harwich fox Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 First post so sorry if I've repeated one I know it's early days but does he prove that sticking with a manager will eventually pay dividends, and on little money ?
rico Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 ask him next week after they've been whooped 5-0 !
purpleronnie Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 ask him next week after they've been whooped 5-0 ! I thought we were playing them?
Thracian Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 First post so sorry if I've repeated one I know it's early days but does he prove that sticking with a manager will eventually pay dividends, and on little money ? You might argue that Burton Albion made a stronger case when Clough was there. The bloke has proved nothing at Derby yet. I honestly wish him well (except against us) but don't see that makes a case for any other situation anyway. He's an isolated example and how can you make a rational judgement anyway? I've no regrets about any of our managers leaving in the last 10/12 years. Sven's is a much more difficult situation. The bloke has clearly got some qualities. But so has MON were he to be available. If pressed to decide today I'd stick with Sven. But I'm not sure I'd be right and might easily think differently in a month or two's time when it would probably be too late for this season anyway,
Guest Col city fan Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 First post so sorry if I've repeated one I know it's early days but does he prove that sticking with a manager will eventually pay dividends, and on little money ? Why? He's done nothing yet with Derby? He might do but might not? What's the point of this thread?
accessory Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 And what is it doing in the LCFC forum? He's never been on our books, nor is likely to be.
Earlydoorsjones Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 An interesting post! Currently, Nigel Clough and Derby are an exception to the modern short term mentality of football as a 'business'. Derby, under Clough, have certainly had some hard times over the past couple of seasons and it has not been easy for the fans. Derby have a large fan base - even when times are bad. They have my complete respect for that. I think the Derby big wigs knew that with the money they had to invest, few managers could see them through. They had to have a manager that knew football from the grass roots up. To answer your question, if a club is looking at long term growth, stick with a manager that knows football and let his philosophy and style come through the youth team and the players he brings in. Some managers could not be effective without big investment (i.e. the Big Ron - or Svens of the game). Still, little point having them in long term if you are not going to back them to the hilt. However, we know the detrimental consequences of a revolving door policy. Then there are the few that can run a club on little investment and get results (the MO'N or Cloughs). There are more clubs with long term managers in the lower leagues because the clubs don't invest as heavily in the team, a situation which necessitates organic growth through youth systems, knowledge of the smaller teams and individual player improvement. Shit, I'm rambling now... Does it pay to stick with one manager? Hind sight is an exact science.
Bagworthblue Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 Absolutely - and stability of the team which comes with it- It takes time to build a team. Add to it gently, gradually improve on certain areas, build understanding, make sure everyone is playing in their best position etc. You get to a stage where everyone is so comfortable with what is expected of them that they can pick out passes barely having to check if their colleague is there. In my last 5 aside team, when we started we were hammered 9-1 in the first game(i scored the 1 ahem) and we got thrashed every week. We finished bottom. 3 years go by with only a couple of changes to personnel and same manager, we won the league and were renowned for our passing game Ok not the best comparison but look at Ferguson and Wenger as a couple of examples - OK they have money as well which doesn't hurt. We need to keep Sven even if he doesn't get us to the promised land this year. A few minor changes in the summer and assuming we kept the majority of the current team, we would be very strong next year. Another manager comes in and 6 leave / 8 join and we start another season with a bunch of strangers and the cycle continues to repeat itself the following year no doubt
Fox92 Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 I know it's early days but does he prove that sticking with a manager will eventually pay dividends, and on little money ? I think that depends. If the team on the pitch are showing enough that they look to be going somewhere, then sticking with the manager could be a good decision. However, I am not sad for the likes of Levien or Holloway when they were sacked because, we were woeful at times. Besides, if Derby did want Nigel to leave, I think they would ask him to step down and not sack him because the second name, Clough, connection with the club. I do hope Nigel Clough does well (not against Leicester though).
Lineker's Left Foot Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 You might argue that Burton Albion made a stronger case when Clough was there. The bloke has proved nothing at Derby yet. I honestly wish him well (except against us) but don't see that makes a case for any other situation anyway. He's an isolated example and how can you make a rational judgement anyway? I've no regrets about any of our managers leaving in the last 10/12 years. Sven's is a much more difficult situation. The bloke has clearly got some qualities. But so has MON were he to be available. If pressed to decide today I'd stick with Sven. But I'm not sure I'd be right and might easily think differently in a month or two's time when it would probably be too late for this season anyway, Blimey do you always have to be so negative, give Sven time ffs??
blueblood88 Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 You might argue that Burton Albion made a stronger case when Clough was there. The bloke has proved nothing at Derby yet. I honestly wish him well (except against us) but don't see that makes a case for any other situation anyway. He's an isolated example and how can you make a rational judgement anyway? I've no regrets about any of our managers leaving in the last 10/12 years. Sven's is a much more difficult situation. The bloke has clearly got some qualities. But so has MON were he to be available. If pressed to decide today I'd stick with Sven. But I'm not sure I'd be right and might easily think differently in a month or two's time when it would probably be too late for this season anyway, WHY do you have to right a fvcking essay about everything! You know absolutley fvck all, every post you put up is complete bollocks
Corky Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 They've had a very good start to the season. They did last season as well, and finished 19th. Whether it was the right decision will be proved at the end of the season. Currently I don't see them as a model we should be following.
Guest Col city fan Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 I really do see this as a pointless thread.. There are a lot of managers who have done very well over time... Fergie at United Allardyce at Bolton MON at Leicester Wenger at Arsenal Etc etc...... Then again there have been lots of managers who have come into a messy situation and actually turned it round very quickly... I think it's a case of whether a certain situation suits a certain manager... Some are made for gradual improvement, others are more like 'troubleshooters' and can generate success pretty quickly. Look at Warnock as a case in point... Most of his tenures have been relatively short term but relatively successful There is NO template for success that works in every situation.
Guest Col city fan Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 WHY do you have to right a fvcking essay about everything! You know absolutley fvck all, every post you put up is complete bollocks This is VERY harsh IMO..... And not necessary..
Thracian Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 This is VERY harsh IMO..... And not necessary.. Thanks Col but don't worry on my behalf. I'll sift through the constructive detail of his comment and drop a reply to him shortly.
Thracian Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 WHY do you have to right a fvcking essay about everything! You know absolutley fvck all, every post you put up is complete bollocks
I am Rod Hull Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 Thanks Col but don't worry on my behalf. I'll sift through the constructive detail of his comment and drop a reply to him shortly. To be fair to blueblood88, its hard for him to think and watch the x-factor at the same time... ............................................................................................................ Clough jnr seems to be getting a good team spirit going this season. Unlike last year when he was slagging his own players off on tv...
harwich fox Posted 24 September 2011 Author Posted 24 September 2011 Often the problem is the board or the chairman as we've experienced over the last few years,either picking the wrong manager or not supporting him .Remember this club has been in a huge mess since MON left and it takes time for a good manager (and board) to sort out a club and get the team he really the way he wants it ,so perhaps patience is a virtue ,except in the case of complete tossers i,e, Twatlor
Tielemans63 Posted 24 September 2011 Posted 24 September 2011 Derby are unfortunately doing pretty well so far this season but they started last season on fire and nearly ended up in the relegation zone. If they're still up there at the end of the season then fair play but I'll put money on us finishing higher
Adster Posted 25 September 2011 Posted 25 September 2011 WHY do you have to right a fvcking essay about everything! You know absolutley fvck all, every post you put up is complete bollocks And people wonder why I think you're a complete c**t.
ajthefox Posted 25 September 2011 Posted 25 September 2011 To be fair to blueblood88, its hard for him to think and watch the x-factor at the same time... ............................................................................................................ Clough jnr seems to be getting a good team spirit going this season. Unlike last year when he was slagging his own players off on tv... That Cwyka bloke he had a massive go at on air played against forest last weekend, was the first time since the outburst. Something ridiculous like 10 months!!
RumbleFox Posted 25 September 2011 Posted 25 September 2011 To be fair, as much as I cannot stand Derby County, I do like Clough quite a bit. I am originally fropm Burton On Trent and he did a fantastic job for the Brewers and got heavily involved in the local community. Like I said, can't stand Derby (growing up in Burton meant I was surrounded by Rams fans and they are by far my most hated team) but I do like the idea of Cloughie going on to be a good manager, Anyway, there's my two penneth for what it's worth. X
Guest DavidJCW Posted 25 September 2011 Posted 25 September 2011 We're only 8 games into the season... let's just see where Derby are come Christmas...
foxaholic Posted 25 September 2011 Posted 25 September 2011 I really do see this as a pointless thread.. There are a lot of managers who have done very well over time... Fergie at United Allardyce at Bolton MON at Leicester Wenger at Arsenal Etc etc...... Then again there have been lots of managers who have come into a messy situation and actually turned it round very quickly... I think it's a case of whether a certain situation suits a certain manager... Some are made for gradual improvement, others are more like 'troubleshooters' and can generate success pretty quickly. Look at Warnock as a case in point... Most of his tenures have been relatively short term but relatively successful There is NO template for success that works in every situation.
foxaholic Posted 25 September 2011 Posted 25 September 2011 Gillies 10 years Martin Oneil 5 no one else has won anything of note .
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