Hughes' comments.

[DaveyJ]

Sorry if this topic has already been discussed, but i was just wondering if anyone could confirm what it means to go "back to basics"...

"It was a case of getting back to basics today" "Everyone involved worked hard"

I haven't seen any games yet so was wondering... were the previous two full of complex Ronaldinhio-esque routines?

[davieG]

Sorry if this topic has already been discussed, but i was just wondering if anyone could confirm what it means to go "back to basics"...

I haven't seen any games yet sop was wondering if the previous two were full of complex Ronaldinhio-esque routines?

The standard explanation to justify any change of any type when you're under pressure to produce success after failure.

[Bert]

Basic football is passing. We have been hoofing recently. On Saturday we passed the ball around much more than we did in the first two games put together.

[The People's Hero]

The basic stuff was attempted by both sides with hilarious consequences which must have had at least 18 of the 22 players on show seriously questioning their own level of performance. I imagine this subsided when they picked up their pay packets though.

On the plus side, Hughes probably didn't say it. Or he did, but read it off a piece of paper, which had been written by the same no b who's been writing this sh it for the past 3 seasons.

[davieG]

Basic football is passing. We have been hoofing recently. On Saturday we passed the ball around much more than we did in the first two games put together.

So in this instance going back to basics should have been described as going forward to basics, considering we were so bad that we hadn't achieved a basic level of performance. When we've got the basics right perhaps we can then go futher forward to playing at and advanced level. From then we'd be able to go back to basics if we got worse again, although not bad enough to be bad just basic.

[Thracian]

Basic football is passing. We have been hoofing recently. On Saturday we passed the ball around much more than we did in the first two games put together.

What does Back to Basics mean. What a good question.

I don't mind your answer Bertfox because we were better as you say but go on... tell me what Nils and "Back to Basics" proper, accurate, non hoof, ball to feet passing have in common. Did he somehow miss the "Back to Basics" bit in training.

If not, COG must have committed some extraordinary sin to have apparently got singled out for training ground failings while Nils, presumably, carried on regardless.

Actually non hoof in the second paragraph is deceptive. In some ways if Nils passes long I'd rather he hoofed it because it might end up 50-50 but he tends to flight his long passes slowly, allowing big defenders all the time they need to win the first header.

Just like McCarthy and Kisnorbo, I do wish Robert Kelly would restrict him to short passing only unless, of course, there really is no alternative. Or get defenders who can/do pass quickly and accurately.

[Jonbluefox9]

What does Back to Basics mean. What a good question.

I don't mind your answer Bertfox because we were better as you say but go on... tell me what Nils and "Back to Basics" proper, accurate, non hoof, ball to feet passing have in common. Did he somehow miss the "Back to Basics" bit in training.

If not, COG must have committed some extraordinary sin to have apparently got singled out for training ground failings while Nils, presumably, carried on regardless.

Actually non hoof in the second paragraph is deceptive. In some ways if Nils passes long I'd rather he hoofed it because it might end up 50-50 but he tends to flight his long passes slowly, allowing big defenders all the time they need to win the first header.

Just like McCarthy and Kisnorbo, I do wish Robert Kelly would restrict him to short passing only unless, of course, there really is no alternative. Or get defenders who can/do pass quickly and accurately.

O'Grady's not the only player to have got a talking to for doing something wrong in training. Even before the season had started, Rob was very quick to talk to Johansson after he failed to play a quick simple ball ahead of himself in training.

Funnily enough the incident involving O'Grady came about after a long ball down the flank from the boot of left back Alan Sheehan. Sheehan wasn't the one singled out though. Kelly instead told O'Grady that even if a ball is played like that one, aimlessly, then it's no good standing there with your hands on your hips moaning about it being a shit ball and what not. You've got to make an effort to chase the ball and turn a lost cause into an opportunity. As I said previously, after that O'Grady got back down to work and showed some improved movement and was praised by Kelly.

[newms]

What does Back to Basics mean. What a good question.

I don't mind your answer Bertfox because we were better as you say but go on... tell me what Nils and "Back to Basics" proper, accurate, non hoof, ball to feet passing have in common. Did he somehow miss the "Back to Basics" bit in training.

If not, COG must have committed some extraordinary sin to have apparently got singled out for training ground failings while Nils, presumably, carried on regardless.

Actually non hoof in the second paragraph is deceptive. In some ways if Nils passes long I'd rather he hoofed it because it might end up 50-50 but he tends to flight his long passes slowly, allowing big defenders all the time they need to win the first header.

Just like McCarthy and Kisnorbo, I do wish Robert Kelly would restrict him to short passing only unless, of course, there really is no alternative. Or get defenders who can/do pass quickly and accurately.

it amazes me how you link everything you say back to either COG, Levi Porter, Alan Sheehan or Conrad Logan

[Thracian]

it amazes me how you link everything you say back to either COG, Levi Porter, Alan Sheehan or Conrad Logan

I don't think that's true and have hardly mentioned Logan anyway but I do happen to believe our young players are absolutely vital to our future right now, and the sooner the good ones are involved in the team the better. Furthermore, it was interesting to hear the chairman briefly suggest the same thing last night.

[filbertway]

I don't think that's true and have hardly mentioned Logan anyway but I do happen to believe our young players are absolutely vital to our future right now, and the sooner the good ones are involved in the team the better. Furthermore, it was interesting to hear the chairman briefly suggest the same thing last night.

Only because he can't find the finances to bring new players to the club though

[Thracian]

Only because he can't find the finances to bring new players to the club though

People always think the grass is greener...

I won't name them but I can think of at least nine "outside signings" over the last couple of years or so that we really could have done without and there's probably more if I dwell on it.

By contrast I don't think any of Stearman, Wesolowski, O'Grady, Logan, Porter, Sheehan, Dodds, Gradel will let us down over the fullness of time and if they do, it won't have cost a fraction of what the not-needed-nine cost in fees and/or wages.

[Dr The Singh]

People always think the grass is greener...

I won't name them but I can think of at least nine "outside signings" over the last couple of years or so that we really could have done without and there's probably more if I dwell on it.

By contrast I don't think any of Stearman, Wesolowski, O'Grady, Logan, Porter, Sheehan, Dodds, Gradel will let us down over the fullness of time and if they do, it won't have cost a fraction of what the not-needed-nine cost in fees and/or wages.

Agreed. With our current financial situation we ought to be developing from within, I haven't seen many reserve players to be honest but the likes of Stearman and Weso has given me hope that we can develop the youth. If we lack players of type, there should be no hesitation in playing youth, the only way youth players can improve is by playing against better players etc!!!!

[Ric Flair]

Agreed. With our current financial situation we ought to be developing from within, I haven't seen many reserve players to be honest but the likes of Stearman and Weso has given me hope that we can develop the youth. If we lack players of type, there should be no hesitation in playing youth, the only way youth players can improve is by playing against better players etc!!!!

It's about getting a mixture of both. Some of the players Thracian has mentioned there might look good in the reserves but until thye play plenty of first team football it's impossible to say whetehr they'd improve our side or ever let us down.

I'm a big believer in bringing through players from the academy, especially in our current situation but there are certain players who clearly aren't ready. Stearman is now levelling out after a season or so in the first team and he must improve to get back in to our team and he has been the best youngster to come out of the academy other than Wesolowski. So that's how good they've got to be to help us in the long run.

Let's not forget that the first team players we currently have who aren't to Thracian's liking will have been the best or one of the best academy players of their generation at their clubs and that's how they broke in to first team football. I'm not saying the likes of Gradel, Sheehan, Porter and Dodds aren't good enough but I wouldn't put them in the same league as the best academy players we've had in the past 2 years (Wesolowski and Stearman) and that's probably the level they've got to be at to get in to our first team and rightly so.

[shen]

It's about getting a mixture of both. Some of the players Thracian has mentioned there might look good in the reserves but until thye play plenty of first team football it's impossible to say whetehr they'd improve our side or ever let us down.

I'm a big believer in bringing through players from the academy, especially in our current situation but there are certain players who clearly aren't ready. Stearman is now levelling out after a season or so in the first team and he must improve to get back in to our team and he has been the best youngster to come out of the academy other than Wesolowski. So that's how good they've got to be to help us in the long run.

Let's not forget that the first team players we currently have who aren't to Thracian's liking will have been the best or one of the best academy players of their generation at their clubs and that's how they broke in to first team football. I'm not saying the likes of Gradel, Sheehan, Porter and Dodds aren't good enough but I wouldn't put them in the same league as the best academy players we've had in the past 2 years (Wesolowski and Stearman) and that's probably the level they've got to be at to get in to our first team and rightly so.

Well you should probably reserve your comments about Dodds and Gradel as they're really just too young to judge from a first team perspective. Petrescu and Wright (and dare I say it, Dawson ) were allegedly the greatest things since sliced bread, but they failed during their time here, so obviously building them up before they've made any telling contribution to the first team is pretty non-substantial.

Having said that, Chambers seems to be the REAL deal!

[Sods]

Basic football is passing. We have been hoofing recently. On Saturday we passed the ball around much more than we did in the first two games put together.

I think they mean back to basics as in a Right winger rather than right back. a left foted left back and a left footed midfielder

[cisono]

On the plus side, Hughes probably didn't say it. Or he did, but read it off a piece of paper, which had been written by the same no b who's been writing this sh it for the past 3 seasons.

Nah, Hughesy would not do that (reading it off a piece of paper etc)!!!

(But he might have been influenced by someone talking like that)...

[Phube]

I've just realised what he meant by getting "Back to Basics"!!!:

Obviously a change in the usual shite R'n'B crap they listen to!!

[Thracian]

Well you should probably reserve your comments about Dodds and Gradel as they're really just too young to judge from a first team perspective. Petrescu and Wright (and dare I say it, Dawson ) were allegedly the greatest things since sliced bread, but they failed during their time here, so obviously building them up before they've made any telling contribution to the first team is pretty non-substantial.

Having said that, Chambers seems to be the REAL deal!

Chambers is a terrific prospect but I haven't mentioned him because I reckon they want to keep him low profile and let him concentrate on some school work this year (though I may be quite wrong).

[Jon the Hat]

It's about getting a mixture of both. Some of the players Thracian has mentioned there might look good in the reserves but until thye play plenty of first team football it's impossible to say whetehr they'd improve our side or ever let us down.

I'm a big believer in bringing through players from the academy, especially in our current situation but there are certain players who clearly aren't ready. Stearman is now levelling out after a season or so in the first team and he must improve to get back in to our team and he has been the best youngster to come out of the academy other than Wesolowski. So that's how good they've got to be to help us in the long run.

Let's not forget that the first team players we currently have who aren't to Thracian's liking will have been the best or one of the best academy players of their generation at their clubs and that's how they broke in to first team football. I'm not saying the likes of Gradel, Sheehan, Porter and Dodds aren't good enough but I wouldn't put them in the same league as the best academy players we've had in the past 2 years (Wesolowski and Stearman) and that's probably the level they've got to be at to get in to our first team and rightly so.

Stearman is an interesting example as he does seem to have dropped off a bit, but academy graduates don't have to play as much as he has to play a part. They can be our cover and play when the opportunity arises. You could argue that this is a better intorduction which far less pressure than elying no them week in week out.

[Thracian]

I think Ric's right about some of our first teamers once being top Academy players but some have done exactly what Stearman's done - gone off a bit since then.

And, like Stearman, I wish they'd get back to their best.

As for Stearman/Wesolowski being our best youngsters I don't know. I've not had the good fortune to see enough of Wesolowski but what I've seen has all been good so I've no reason to disagree.

Stearman I disagreed about some months ago. At the time Alan Sheehan played against Sheffield Wednesday I honestly thought he had more to his game than Stearman but Sheehan disappeared into oblivion and Stearman established himself in the first team so I doubted my own beliefs.

Now I'm not so sure again. Stearman has certainly not improved since he became established and seems to have lost his focus. Sheehan's still got weaknesses but remains a consistently dangerous player who is forever supporting the attack in the way I hoped Stearman would.

As for Gradel and Dodds I don't know how to compare them with full-backs or midfield players. What I do know is that City have been desperately short of wingers who could take people on and score - and that's exactly what Gradel can do.

And Dodds scores goals at an exceptional rate. I'm a great believer in statistics where goals are concerned and find it far harder to defend Hammond than Dodds because of it.

But I'd stick my neck out and say that, given the chance, either Dodds or Chambers will prove to be as good a striker as we've had at City for years.

Trouble with Dodds is that if he's not scoring you hardly notice him. And if he plays 70 minutes of a game he'll probably be substituted just before he would have scored. I knew a striker called Frank Sheard who was like that. Dead ordinary outside the box. Not big, not fast, not clever, not anything. Just 25 goals every season. You just had to believe in him.

Dodds is much more sophisticated as a player but he's similar in style. No matter how matter-of-fact his general play, sooner or later he puts one in the net. It's a different job to Weso's or Stearman's but a vital one nevertheless and some people have it, some don't.

[Manwell Pablo]

I think Ric's right about some of our first teamers once being top Academy players but some have done exactly what Stearman's done - gone off a bit since then.

And, like Stearman, I wish they'd get back to their best.

As for Stearman/Wesolowski being our best youngsters I don't know. I've not had the good fortune to see enough of Wesolowski but what I've seen has all been good so I've no reason to disagree.

Stearman I disagreed about some months ago. At the time Alan Sheehan played against Sheffield Wednesday I honestly thought he had more to his game than Stearman but Sheehan disappeared into oblivion and Stearman established himself in the first team so I doubted my own beliefs.

Now I'm not so sure again. Stearman has certainly not improved since he became established and seems to have lost his focus. Sheehan's still got weaknesses but remains a consistently dangerous player who is forever supporting the attack in the way I hoped Stearman would.

As for Gradel and Dodds I don't know how to compare them with full-backs or midfield players. What I do know is that City have been desperately short of wingers who could take people on and score - and that's exactly what Gradel can do.

And Dodds scores goals at an exceptional rate. I'm a great believer in statistics where goals are concerned and find it far harder to defend Hammond than Dodds because of it.

But I'd stick my neck out and say that, given the chance, either Dodds or Chambers will prove to be as good a striker as we've had at City for years.

Trouble with Dodds is that if he's not scoring you hardly notice him. And if he plays 70 minutes of a game he'll probably be substituted just before he would have scored. I knew a striker called Frank Sheard who was like that. Dead ordinary outside the box. Not big, not fast, not clever, not anything. Just 25 goals every season. You just had to believe in him.

Dodds is much more sophisticated as a player but he's similar in style. No matter how matter-of-fact his general play, sooner or later he puts one in the net. It's a different job to Weso's or Stearman's but a vital one nevertheless and some people have it, some don't.

I thought you didn't judge players on one off games.

[Thracian]

I thought you didn't judge players on one off games.

I don't. I said it was around that time. He also played against Blackpool and Bolton in cup matches and in various reserve games...

[Manwell Pablo]

I don't. I said it was around that time. He also played against Blackpool and Bolton in cup matches and in various reserve games...

Right, so two games and fifteen minutes then.

[Thracian]

Right, so two games and fifteen minutes then.

If you're trying to make a point his record in five first team games and various friendlies involving first teamers is as good as anyone's at the club. That's assuming you don't count reserve games or the Westerby Cup win etc and, of course, it is impossible to judge him on a broader basis if no-one picks him.

[Manwell Pablo]

If you're trying to make a point his record in five first team games and various friendlies involving first teamers is as good as anyone's at the club. That's assuming you don't count reserve games or the Westerby Cup win etc and, of course, it is impossible to judge him on a broader basis if no-one picks him.

What, no goals no assists and one red card.