to want to know why this happened, not only because he was a popular and well-known figure but also especially because of the accounts of many of his friends yesterday. Everyone that spoke to him just hours before has said he seemed the same as ever, without any indication of the events that unfolded.

In that sense it is a unique 'story', it seems incredibly strange and naturally we will wonder what has happened. Not because we are disrespectful, but because we are humans who are in disbelief.

Edited 28 November 2011 by Kitchandro

[Finnegan]

I think the truth is important though. If people can't handle the truth being exposed they shouldn't be so disrespectful to those who love them, as Giggs was.

I'm not saying the media aren't a-holes. But there are some people who bring the humiliation on themselves and they can't blame anyone else for that.

If you committed a crime, it may do more harm to you and your families life if you were caught, but does that mean you should get off scot-free because it may be harmful to your family?

I'm not saying Speed deserved to be publicly ruined because I have no idea what he did or if he indeed did anything. Giggs though, it's his fault and no-one elses, he can't complain the media have stitched him up.

I can't agree. I really don't want to see this thread turn in to a heated debate but the personal lives of entertainers is not and should not ever be public information. I can, at an absolute stretch, accept that the private lives of civil servants and politicians may give a look into their true selves that could be loosely justified as public interest to know but even that's clutching at straws.

The media broadcasting anyone's private or social lives is a hateful and vile failing of modern society.

Giggs and the like may have done truly vulgar things but they were his mistakes to make and his family's problem to deal with. At no point should they have been in the public domain for the world to scrutinize and judge.