Guest Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 1 minute ago, Buce said: Perhaps you should use words with fewer syllables. I thought I might be getting somewhere when he said getting rid of securities might not be a good idea. But alas I was wrong.
Webbo Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 9 minutes ago, toddybad said: I thought I might be getting somewhere when he said getting rid of securities might not be a good idea. But alas I was wrong. You must be use to that. 1
Guest Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 2 minutes ago, Webbo said: You must be use to that. We'll come back to this when recession hits.
Webbo Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 Just now, toddybad said: We'll come back to this when recession hits. And if it doesn't nobody will remember. You didn't answer my earlier question. Personal debt up , credit card spending down, which one of these things is bad?
Guest Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 (edited) I did note earlier that the figures actually counter my own argument to some extent. Let me be clear. Personal debt is bad. Personal debt is at record levels. Personal debt growth has reduced lately. It is impossible to know whether this is because of consumers tightening belts (as most commentators are suggesting, even in the tory press) or hitting their limits. Together with mortgage figures it suggests a crisis of consumer confidence. What seems extremely unlikely is that consumers suddenly have more money given that wages are falling in real terms. Edited 24 November 2017 by Guest
Izzy Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 32 minutes ago, toddybad said: I did note earlier that the figures actually counter my own argument to some extent. Let me be clear. Personal debt is bad. Personal debt is at record levels. Personal debt growth has reduced lately. It is impossible to know whether this is because of consumers tightening belts (as most commentators are suggesting, even in the tory press) or hitting their limits. Together with mortgage figures it suggests a crisis of consumer confidence. What seems extremely unlikely is that consumers suddenly have more money given that wages are falling in real terms. There doesn't seem to be much tightening of belts or a crisis of consumer confidence on the High Street today old bean... The Black Friday sales bonanza was on course for a record with consumers set to spend almost £8bn during what has become a four-day shopping event. Retail researchers said online sales would see the most growth on Friday. Shoppers are expected to spend £1.15bn - up 15% on the same day last year. On the High Street, sales were forecast to total £1.45bn, up 4% on 2016. 3
Guest Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said: There doesn't seem to be much tightening of belts or a crisis of consumer confidence on the High Street today old bean... The Black Friday sales bonanza was on course for a record with consumers set to spend almost £8bn during what has become a four-day shopping event. Retail researchers said online sales would see the most growth on Friday. Shoppers are expected to spend £1.15bn - up 15% on the same day last year. On the High Street, sales were forecast to total £1.45bn, up 4% on 2016. It'll be interesting to see sales over they black Friday and xmas period together. Taking just today's figures on their own doesn't really mean anything - either the figures you mention or the figures I've been talking about - we need to see how things are moving over time. Let's not forget that inflation of 3% means a 4% sales rise isn't actually that much. There's also been reports of very slow in store sales. Edited 24 November 2017 by Guest
Izzy Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 You know I love you really @toddybad but you're such a fvckin doom and gloom merchant sometimes. Half the problem in this country is people trying to talk us into recession and Brexit failing and looking at everything from a glass half empty perspective. 2
leicsmac Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 2 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said: You know I love you really @toddybad but you're such a fvckin doom and gloom merchant sometimes. Half the problem in this country is people trying to talk us into recession and Brexit failing and looking at everything from a glass half empty perspective. Tbh I agree with the sentiment here about attitudes. It's like folks saying we can't do anything about climate change and shouldn't change our energy policy because "reasons". Well yeah, of course we can't do anything about it if we stand around saying we can't, can we?
The Doctor Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 7 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said: You know I love you really @toddybad but you're such a fvckin doom and gloom merchant sometimes. Half the problem in this country is people trying to talk us into recession and Brexit failing and looking at everything from a glass half empty perspective. The bloke on the titanic pointing out the oncoming iceberg to be avoided was a doom and gloom merchant too tbf
Guest Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 11 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said: You know I love you really @toddybad but you're such a fvckin doom and gloom merchant sometimes. Half the problem in this country is people trying to talk us into recession and Brexit failing and looking at everything from a glass half empty perspective. 7 minutes ago, leicsmac said: Tbh I agree with the sentiment here about attitudes. It's like folks saying we can't do anything about climate change and shouldn't change our energy policy because "reasons". Well yeah, of course we can't do anything about it if we stand around saying we can't, can we? Thing is I'm saying there is something we can do about it. We're just not.
Rogstanley Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Izzy Muzzett said: You know I love you really @toddybad but you're such a fvckin doom and gloom merchant sometimes. Half the problem in this country is people trying to talk us into recession and Brexit failing and looking at everything from a glass half empty perspective. The real glass half empty perspective is the one which wishes us to become a closed off, isolated nation riddled by irrational fear, practicing old fashioned, tax dodging social conservatism with so little confidence in itself that it daren't not even invest to grow. Edited 24 November 2017 by Rogstanley
leicsmac Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 2 hours ago, toddybad said: Thing is I'm saying there is something we can do about it. We're just not. Yeah, perhaps I should have been clearer that I wasn't focusing on Brexit in the strictest sense here, but rather just talking about the attitude where people are perfectly happy to let tomorrow be just like today even though their own little world is alright with that. Which can be bad news further down the line for them and lots of other folks.
Guest Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 The government has committed to reimbursing Greater Manchester just £12m of the full £28m cost of dealing with the aftermath of the Manchester Arena bomb, leaving the NHS and other services “significantly short”, the region’s mayor, Andy Burnham, has said. On Friday, six months on from the attack on a concert by American singer Ariana Grande which killed 22 people, Burnham said he had received a letter from Theresa May saying the government would pay only the “reasonable costs” relating to the terrorist atrocity. In a statement, the government committed to covering just £12m of the total, while Burnham said the letter from the Home Office was “inconclusive” in terms of how much the government would pay back. “On the NHS they have met the mental health element but not other aspects of the massive extra costs the NHS incurred, including overtime and many other things, which looks like it will leave the NHS significantly short,” said Burnham. He claimed the government would not commit to paying in full a bill from Greater Manchester police (GMP) for its bomb-related costs. “On police costs they say: ‘We have got your bid and we will decide what’s reasonable,’” he said. “It’s not good enough. We’re not trying it on here. It’s all reasonable.” A government spokesperson said there had been a “strong assurance” that Manchester would receive £12m and added: “This is an ongoing process and the government stands by its commitment to provide all necessary further assistance.” Last week the prime minister told MPs the government would make available “the majority of funds”. Officers from all over the UK were drafted in to deal with public policing following the attack on an Ariana Grande concert at the arena. Further officers were drafted in to help with the criminal investigation, which resulted in the arrest of 23 people, the searching of 30 addresses and the seizure of more than 11,000 pieces of evidence. At least 100 officers are still working full time on the investigation; earlier this month, an extradition request was made for the bomber’s younger brother in Libya. The mayor said the government should have dealt with the arena bill in Wednesday’s budget, when the chancellor, Philip Hammond, promised £28mto the victims of the Grenfell fire. “It’s six months on now from the bomb in the week of the budget. At the time we were promised by various government minister and officials that we would get whatever we needed. They have done the right thing by Grenfell and they should do the right thing by the people of Greater Manchester too. I am not quibbling over one penny of what the Grenfell people have got, because they absolutely deserve it. But the same principles should apply for Greater Manchester,” he said. Burnham said he sent a letter to the prime minister about four months ago with a detailed breakdown of the £28m costs Greater Manchester will have to spend dealing with the events of 22 May. That includes £17m already spent, largely on policing and NHS, he said, plus an additional £11m for the inquests of the 22 victims, as well as for the bomber Salman Abedi, and for an independent review being carried out by Lord Kerslake. According to Burnham, the £28m figure consists of £9.8m in policing costs, £2.6m in mental health support, and nearly £3.7m in NHS and ambulance service expenditure in the aftermath of the bombing. An additional £5m has been requested to cover the cost of coroner inquests relating to the attack and Greater Manchester has requested £7m to counter the negative economic consequences of the suicide bombing and to add to the We Love Manchester emergency fund. If the government did not pay up in full, it would lead to further cuts in public services in Greater Manchester, Burnham said. “It’s not acceptable.” Sir Richard Leese, the leader of Manchester city council, said: “We were assured at the time of the Manchester Arena attack that the costs incurred by the city’s public services as a result of that terrible event would be fully supported by government. This still hasn’t happened. “While the government has gone some way towards addressing this, for example through a donation of £1m to meet the administrative costs of the We Love Manchester Emergency Fund, their response is incomplete and inconclusive. Manchester will continue to push to ensure that those costs are met in full so there is no knock-on effect on our budget for public services.”
Izzy Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 Another negative doom and gloom article Toddy. Are your motives just to have a constant dig at the government? Why post it?
Jimothy Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 1 minute ago, Izzy Muzzett said: Another negative doom and gloom article Toddy. Are your motives just to have a constant dig at the government? Why post it? Because it's a politics thread and that's about what our government is doing. You can't post negatives if there's no negatives to post. Or should we avoid talking about how shit this government are to spare you feelings of being upset when their failings are pointed out? 2
Izzy Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 5 minutes ago, Facecloth said: Because it's a politics thread and that's about what our government is doing. You can't post negatives if there's no negatives to post. Or should we avoid talking about how shit this government are to spare you feelings of being upset when their failings are pointed out? Doesn't upset me in the slightest. If Toddy feels better by constantly posting articles slagging off the government then good for him. But why post it in isolation with no questions, view point or comments? I thought this thread was about discussion not just posting negative articles for the sake of it...
Guest Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 11 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said: Doesn't upset me in the slightest. If Toddy feels better by constantly posting articles slagging off the government then good for him. But why post it in isolation with no questions, view point or comments? I thought this thread was about discussion not just posting negative articles for the sake of it... It was posted as it is news to spark discussion. Feel free to give us some positive information about the government we can discuss.
Izzy Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 4 minutes ago, toddybad said: It was posted as it is news to spark discussion. Feel free to give us some positive information about the government we can discuss. Feel free to spark the discussion on it seeing as you posted it!!
Wymsey Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 33 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said: Another negative doom and gloom article Toddy. Are your motives just to have a constant dig at the government? Why post it? 2 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said: Feel free to spark the discussion on it seeing as you posted it!! Maybe, without being rude, you need a break from this thread for a day or two? This thread can be understandably frustrating on a complex topic, but there's no point in getting annoyed by it?
Izzy Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 Just now, Wymeswold fox said: Maybe, without being rude, you need a break from this thread for a day or two? This thread can be understandably frustrating on a complex topic, but there's no point in getting annoyed by it? You're polite Wymesy - I like that Trust me mate, I'm far from annoyed
Guest Kopfkino Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 (edited) Edit: Thinking about its different actually Edited 25 November 2017 by Kopfkino
Guest Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 4 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said: You're polite Wymesy - I like that Trust me mate, I'm far from annoyed Not really sure why your comments are what they are tbh.
Izzy Posted 24 November 2017 Posted 24 November 2017 (edited) 38 minutes ago, toddybad said: Not really sure why your comments are what they are tbh. Wymsey is probably right, I should give this thread a wide berth for a bit. The constant negativity on here is becoming too much for me in my old age I think Edited 25 November 2017 by Izzy Muzzett
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