Premier League 2024/25

[Finnegan]

16 hours ago, StanSP said:

He's not wrong to be fair... 

 

 

He's not but it's still incredible how quickly a stint at Spurs can turn you from one of the most likeable, affable coaches in British football to one of the most bitter and constantly whinging. 

 

Edited 17 February by Finnegan

[Md9]

Can’t believe how bad Man Utd have been this season. Spurs will no don’t go and lose to Ipswich next game after beating the worse Utd side in forever . Ange didn’t help himself with injuries either rushing back both Romero and vdv and then both going off injured again straight away. 

[Sly]

Promoted Teams Relegated from the Premier League the following Season 

 

1992-93: Crystal Palace (1/3)

1993-94: Swindon Town (1/3)

1994-95: Leicester City, Ipswich Town (2/3)

1995-96: Bolton Wanderers (1/3)

1996-97: Sunderland (1/3)

1997-98: Barnsley, Bolton Wanderers (2/3)

1998-99: Charlton Athletic (1/3)

1999-00: Watford (1/3)

2000-01: None (0/3)

2001-02: None (0/3)

2002-03: West Bromwich Albion (1/3)

2003-04: Leicester City (1/3)

2004-05: Crystal Palace (1/3)

2005-06: Sunderland (1/3)

2006-07: Watford, Sheffield United (2/3)

2007-08: Derby County (1/3)

2008-09: West Bromwich Albion (1/3)

2009-10: Burnley (1/3)

2010-11: Blackpool (1/3)

2011-12: None (0/3)

2012-13: Reading, QPR (2/3)

2013-14: None (0/3)

2014-15: Burnley, QPR (2/3)

2015-16: Norwich City (1/3)

2016-17: Hull City (1/3)

2017-18: None (0/3)

2018-19: Fulham, Cardiff City (2/3)

2019-20: Norwich City (1/3)

2020-21: Fulham, WBA (2/3)

2021-22: Norwich City, Watford (2/3)

2022-23: None (0/3)

 

2023-24 - At this stage, could all three go? It’s never happened before, however if the gap continues to widen, it could become a stark reality that PSR isn’t a sustainable model when joining the league. 

[Nalis]

3 hours ago, Sly said:

Promoted Teams Relegated from the Premier League the following Season 

 

1992-93: Crystal Palace (1/3)

1993-94: Swindon Town (1/3)

1994-95: Leicester City, Ipswich Town (2/3)

1995-96: Bolton Wanderers (1/3)

1996-97: Sunderland (1/3)

1997-98: Barnsley, Bolton Wanderers (2/3)

1998-99: Charlton Athletic (1/3)

1999-00: Watford (1/3)

2000-01: None (0/3)

2001-02: None (0/3)

2002-03: West Bromwich Albion (1/3)

2003-04: Leicester City (1/3)

2004-05: Crystal Palace (1/3)

2005-06: Sunderland (1/3)

2006-07: Watford, Sheffield United (2/3)

2007-08: Derby County (1/3)

2008-09: West Bromwich Albion (1/3)

2009-10: Burnley (1/3)

2010-11: Blackpool (1/3)

2011-12: None (0/3)

2012-13: Reading, QPR (2/3)

2013-14: None (0/3)

2014-15: Burnley, QPR (2/3)

2015-16: Norwich City (1/3)

2016-17: Hull City (1/3)

2017-18: None (0/3)

2018-19: Fulham, Cardiff City (2/3)

2019-20: Norwich City (1/3)

2020-21: Fulham, WBA (2/3)

2021-22: Norwich City, Watford (2/3)

2022-23: None (0/3)

 

2023-24 - At this stage, could all three go? It’s never happened before, however if the gap continues to widen, it could become a stark reality that PSR isn’t a sustainable model when joining the league. 

All 3 went in 23-24. You are thinking 24-25, when all 3 will probably go down again

[Sly]

2 minutes ago, Nalis said:

All 3 went in 23-24. You are thinking 24-25, when all 3 will probably go down again

Bizarrely I thought only two of the three had gone in 23/24. It was early…… 

[Nalis]

1 minute ago, Sly said:

Bizarrely I thought only two of the three had gone in 23/24. It was early…… 

Was a good post though. Completely forgot who the 3rd team who got relegated were in our great escape season, was trying to think of it before giving up and searching for the answer.

[Sly]

1 hour ago, Nalis said:

Was a good post though. Completely forgot who the 3rd team who got relegated were in our great escape season, was trying to think of it before giving up and searching for the answer.

Thank you! Took me an age to type out on my phone at 3AM!
 

Either way, if we end up getting two years of the all the promoted teams getting relegated, it makes the situation worse if anything. Especially when you consider the recent history of Leicester. Southampton finished 6th in 15/16 as well. 
 

Both have been mismanaged, however I think this correlation in expenditure against incomings is generating a wider divide. T

Manchester United will fall further behind as they’ll now be crippled by PSR themselves. So we go back to a big four / five (Man City, Arsenal, Liverpool, Tottenham, Chelsea) and and a disrupter for the season (Forest).

 

How long before the likes of Newcastle, Villa, Chelsea etc fall into this trap also? All that’s keeping some of them up in reality, is how poor the teams coming up are. 
 

 

[Super_horns]

Aren’t they changing the PSR rules which might make a difference to the levels required and punishment?

[FoxesBraun]

6 hours ago, Sly said:

Promoted Teams Relegated from the Premier League the following Season 

 

1992-93: Crystal Palace (1/3)

1993-94: Swindon Town (1/3)

1994-95: Leicester City, Ipswich Town (2/3)

1995-96: Bolton Wanderers (1/3)

1996-97: Sunderland (1/3)

1997-98: Barnsley, Bolton Wanderers (2/3)

1998-99: Charlton Athletic (1/3)

1999-00: Watford (1/3)

2000-01: None (0/3)

2001-02: None (0/3)

2002-03: West Bromwich Albion (1/3)

2003-04: Leicester City (1/3)

2004-05: Crystal Palace (1/3)

2005-06: Sunderland (1/3)

2006-07: Watford, Sheffield United (2/3)

2007-08: Derby County (1/3)

2008-09: West Bromwich Albion (1/3)

2009-10: Burnley (1/3)

2010-11: Blackpool (1/3)

2011-12: None (0/3)

2012-13: Reading, QPR (2/3)

2013-14: None (0/3)

2014-15: Burnley, QPR (2/3)

2015-16: Norwich City (1/3)

2016-17: Hull City (1/3)

2017-18: None (0/3)

2018-19: Fulham, Cardiff City (2/3)

2019-20: Norwich City (1/3)

2020-21: Fulham, WBA (2/3)

2021-22: Norwich City, Watford (2/3)

2022-23: None (0/3)

 

2023-24 - At this stage, could all three go? It’s never happened before, however if the gap continues to widen, it could become a stark reality that PSR isn’t a sustainable model when joining the league. 

Really good post this.

 

But very concerned about the the direction it's heading in. 

 

Realistically this season all 3 who came up go down again, so what happens next year and who goes down?  Brentford, Fulham no because they now appear well established and financially comfortable. Forest and Bournemouth no, West Ham, Everton, Wolves, Palace highly unlikely unless one of them implodes like we did in 22/23.  So all of sudden you have 3 consecutive years of the promoted teams not standing a chance and you might as well close up shop. 

 

Something ought to change but I fear we're already created our own little super league here and as a club we have missed out big time because of our own incompetence. 

Edited 18 February by FoxesBraun

[AjcW]

I still think there's more to it than just PSR

 

Last season you had a fluke of a team in Luton coming up, they were never going to survive and look at them now... that wasn't to do with money, they spent plenty they just didn't know how to spend it! Sheffield United, worst defence the league has ever witnessed... again, they prioritised spend in other positions. 

 

This season, Ipswich are another Luton really, except they spent even more money but the majority of it has gone on creating a Championship superteam that will yoyo up and down for eternity

 

As for us and Southampton, it's just rank missmanagement, Saints owners are only interested in making profit from young talent, they invest in a squad that can get out of the Championship and exist in the premier league, spotlighting some of their youngsters and making 60-80m a season on transfers. I don't need to go into what's gone wrong for us.

 

Promoted teams shouldn't struggle because of PSR... no one has mentioned PSR in respect of Saints or Ipswich this season have they? 

 

I just think there's more too it personally.

[Spudulike]

Just looking at the footage of the new Everton stadium. Inside it looks like a bigger version of ours. Certainly generate more income for the owners but won't improve the fan experience. Clubs with new stadiums never win trophies unless they are Leicester City. And ManC (obvs).

Edited 18 February by Spudulike

[bmt]

1 minute ago, Spudulike said:

Just looking at the footage of the new Everton stadium. Inside it looks like a bigger version of ours. Certainly generate more income for the owners but won't improve the fan experience. Clubs with new stadiums never win trophies unless they are Leicester City.

Do you have a link for this? I was involved (in a tiny way) in the process of the early build from a sustainability perspective and would be keen to see how it's turned out.

[Spudulike]

7 minutes ago, bmt said:

Do you have a link for this? I was involved (in a tiny way) in the process of the early build from a sustainability perspective and would be keen to see how it's turned out.

Fast forward to about 24 mins...

 

 

[TheGoldenGod]

12 minutes ago, Spudulike said:

Just looking at the footage of the new Everton stadium. Inside it looks like a bigger version of ours. Certainly generate more income for the owners but won't improve the fan experience. Clubs with new stadiums never win trophies unless they are Leicester City. And ManC (obvs).

Funny you mention the fan experience because a lot has come out this weekend regarding West Ham's new ground being a far cry from the Boleyn ground in terms of atmosphere and and general experience and wonder of this will be the same...

[Footballwipe]

7 hours ago, Sly said:

Promoted Teams Relegated from the Premier League the following Season 

 

1992-93: Crystal Palace (1/3)

1993-94: Swindon Town (1/3)

1994-95: Leicester City, Ipswich Town (2/3)

1995-96: Bolton Wanderers (1/3)

1996-97: Sunderland (1/3)

1997-98: Barnsley, Bolton Wanderers (2/3)

1998-99: Charlton Athletic (1/3)

1999-00: Watford (1/3)

2000-01: None (0/3)

2001-02: None (0/3)

2002-03: West Bromwich Albion (1/3)

2003-04: Leicester City (1/3)

2004-05: Crystal Palace (1/3)

2005-06: Sunderland (1/3)

2006-07: Watford, Sheffield United (2/3)

2007-08: Derby County (1/3)

2008-09: West Bromwich Albion (1/3)

2009-10: Burnley (1/3)

2010-11: Blackpool (1/3)

2011-12: None (0/3)

2012-13: Reading, QPR (2/3)

2013-14: None (0/3)

2014-15: Burnley, QPR (2/3)

2015-16: Norwich City (1/3)

2016-17: Hull City (1/3)

2017-18: None (0/3)

2018-19: Fulham, Cardiff City (2/3)

2019-20: Norwich City (1/3)

2020-21: Fulham, WBA (2/3)

2021-22: Norwich City, Watford (2/3)

2022-23: None (0/3)

 

2023-24 - At this stage, could all three go? It’s never happened before, however if the gap continues to widen, it could become a stark reality that PSR isn’t a sustainable model when joining the league. 

All three went back down in 97/98. Missing Crystal Palace.

 

Missing Wolves 03/04 as they came up with us in 02/03

 

Ipswich didn't come up in 93/94 so shouldn't be on the 94/95 list. Palace did though so they should be there.

 

Man City went down 00/01 after being promoted in 99/00.

 

Missing Middlesbrough in 16/17 after they got promoted in 15/16.

 

Crystal Palace didn't get promoted in 91/92 so shouldn't be on the 92/93 list. Middlesbrough should be though.

 

I've not checked the other seasons out but just from the top of my head list list is quite inaccurate, even if the point about the gap widening is right.

Edited 18 February by Footballwipe

[StanSP]

5 minutes ago, TheGoldenGod said:

Funny you mention the fan experience because a lot has come out this weekend regarding West Ham's new ground being a far cry from the Boleyn ground in terms of atmosphere and and general experience and wonder of this will be the same...

Distance to the pitch is probably the biggest difference. There's a really steep stand which makes it feel very imposing or gets fans to feel very close to the pitch. 

 

Apparently transport is a major issue for fans that went last night. And that's only 10,000 allowed. Public transport infrastructure needs to be improved. 

[izzymuzzet]

13 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Distance to the pitch is probably the biggest difference. There's a really steep stand which makes it feel very imposing or gets fans to feel very close to the pitch. 

 

Apparently transport is a major issue for fans that went last night. And that's only 10,000 allowed. Public transport infrastructure needs to be improved. 

It's not too far a walk from the city centre really. 35-40 minutes from Lime Street. Certainly easier to get to than Goodison and Anfield.

[Leicesterpool]

Looks impressive but, typical new stadium... the atmosphere likely will be dull, bowl shame stadiums in football just seem to kill an atmosphere. I'm yet to see a club move into a new stadium and experience a better atmosphere. Imagine one of the best atmopshere's in the country used to be Upton Park... since moving to London Stadium atmosphere there is stale.  

[Spudulike]

You'd think that architects would be able to come up with something with at least a smidgeon of character given the modern software tools at their disposal. Just another concrete and steel (and plastic) dull, boring arena. Yet another money making venture 

[chris1232]

[AjcW]

3 minutes ago, chris1232 said:

Can tell it's half term....

[Finnegan]

3 minutes ago, chris1232 said:

 

What the **** am I looking at

 

Is this like, a tier list of... idk, chins?

 

[purpleronnie]

2 hours ago, TheGoldenGod said:

Funny you mention the fan experience because a lot has come out this weekend regarding West Ham's new ground being a far cry from the Boleyn ground in terms of atmosphere and and general experience and wonder of this will be the same...

1 hour ago, Leicesterpool said:

Looks impressive but, typical new stadium... the atmosphere likely will be dull, bowl shame stadiums in football just seem to kill an atmosphere. I'm yet to see a club move into a new stadium and experience a better atmosphere. Imagine one of the best atmopshere's in the country used to be Upton Park... since moving to London Stadium atmosphere there is stale.  

There's no comparison, the olympic stadium was for athletics with little or no concept for it being turned into a football stadium, they've adapted it over the years but its still awful and it will always be that way, west ham are stuck with it.

 

The everton stadium is  purpose built for football, they've thought about sightlines, atmosphere etc...They have included 'safe standing' too, nice steep stands, fans close to the pitch. The everton fans have no excuses, if the atmosphere is poor then its the fans fault.  

 

One of the problems we have in this country is when a club moves there is no fan representation as far as how the seats are allocated.  In the rest of europe and the US, when it comes to 'soccer' stadiums the fans have their say, the supporters groups always vie for position.  So abroad in the new stadium you have no change in atmsophere because all the noisey fans have their end.  In england we dont have that so if a group of fans in the old stadium move to a new one they are inveitably split up.

 

The fact everton have a large safe stading area would (you'd hope) be the place where the noisier fans are likely to buy their tickets.

Edited 18 February by purpleronnie

[StanSP]

1 hour ago, Leicesterpool said:

Looks impressive but, typical new stadium... the atmosphere likely will be dull, bowl shame stadiums in football just seem to kill an atmosphere. I'm yet to see a club move into a new stadium and experience a better atmosphere. Imagine one of the best atmopshere's in the country used to be Upton Park... since moving to London Stadium atmosphere there is stale.  

Is it a bowl shape? 

[StanSP]

15 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

What the **** am I looking at

 

Is this like, a tier list of... idk, chins?

 

A blind child's choice of footballers without knowing what football actually is.