Bayfox Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 More than 1k have gone to join IS from the UK alone I believe Yep and in belgium they suggest upwards of 1k and maybe as many as 3. Yet we hand our power to............ Doing a good job over there.
GaelicFox Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 I think this is being made to national again and missing the fact it's international. Can't think of any reason for Brits to sing the French anthem. In fact I'd find it quite embarrassing. Most don't know how to sing the full version of God save the queen And some tool is suggesting they sing in French
Alf Bentley Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 More than 1k have gone to join IS from the UK alone I believe The official figures I heard were 700-800 from UK, about 1000 from France and the "proportionally highest numbers" from Belgium (so, I imagine 500-ish, as the population of Belgium is much smaller?). A tiny proportion as Fuchsntf says, but still a worryingly high figure in absolute terms. I hope - and expect - monitoring of those who return to be a very high priority for the security services.
ramboacdc Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Most don't know how to sing the full version of God save the queen And some tool is suggesting they sing in French it kind of rhymes: Dieu sauve notre gracieuse reine! Vive notre noble reine! Dieu sauve la reine! Envoyez-lui victorieux, Heureuse et glorieuse, Longue de régner sur nous, Dieu sauve la reine. Tes plus belles cadeaux en magasin Sur son serons heureux de verser, Qu'elle règne longtemps. Peut-elle défendre nos lois, Et donnons-nous jamais la cause, Pour chanter avec le cœur et la voix, Dieu sauve la reine.
GaelicFox Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 I don't think my Dad would have spoken out publicly against IRA recruiters. He had more desire for self-preservation than that....though he did tell the priest that he doubted God's existence and was told to go away and examine his conscience. Like most Irish in past decades, I assume that most Muslims are too busy making a living and sustaining their families to go chasing after young radicals, unless the radicals happen to be in their own family or directly affect them. Most Muslims over 30 will probably know little about such radicals. That may be an argument for intervention at the level of a generation (the young), not that of the "Muslim community" as a whole, if such a monolith exists. So, if people were preaching hate in the streets of Luton, did you challenge them? If not, why not? It's your country too, isn't it? Are you implicitly accepting that the country should be divided into different cultural communities? I'm not saying that because I'm some sort of hero who'd have intervened. I'm not. I might challenge a white supremacist, Islamist or pro-IRA person in the street, but only if I had the time and didn't feel in danger. Society as a whole and its agents (teachers, parents, police, youth workers, probation officers, politicians) should be tackling this. As a young man who sometimes frequented Irish pubs, I usually declined to buy a copy of "An Phoblacht" (the pro-Irish Republican paper), but I did buy it a couple of times when I sensed that there were some serious pro-IRA types in the pub. Likewise, there's a bloke a couple of doors down from me who keeps yelling foul drunken abuse and violent threats at his flatmate (and I've heard that he has a prison record for violence). As a young, single man, I might well have had a word with him and asked him to cool it - but I wouldn't now, partly due to age but mainly because I'd be concerned about the potential impact on my daughter. Is it realistic to expect individual Muslims (office/factory workers, housewives, pensioners, shopkeepers) to police young people from Muslim families who go off the rails (sometimes without the knowledge of their own families/neighbours) or get recruited by extremists? Certainly, mosques can ensure that hate preachers aren't allowed access to their premises - but last night's programme suggested that most such recruitment in France/Belgium took place online or in prisons, not at mosques. Siddique Khan recruited the other 7/7 bombers via a youth group/health centre, I think. While Muslim communities, families, mosques and youth groups have a role to play, I don't accept this idea that it's down to the "Muslim community" to "police their own". That accepts the very ideas promoted by the Jihadists - that Muslims should be a separate group from the rest of society. All sorts of people have differences in the lives they lead because of their age, gender, race, religion, sexuality, whatever. As a society, we should be encouraging MORE contact and understanding between different groups, not saying: "you're different, you police your own!". Your relating too much of your western understanding and experience to a community that has no such tollerance or desire to be like that These people are preparing and interacting on huge scales accross huge platforms The IRA was generally 50 men/terrorists we have maybe 10-15k Europeans fighting a jihadi war That's organisation on a level we cannot comprehend I will say this now not one suicide bomber goes to his 36 Virgins without at least half a dozen people being aware that it was a "potential" outcome They need to rat and keep ratting till we round up these cretins ! They don't rat ! Why don't they ? Because it's the will of Allah ! Scary but true
GaelicFox Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 it kind of rhymes: Dieu sauve notre gracieuse reine! Vive notre noble reine! Dieu sauve la reine! Envoyez-lui victorieux, Heureuse et glorieuse, Longue de régner sur nous, Dieu sauve la reine. Tes plus belles cadeaux en magasin Sur son serons heureux de verser, Qu'elle règne longtemps. Peut-elle défendre nos lois, Et donnons-nous jamais la cause, Pour chanter avec le cœur et la voix, Dieu sauve la reine. I can't wait to hear someone from Dagenham blast that ****er out Will sound like a backwards version of allo allo !
Alf Bentley Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Most don't know how to sing the full version of God save the queen And some tool is suggesting they sing in French Maybe I'm an unrealistic romantic, but I'm expecting a good response - even if most of the English fans just "la-la-la" along to the French anthem. The tune of the French anthem is well enough known. I also hope that the French fans reciprocate and sing "God save the Queen", but maybe I'm taking my romanticism too far there.
ramboacdc Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Maybe I'm an unrealistic romantic, but I'm expecting a good response - even if most of the English fans just "la-la-la" along to the French anthem. The tune of the French anthem is well enough known. I also hope that the French fans reciprocate and sing "God save the Queen", but maybe I'm taking my romanticism too far there. i dont understand why some people wont even do that to the french anthem. "i wont sing another countries anthem" and all that jazz...its a song. who gives a shit?
Bayfox Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Maybe I'm an unrealistic romantic, but I'm expecting a good response - even if most of the English fans just "la-la-la" along to the French anthem. The tune of the French anthem is well enough known. I also hope that the French fans reciprocate and sing "God save the Queen", but maybe I'm taking my romanticism too far there. I'd take us not booing, that would be enough.
MooseBreath Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 The official figures I heard were 700-800 from UK, about 1000 from France and the "proportionally highest numbers" from Belgium (so, I imagine 500-ish, as the population of Belgium is much smaller?). A tiny proportion as Fuchsntf says, but still a worryingly high figure in absolute terms. I hope - and expect - monitoring of those who return to be a very high priority for the security services. They're amazingly high numbers, given how much commitment it requires. Can't help but wonder what multiple of those numbers covers those people who 'only' support ISIS, but who aren't willing or able to physically give up everything to join them.
ramboacdc Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 I can't wait to hear someone from Dagenham blast that ****er out Will sound like a backwards version of allo allo ! the french anthem doesn't translate well into english! Arise children of the fatherland, The day of glory has come! Against us from the tyrany The bloody banner is raised! (bis) Do you hear in the countryside, Blared the wild soldiers? They are coming into our arms Slay our son, our wives! To arms, citizens! Form your battalions! Walk! Walk! Only an impure blood Water our furrows! Sacred love of country, Lead, support our avenging arms! Freedom, liberty cherie, Fight with your defenders! (bis) Under our flags, let victory Hurries to your manly! May your enemies expiring See your triumph and our glory! We will enter careers When our elders are no longer there; We shall find their dust And the mark of their virtues. Much less jealous of surviving them Than sharing their coffins, We have the sublime pride Of avenging or following them!
David Guiza Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 i dont understand why some people wont even do that to the french anthem. "i wont sing another countries anthem" and all that jazz...its a song. who gives a shit? The same people who have been sharing the lyrics to 'Imagine' on Facebook 'imagine there's no countries'. I'm all for supporting England in every sport/competition, but it is meaningless in comparison to real life tragedy. Football has brought people together on numerous occasions, from world wars to games between countries like Iran and America etc, you'd like to think people could put their feelings aside for 90 minutes and hopefully (big wish) enjoy a good game of football.
GaelicFox Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Maybe I'm an unrealistic romantic, but I'm expecting a good response - even if most of the English fans just "la-la-la" along to the French anthem. The tune of the French anthem is well enough known. I also hope that the French fans reciprocate and sing "God save the Queen", but maybe I'm taking my romanticism too far there. Stick to porn , romance is ohh so overrated
GaelicFox Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 the french anthem doesn't translate well into english! Arise children of the fatherland, The day of glory has come! Against us from the tyrany The bloody banner is raised! (bis) Do you hear in the countryside, Blared the wild soldiers? They are coming into our arms Slay our son, our wives! To arms, citizens! Form your battalions! Walk! Walk! Only an impure blood Water our furrows! Sacred love of country, Lead, support our avenging arms! Freedom, liberty cherie, Fight with your defenders! (bis) Under our flags, let victory Hurries to your manly! May your enemies expiring See your triumph and our glory! We will enter careers When our elders are no longer there; We shall find their dust And the mark of their virtues. Much less jealous of surviving them Than sharing their coffins, We have the sublime pride Of avenging or following them! Most people in Dagenham don't speak English either
Guest Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Do you seriously think that they immediately bomb everything the moment they find out about it? There's processes they need to go through to get clearance, there's check they need to do to make sure the target is credible, and then there's the fact that not destroying the place can uncover huge amounts of intel about what ISIS are doing and where they are targeting. And you seriously think that the process and clearance all happened on the evening of the Paris attacks.
Guest Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Of course, but FIF is almost suggesting there's a conspiracy that they've just bombed a random target No, I'm suggesting that if these places were known and worthy of a hit they should have been hit long ago. I think the ISIS HQ should have been hit very quickly before it moved. No point allowing the leaders to continue to operate and organize.
Guest Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 More to the point these anthems were sang against each other when we were at war. It's just a ludicrous idea. Listen to the French sing then applaud them. That's respect. the french anthem doesn't translate well into english! Arise children of the fatherland, The day of glory has come! Against us from the tyrany The bloody banner is raised! (bis) Do you hear in the countryside, Blared the wild soldiers? They are coming into our arms Slay our son, our wives! To arms, citizens! Form your battalions! Walk! Walk! Only an impure blood Water our furrows! Sacred love of country, Lead, support our avenging arms! Freedom, liberty cherie, Fight with your defenders! (bis) Under our flags, let victory Hurries to your manly! May your enemies expiring See your triumph and our glory! We will enter careers When our elders are no longer there; We shall find their dust And the mark of their virtues. Much less jealous of surviving them Than sharing their coffins, We have the sublime pride Of avenging or following them!
Guest MattP Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 La Marseillaise is actually very hard to sing from lyrics if you are trying it for the first time, it doesn't read well in a karaoke sense, 80,000 English blokes trying a rendition could be a absolute joke to be honest I'm with FIF here, it does a bit daft for us to be joining in.
Fox92 Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Can't they just play 'All You Need Is Love'. At least it opens with 'La Marseillaise'.
ramboacdc Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 More to the point these anthems were sang against each other when we were at war. It's just a ludicrous idea. Listen to the French sing then applaud them. That's respect. we have been at war with pretty much every country on the planet. that doesn't make sense.
Guest MattP Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Just sing Imagine. It has more meaning. I'd say that would be a tad inappropriate given some of the "organisations" John Lennon funded.
Bellend Sebastian Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Just play Stereolab and have everyone jump around a bit. If that doesn't show off what's great about France I don't know what does
Merging Cultures Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Just sing Imagine. It has more meaning. From Wikipedia: Lennon stated: "'Imagine', which says: 'Imagine that there was no more religion, no more country, no more politics,' is virtually the Communist manifesto, even though I'm not particularly a Communist and I do not belong to any movement." He told NME: "There is no real Communist state in the world; you must realize that. The Socialism I speak about ... [is] not the way some daft Russian might do it, or the Chinese might do it. That might suit them. Us, we should have a nice ... British Socialism." .
Rincewind Posted 17 November 2015 Posted 17 November 2015 Well my thought process was that Imagine has no country associated with it so can be impartial. Politics never entered my head. It has a message of peace.
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