Golf

[tom27111]

It looks like it's happening.

 

I might not need to wait 8 years for the seniors tour, looks like there'll be an opportunity to play on the PGA soon.

 

Anyone got Butch Harmon's number?

 

Oh, and if anyone from Augusta National is reading, I'm a 42 short 

 

 

[Smashing-Pumpkin]

Ive got to be honest, the format of this thing is at best bizarre, and at worst absolutely pants.

 

First of all, the shotgun start is so tinpot. It doesnt give a better fan experience at all because the entire days play will be over in four and a half hours and then the field will always be tiny. Secondly on the shotgun start, the "individual" strokeplay winner (if i understand the format correctly) wont be in the final group by default, as there wont be a final group. He will just finish somewhere around the course, walk off and win without the leaders being grouped together? some live spectacle thatll be....NOT. The winner holes out for par and walks off the 12th green whilst everyone else watches someone tied for 28th on the other side of the course.

 

Youve then got the team aspect each week, despite the fact that the "team" will be comprised of different players every week. How the F does that work then? Presumably the team captain has committed to playing the entire LIV series, so he will always be on team duckhook, but his team mates will change every tournament.

 

Youve then got 48 players and no cut, so everyones in the money, so I have absolutely no idea who decides what next weeks field will be, and the week after that. And the week after that.

 

Why do people think that sports need to be "jazzed up" to be exciting. Like playing snooker with 6 reds or playing football with 5 balls??

 

72 hole medal play is what makes the sport what it is, its exciting, it builds to a crescendo, the excitement of the closing stretch of holes, holding the lead or sleeping on the lead, saturday and sunday charges up the leaderboard. Sticking chili dip gc in a friday afternoon shotgun start is more reminiscent of a Rainbows charity day than a professional tour.

Edited 8 June 2022 by Smashing-Pumpkin

[The Year Of The Fox]

I hope it fails

 

But with the money involved it’ll no doubt be a success

 

 

Have all those who’ve jumped ship now forfeited their PGA card or what?

 

Pissed off at Poulter going. Especially with his love for the Ryder Cup

[tom27111]

Put the money and the breakaway tour to one side.

 

Will they play by the official laws of the game set out by the R&A and the USGA?

 

I think that's what I'd like to know most.

 

Edit...I mainly mean things like club regulations that would affect most of us.

 

Are we going to see a 600cc driver endorsed by DJ manufacturered by TaylorMade?

 

But also just the general rules of golf.

Edited 8 June 2022 by tom27111

[Izzy]

Bryson now confirms he’ll be playing the second LIV event in the US at the end of June.

 

Like Phil though, he won’t be resigning from the PGA Tour like DJ, Na and Sergio have.

 

Seems these players think they can have their cake and eat it.
 

Over to the PGA tour. Your move…

[tom27111]

Just now, Izzy said:

Bryson now confirms he’ll be playing the second LIV event in the US at the end of June.

 

Like Phil though, he won’t be resigning from the PGA Tour like DJ, Na and Sergio have.

 

Seems these players think they can have their cake and eat it.
 

Over to the PGA tour. Your move…

I wonder what the fans, sorry, patrons, reaction will be when these players exercise their rights to play in the majors through their exemptions?

 

Apparently, the tours have no authority to stop them playing in them.

[Smashing-Pumpkin]

2 minutes ago, Izzy said:

Bryson now confirms he’ll be playing the second LIV event in the US at the end of June.

 

Like Phil though, he won’t be resigning from the PGA Tour like DJ, Na and Sergio have.

 

Seems these players think they can have their cake and eat it.
 

Over to the PGA tour. Your move…

Its this bit of it that I dont understand.

 

If youve got limited fields, who loses their spot to Bryson, and on the basis of what exemption category does someone move out of the field?

 

 

[Izzy]

5 minutes ago, tom27111 said:

Put the money and the breakaway tour to one side.

 

Will they play by the official laws of the game set out by the R&A and the USGA?

 

I think that's what I'd like to know most.

Yeah the format of LIV might be different but they’ll still have to play by the R&A and USGA rules. As governing bodies, they set the rules but it’s the tours (DP World/PGA/LIV) who organise the events, get sponsors, pay prize money etc

 

A bit like when the Premier League broke away from the Football league in ‘92. Still had to play by the same FIFA/UEFA rules 

[tom27111]

1 minute ago, Izzy said:

Yeah the format of LIV might be different but they’ll still have to play by the R&A and USGA rules. As governing bodies, they set the rules but it’s the tours (DP World/PGA/LIV) who organise the events, get sponsors, pay prize money etc

 

A bit like when the Premier League broke away from the Football league in ‘92. Still had to play by the same FIFA/UEFA rules 

But will they HAVE to stick to that?

 

There's nothing stopping them setting up a breakaway format is there?

 

Much like the BDO and PDC in darts and the various boxing governing bodies.

[The Year Of The Fox]

2 minutes ago, tom27111 said:

But will they HAVE to stick to that?

 

There's nothing stopping them setting up a breakaway format is there?

 

Much like the BDO and PDC in darts and the various boxing governing bodies.

I’ll be all for it if they start giving free drops for lies in a fairway divot 🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼

[tom27111]

1 minute ago, The Year Of The Fox said:

I’ll be all for it if they start giving free drops for lies in a fairway divot 🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼

 

I don't want a bigger driver on the market, everyone else will be 40 yards longer, I'll be 50 yards further right 

 

Now a free throw out of a greenside bunker and I'm in business!

[Izzy]

9 minutes ago, Smashing-Pumpkin said:

Its this bit of it that I dont understand.

 

If youve got limited fields, who loses their spot to Bryson, and on the basis of what exemption category does someone move out of the field?

 

I did some digging on this earlier and apparently all the LIV events this year are invitationals. To my surprise, apparently they had 170 applications for spots at Centurion before choosing the field of 48

 

If the PGA/DP World tour don't impose fines/sanctions, then I guess all players could apply to play in LIV events and they just cherry pick the 48 best.

 

Seeing as LIV players can now play the US Open, if they're still allowed to play on the PGA Tour then the likes of DJ, Na and Sergio may have jumped the gun by giving up their membership.

 

If more players backtrack and apply to play (like Bryson just has) then what started off as a shitshow might end up being a masterstroke.

 

I guess it's all down to if/what sanctions/fines the PGA/DP tour impose and if the whole independent contractor/free agent thing happens (which LIV have said they'd back/support/represent legally any of their players)

 

P.S. apparently LIV are also paying all the caddies expenses. They're going balls out for this in a HUGE way

 

[Izzy]

12 minutes ago, tom27111 said:

But will they HAVE to stick to that?

 

There's nothing stopping them setting up a breakaway format is there?

 

Much like the BDO and PDC in darts and the various boxing governing bodies.

If LIV don't stick to the R&A/USGA rules of golf they'd lose all credibility IMO

 

Can't really see any need for them to want to change the rules of golf tbh. There's no benefit in them changing the rules but they can fvck about with the format of competitions all they want

[tom27111]

Unrelated to LIV, I'm off to Scotland for a few days at the end of the month to watch a gig.

 

Booked a lovely little hotel for one night in Berwickshire and booked to play what looks to be a fantastic and picturesque links course.

 

The Mrs doesn't know yet, but how mad can she be? 

[Izzy]

1 hour ago, Smashing-Pumpkin said:

 

Youve then got the team aspect each week, despite the fact that the "team" will be comprised of different players every week. How the F does that work then? Presumably the team captain has committed to playing the entire LIV series, so he will always be on team duckhook, but his team mates will change every tournament.

 

Still can't get my head around this.

 

What pisses me off is when Lee Westwood says the team aspect is one of the main reasons he signed up for LIV.

 

Here's a guy being talked about as a future RC captain yet isn't even a captain of team duckhook or team shaggingyoursister

 

Fvck off Lee, it's all about the money mate - just admit it (like Martin Kaymer has)

[skolfoxes]

The key to this whole thing is whether or not the events will carry world ranking points.
 

The guys involved still want to be able to play in the majors, if there’s no ranking points and they’re banned from the PGA/DP World Tours then they’ll quickly begin to slide down the rankings and then everyone bar those with past winner exemptions will no longer qualify. If it turns out there are going to be ranking points awarded and the majors don’t ban players then there could be a real exodus. Of course the £££ will soften the blow of no longer being able to play in The Masters I’m sure. 
 

Aside from that the whole format sounds sh*te. They keep pushing the whole 54 hole, no cut, shotgun start format as though this is a selling point. It just means there’s less golf for the fans and absolutely no jeopardy for anyone as the the guy dead last still makes $120,000. The team event is a joke as well, the names are bad enough but the fact the teams change every week makes it seem a bit pointless.

[The Year Of The Fox]

[The Year Of The Fox]

I wonder how many HRH Prince Khalid will win by 

[Izzy]

12 minutes ago, skolfoxes said:

The key to this whole thing is whether or not the events will carry world ranking points.
 

The guys involved still want to be able to play in the majors, if there’s no ranking points and they’re banned from the PGA/DP World Tours then they’ll quickly begin to slide down the rankings and then everyone bar those with past winner exemptions will no longer qualify. If it turns out there are going to be ranking points awarded and the majors don’t ban players then there could be a real exodus. Of course the £££ will soften the blow of no longer being able to play in The Masters I’m sure. 
 

Aside from that the whole format sounds sh*te. They keep pushing the whole 54 hole, no cut, shotgun start format as though this is a selling point. It just means there’s less golf for the fans and absolutely no jeopardy for anyone as the the guy dead last still makes $120,000. The team event is a joke as well, the names are bad enough but the fact the teams change every week makes it seem a bit pointless.

I think this is a real possibility.

 

LIV have already applied to OWGR for their events to earn points and I suspect they'll get accepted.

 

Seeing as the majors are independently ran from the PGA/DP World Tours (and assuming the Majors don't ban LIV players which the US Open haven't) and if LIV events do carry OWGR points in the future, I reckon you'll soon see that exodus.

 

Pressure then on The PGA Tour to up their purses to match LIV and the DP World Tour will just end up being a feeder tour for both (which it pretty much is anyway)

 

[The Bear]

In sport and business, money talks. It'll be a success purely because of that. 

[Vacamion]

 

The journos are going in hard at those they speak to about this.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 8 June 2022 by Vacamion

[skolfoxes]

15 minutes ago, Izzy said:

I think this is a real possibility.

 

LIV have already applied to OWGR for their events to earn points and I suspect they'll get accepted.

 

Seeing as the majors are independently ran from the PGA/DP World Tours (and assuming the Majors don't ban LIV players which the US Open haven't) and if LIV events do carry OWGR points in the future, I reckon you'll soon see that exodus.

 

Pressure then on The PGA Tour to up their purses to match LIV and the DP World Tour will just end up being a feeder tour for both (which it pretty much is anyway)

 

Agreed, unless the OWGR people see LIV as an exhibition but I fear their alliance with the Asian Tour was to get round exactly that.

 

I don't think the PGA Tour will ever be able to match the LIV purses, PGA Tour purses are ultimately paid by the sponsors and TV contracts who only put in as much money as financially makes sense for them. The issue with LIV is that it does not, and never will, make any business/financial sense as that's not what it's about. They have to have accepted that there never will be any return on investment, not directly anyway, therefore they can throw way over market value at the players which the PGA Tour will never be able to match. I heard that their budget for this thing is between 6 and 8 billion dollars, DJ is being paid 150 million if reports are to be believed which is more than Tiger has made on course in his career!

 

This thing really could kill off the DP World Tour, as you say it has already become a feeder to the PGA Tour and seems to have really suffered post pandemic, players who are not playing for loads of money (relatively speaking) and have little chance of competing in never mind winning any of the majors have to be very very interested in this.

 

[skolfoxes]

11 minutes ago, Vacamion said:

 

The journos are going in hard at those they speak to about this.

 

 

 

 

 

I'd have more respect for them, albeit still virtually zero, if they just admitted that they don't give a sh1t about being used as pawns is the Saudi's sports washing operation as long as the massive cheques clear. None of this 'I'm not a politician I'm a golfer' style crap we've had.

 

The arrogance that they didn't seem to think anyone was going to challenge them on this stuff beggars belief. 

 

McDowell's answer was the best, he managed to unintentionally and completely unironically give a near perfect description of sports washing when asked how he felt about the Saudi's human rights record, it was actually quite impressive.

[trabuch]

 

[Izzy]

Eamon Lynch pretty much brutally nailing it