Golf

[Smashing-Pumpkin]

21 hours ago, The Bear said:

I went round South Chesterfield in 94 last week. I thought I played alright for my standard, and was thinking of breaking 90. Out in 45, in in 49. Only duffed one iron shot. I did however thin a shot out of the bunker over the green and ended up with a 7 after being in the bunker for two. Only lost one ball too, hooked left off the tee. 

 

My putting let me down, a couple of three putts. I rarely leave myself a decent chance for birdie or par though. Too many approaches are either just on the edge or just off the green. 

Hi mate

 

I think youve hit on something there that will really stand you in good stead as you improve. When you mention not getting your approach shots close, this is because people actually dont get their shots close. And by that, I mean everyone! (no, genuinely).

 

Lets take the best player from the PGA Tour stats from 150-175 yards from the hole. The typical "150 yard marker" distance, where lets call 175 the back, and 150 front to middle.

 

The best player in terms of proximity to the hole from this distance on tour is Vaughan Taylor. And his average distance to the hole from this distance is 21 feet 8 inches. So on average (some being less, some being more, and some being a chip or bunker shot), one of the best players in the world is nearly 22 feet away from the hole.

 

Whats more, Vaughan is considerably more accurate from 150-175 yards than the tour average from this distance, which is 28.5 feet from the hole. Over 9 yards away from the hole.

 

On the one hand, this takes some of the pressure away. Dont always think the TV represents whats really going on. Youre only watching the absolute best shots hit all day on a delay, and the leading groups, who are by definition usually playing very well to get the TV time.

 

You arent seeing players who are hitting it to 25 feet, or aiming away from the flag deliberately, etc etc.

 

But...... these are players who are regularly shooting -2, -3 on a normal day, -6 and -7 on a hot day......

 

So one of the absolute keys to scoring well is LAG PUTTING. the ability to roll the ball close to the hole from such distances that you leave yourself without a stressful little 4 or 5 footer to hole. Its an area of the game almost no one seems to work on at amateur level. Bizarrely, a lot of amateurs dont even seem to think putting is a part of the game, they only refer to their "good shots" being full swing shots, rather than any kind of putt.

 

When you tidy up the short game, youll be amazed at how quickly youll see gains in your scores relative to the amount of effort youd need to put into the long game.

 

Breaking 90 is a great milestone too, and one that will stand you in great stead moving forwards!

Edited 5 June 2022 by Smashing-Pumpkin

[Izzy]

9 minutes ago, Smashing-Pumpkin said:

Hi mate

 

I think youve hit on something there that will really stand you in good stead as you improve. When you mention not getting your approach shots close, this is because people actually dont get their shots close. And by that, I mean everyone! (no, genuinely).

 

Lets take the best player from the PGA Tour stats from 150-175 yards from the hole. The typical "150 yard marker" distance, where lets call 175 the back, and 150 front to middle.

 

The best player in terms of proximity to the hole from this distance on tour is Vaughan Taylor. And his average distance to the hole from this distance is 21 feet 8 inches. So on average (some being less, some being more, and some being a chip or bunker shot), one of the best players in the world is nearly 22 feet away from the hole.

 

Whats more, Vaughan is considerably more accurate from 150-175 yards than the tour average from this distance, which is 28.5 feet from the hole. Over 9 yards away from the hole.

 

On the one hand, this takes some of the pressure away. Dont always think the TV represents whats really going on. Youre only watching the absolute best shots hit all day on a delay, and the leading groups, who are by definition usually playing very well to get the TV time.

 

You arent seeing players who are hitting it to 25 feet, or aiming away from the flag deliberately, etc etc.

 

But...... these are players who are regularly shooting -2, -3 on a normal day, -6 and -7 on a hot day......

 

So one of the absolute keys to scoring well is LAG PUTTING. the ability to roll the ball close to the hole from such distances that you leave yourself without a stressful little 4 or 5 footer to hole. Its an area of the game almost no one seems to work on at amateur level. Bizarrely, a lot of amateurs dont even seem to think putting is a part of the game, they only refer to their "good shots" being full swing shots, rather than any kind of putt.

 

When you tidy up the short game, youll be amazed at how quickly youll see gains in your scores relative to the amount of effort youd need to put into the long game.

 

Breaking 90 is a great milestone too, and one that will stand you in great stead moving forwards!

My iron play has always been shit - the worst part of my game. My driving was O.K. and I'd hit 50-60% of fairways, but probably less than 25% GIR

 

Knowing this to be true, I put all my practice effort into chipping and putting and my scrambling stats became the most important part of my round.

 

When I got down to 6 h'cap (briefly), is was purely due to getting up and down more often than not. I was always scrambling to make par and made very few birdies. Pretty much always keeping a six off my card also helped.

 

Just goes to prove that you don't have to be a bomber or an iron wizard to be a single figure golfer.

 

Like you say, short game is everything really and even those with a technically bad swing (like me) can still break 80 on a good day (and with the right mental game)

 

[purpleronnie]

Haven't played a round of golf in maybe. 30 years.  When I did I would use a 3 iron and a pitching wedge 90% of the time.  I would more often than not get on the green putting for par or birdy.  My problem was putting, I just couldn't get to grips with it.  Having read some of this thread I wonder if I had stuck with it what handicap I would be now as looking back I was pretty talented with the iron.

[The Bear]

6 hours ago, Smashing-Pumpkin said:

Hi mate

 

I think youve hit on something there that will really stand you in good stead as you improve. When you mention not getting your approach shots close, this is because people actually dont get their shots close. And by that, I mean everyone! (no, genuinely).

 

Lets take the best player from the PGA Tour stats from 150-175 yards from the hole. The typical "150 yard marker" distance, where lets call 175 the back, and 150 front to middle.

 

The best player in terms of proximity to the hole from this distance on tour is Vaughan Taylor. And his average distance to the hole from this distance is 21 feet 8 inches. So on average (some being less, some being more, and some being a chip or bunker shot), one of the best players in the world is nearly 22 feet away from the hole.

 

Whats more, Vaughan is considerably more accurate from 150-175 yards than the tour average from this distance, which is 28.5 feet from the hole. Over 9 yards away from the hole.

 

On the one hand, this takes some of the pressure away. Dont always think the TV represents whats really going on. Youre only watching the absolute best shots hit all day on a delay, and the leading groups, who are by definition usually playing very well to get the TV time.

 

You arent seeing players who are hitting it to 25 feet, or aiming away from the flag deliberately, etc etc.

 

But...... these are players who are regularly shooting -2, -3 on a normal day, -6 and -7 on a hot day......

 

So one of the absolute keys to scoring well is LAG PUTTING. the ability to roll the ball close to the hole from such distances that you leave yourself without a stressful little 4 or 5 footer to hole. Its an area of the game almost no one seems to work on at amateur level. Bizarrely, a lot of amateurs dont even seem to think putting is a part of the game, they only refer to their "good shots" being full swing shots, rather than any kind of putt.

 

When you tidy up the short game, youll be amazed at how quickly youll see gains in your scores relative to the amount of effort youd need to put into the long game.

 

Breaking 90 is a great milestone too, and one that will stand you in great stead moving forwards!

Agreed. Lag putting is something I used to be very good at, but maybe not as good now. If I have a 30 footer then I usually leave it within 4-5 feet. Not always though. That's when the 3 putts come in. 

 

Short 1-2 foot puuts that have a lot of break too. Horrible little ones. 

 

Edited 5 June 2022 by The Bear

[Guest Manini]

9 hours ago, Izzy said:

I spend far too long following golfers on YouTube - literally hours a day. There's so much quality content these days and I probably subscribe to at least 30 different golf channels.

 

Here's my top 10 and would be interested to know who anyone else subscribes to:

 

1. Good Good - 6 US lads who are all decent players in their own right. Great banter, competition and podcasts

2. Micha Morris golf (from Good Good) 27 year old trying to make it on the PGA tour, hits it a mile

3. gm_golf - Garrett Clark (also from Good Good) 

4. Grant Horvat golf (also from Good Good) only a young guy but a great instructor

5. Bryan Bros Golf - Wesley & George Bryan (Wesley has won on the PGA tour) - both amazing players

6. Fore Play (Barstool sports) 4 average golfers who swear a lot

7. Rick Shiels - his game is crap these days but he gets some great guests on (recently played against Westwood & Fleetwood)

8. Peter Finch Golf (love his 'quest for the Open' series)

9. Not A Scratch Golfer (Canadian bloke plays off about 7 who I can relate to)

10. Golf Mates (Liam and his mates from Bolton is good fun)

 

Could easily list another 10 and recently started following BDC who gives a good insight into life on tour. 

 

 

Give Bob Does Sports a go. Not serious in the slightest but it’s a good laugh. 

[Izzy]

So Phil the thrill is confirmed teeing it up at Centurian after all and committing himself to LIV golf.

 

Things are gonna get really interesting (and very messy)

 

Strap yourself in and grab your popcorn as the world of professional golf is about to be turned upside down.

[Smashing-Pumpkin]

3 hours ago, Izzy said:

So Phil the thrill is confirmed teeing it up at Centurian after all and committing himself to LIV golf.

 

Things are gonna get really interesting (and very messy)

 

Strap yourself in and grab your popcorn as the world of professional golf is about to be turned upside down.

I think the Saudi league makes perfect sense for someone like Phil, Poulter, McDowell.....no cuts, huge money, and at a stage of their career where cutting back on events and not relying on DP world/PGA tour exemption status is crucial.

 

But from a Saudi point of view, you cant build a multi million dollar tour around the worlds B list players, its just not going to attract tv or the sponsors.

 

Its the players like Oliver Fisher or some of the lesser DP world guys that surprise me. 3 years of Saudi League theyll almost certainly lose their cards on DP world and be left with nowhere to play after theve cashed in for a few years. Just seems a totally unviable career move.

[The Year Of The Fox]

On 05/06/2022 at 08:50, Izzy said:

I spend far too long following golfers on YouTube - literally hours a day. There's so much quality content these days and I probably subscribe to at least 30 different golf channels.

 

Here's my top 10 and would be interested to know who anyone else subscribes to:

 

1. Good Good - 6 US lads who are all decent players in their own right. Great banter, competition and podcasts

2. Micha Morris golf (from Good Good) 27 year old trying to make it on the PGA tour, hits it a mile

3. gm_golf - Garrett Clark (also from Good Good) 

4. Grant Horvat golf (also from Good Good) only a young guy but a great instructor

5. Bryan Bros Golf - Wesley & George Bryan (Wesley has won on the PGA tour) - both amazing players

6. Fore Play (Barstool sports) 4 average golfers who swear a lot

7. Rick Shiels - his game is crap these days but he gets some great guests on (recently played against Westwood & Fleetwood)

8. Peter Finch Golf (love his 'quest for the Open' series)

9. Not A Scratch Golfer (Canadian bloke plays off about 7 who I can relate to)

10. Golf Mates (Liam and his mates from Bolton is good fun)

 

Could easily list another 10 and recently started following BDC who gives a good insight into life on tour. 

 

 

Danny Maude and Me and My Golf are very good. The latter are in with TaylorMade and so manage to get small coaching lessons with the likes of DJ and Rory.

 

Though they’re more Facebook than YouTube 

[Izzy]

7 hours ago, Smashing-Pumpkin said:

I think the Saudi league makes perfect sense for someone like Phil, Poulter, McDowell.....no cuts, huge money, and at a stage of their career where cutting back on events and not relying on DP world/PGA tour exemption status is crucial.

 

But from a Saudi point of view, you cant build a multi million dollar tour around the worlds B list players, its just not going to attract tv or the sponsors.

 

Its the players like Oliver Fisher or some of the lesser DP world guys that surprise me. 3 years of Saudi League theyll almost certainly lose their cards on DP world and be left with nowhere to play after theve cashed in for a few years. Just seems a totally unviable career move.

I see our very own Arlo White is heading up the commentary team on LIVGolf.com (apparently Darren Clarke turned down millions to offer his expert analysis)

 

I reckon it'll all boil down to exactly what 'sanctions' the PGA/DP World Tour can inflict and the legalities around this. Greg Norman seems quite bullish that players should be free to play on any tour and LIV are happy to 'defend' any player if it goes to the courts.

 

LIV getting DJ to head this up is a big move and I wonder if the likes of Brookes Koepka seeing his brother potentially earn more money than him might also turn his head.

 

Phil says he'll still be playing the majors so if LIV ends up offering OWGR points and players can still play the majors (apart from the PGA maybe) then I can see other big names eventually joining.

[Izzy]

Now DJ 'resigns' from the PGA Tour along with Kevin Na (in a move to avoid any fines/sanctions I imagine)

 

Means he also gives up the chance to play in future Ryder Cups which is a real shame (considering he was the best player at Whistling Straights)

 

Edited 7 June 2022 by Izzy

[kingfox]

Sad to see greed take over but unsurprising in the cases of some players.

 

Seeing it built up with players in their late 30’s/early 40’s and a bunch of nobodies isn’t an attractive look, you had a feeling they’d get one headline act in DJ, but looking at the rest of the field it doesn’t scream “Please watch us”. 
 

I wouldn’t be surprised if a number of other players are sitting by, waiting to watch what happens, waiting to see what the consequences will be from the PGA, then they’ll make a decision. 
 

If you get some players at their peak moving over, then that’s when the concern really starts. 

[Smashing-Pumpkin]

1 hour ago, kingfox said:

Sad to see greed take over but unsurprising in the cases of some players.

 

Seeing it built up with players in their late 30’s/early 40’s and a bunch of nobodies isn’t an attractive look, you had a feeling they’d get one headline act in DJ, but looking at the rest of the field it doesn’t scream “Please watch us”. 
 

I wouldn’t be surprised if a number of other players are sitting by, waiting to watch what happens, waiting to see what the consequences will be from the PGA, then they’ll make a decision. 
 

If you get some players at their peak moving over, then that’s when the concern really starts. 

I think youre right, but i also think in some ways its not even just a case of sanctions.

 

The main players are going to want to hold a PGA Tour card and a DP World Tour card, so they can pick and choose their events.

 

If youve got a guy who also wants to hold a Saudi League card (which i dont even know what the exemption categories are on that tour), then I dont know how a top player plays the minimum number of events on all tours including Saudi, plays them well enough they keep their card on all three tours, and has a schedule that works to peak for the majors all at the same time.

 

To someone like G-Mac, i suppose it doesnt matter about holding a card on either tour. On DP world id assume he still gets most events he wants through career money exemption. On PGA Tour, even if he was to lose his card, he would still get a decent amount of events on conditional status outside the top 115 and sponsors invites, so its not so much of a big deal.

 

But the guys who only play one tour, the likes of Wiesberger, Oliver Fisher, Justin Harding.......... these guys are basically going to either get sanctionned or lose their DP cards through falling outside the order of merit to keep their cards.

 

Is their ambition just to play a few years on Saudi, lose their cards and just think stuff it im done? thats incredibly sad if true.

 

If Greg Norman's ambition to have "free agents" is true, then I dont know how he envisages filling the field every week for the Saudi events. Or else how does a player who WANTS to play Saudi know which events he is exempt for and which he isnt once the tour grows?

 

The logical solution all round is surely to co sanction the Saudi League events with DP World Tour, which increases the DP prize fund and should attract decent fields, so its win win for both governing bodies.

[kingfox]

1 hour ago, Smashing-Pumpkin said:

I think youre right, but i also think in some ways its not even just a case of sanctions.

 

The main players are going to want to hold a PGA Tour card and a DP World Tour card, so they can pick and choose their events.

 

If youve got a guy who also wants to hold a Saudi League card (which i dont even know what the exemption categories are on that tour), then I dont know how a top player plays the minimum number of events on all tours including Saudi, plays them well enough they keep their card on all three tours, and has a schedule that works to peak for the majors all at the same time.

 

To someone like G-Mac, i suppose it doesnt matter about holding a card on either tour. On DP world id assume he still gets most events he wants through career money exemption. On PGA Tour, even if he was to lose his card, he would still get a decent amount of events on conditional status outside the top 115 and sponsors invites, so its not so much of a big deal.

 

But the guys who only play one tour, the likes of Wiesberger, Oliver Fisher, Justin Harding.......... these guys are basically going to either get sanctionned or lose their DP cards through falling outside the order of merit to keep their cards.

 

Is their ambition just to play a few years on Saudi, lose their cards and just think stuff it im done? thats incredibly sad if true.

 

If Greg Norman's ambition to have "free agents" is true, then I dont know how he envisages filling the field every week for the Saudi events. Or else how does a player who WANTS to play Saudi know which events he is exempt for and which he isnt once the tour grows?

 

The logical solution all round is surely to co sanction the Saudi League events with DP World Tour, which increases the DP prize fund and should attract decent fields, so its win win for both governing bodies.

In other words, things could get seriously complicated  

 

It’s just a sit back and waiting game atm I think, see how this week goes, see what sanctions are dished out and go from there. That’s why I said I wouldn’t be surprised if some players are sitting back to see what happens.

 

In the case of DJ & Kevin Na, for them to resign from the PGA tour, it very much feels like they are jumping the gun. The way Kevin Na spoke in his press conference, he seemed happy to throw his eggs all in one basket, was extremely adamant that the LIV is the place to be and more top players will follow. If that ends up not being the case, then he would have shot himself in the foot and be left with a case of What next? 
 

You look at the 40 year olds, the type who are not challenging anymore, out of their prime and past their sell by date, it’s no surprise to see them make this move, listening to Martin Kaymer talking about where he’s at in his career, this move is very much a way of trying something different in Golf while making easy buck, very easy to have that thought process when you’re not challenging nowadays.

 

Looking at the likes of DJ, Gooch, Na & Oosthuizen, players who are competing at a high level, this move clearly strikes as greed.

 

For the DP World tour bunch, Asian players and Amateurs, as you say, what is their ambition from this?

 

Looking at the format and the field, besides from the money aspect, is it an attractive place to play, right now you’d have to say no. 
 

Right now it’s just a case of sitting back and seeing how this week materialises.

[Super_horns]

I read on the BBC Dustin Johnson was getting paid 150 million dollars to play !?

 

I mean lottery winners don’t get that much.

[The Year Of The Fox]

26 minutes ago, Super_horns said:

I read on the BBC Dustin Johnson was getting paid 150 million dollars to play !?

 

I mean lottery winners don’t get that much.

Tiger was offered just shy of €1bn apparently 

[tom27111]

2 minutes ago, The Year Of The Fox said:

Tiger was offered just shy of €1bn apparently 

I'm available for free.

 

I'd obviously miss the cut, but it saves me a minimum of £60 for two rounds of golf!

 

I'd be incredible entertainment too.

[kingfox]

Can’t wait to see Kevin Yuan tee it up, what a cringeworthy shitshow this looks  

 

[Izzy]

7 hours ago, kingfox said:

Can’t wait to see Kevin Yuan tee it up, what a cringeworthy shitshow this looks  

 

Those team names  

 

 

 

 

[kingfox]

2 hours ago, Izzy said:

Those team names  

 

 

 

 

The Smash GC logo 

 

Fits in with the team though which is also shit.

[Jiggers the Fox]

Bryson and Reed joining now too 

[kingfox]

These fvcking team names 

[Izzy]

29 minutes ago, Jiggers the Fox said:

Bryson and Reed joining now too 

It's all about 'growing the game' 

 

 

 

[Zear0]

What channel is it being shown on?  Love watching a potential farce.

[Izzy]

14 minutes ago, Zear0 said:

What channel is it being shown on?  Love watching a potential farce.

I think you can only stream it via the LIVgolf.com website initially.

 

It's gonna be weird having a shotgun start at 2pm with everyone on the course at the same time.

 

And don't forget to watch the Jessie J concert there after Saturdays play 

 

 

[Izzy]