Animal rights

[Captain...]

I was banned for 24 hours from 1.30pm yesterday, so I'm now rehabilitated and ultimately a much better person.

Well that is good to hear, have you embraced the inner socialist?

[Zingari]

I was banned for 24 hours from 1.30pm yesterday, so I'm now rehabilitated and ultimately a much better person.

Disappointed to get banned for suggesting a link between the mindset of a homosexual and the mindset of a vegetarian to be honest. I thought I was being quite insightful and certainly wasn't looking to offend anyone.

Was it the gays or the vegetarians that got upset about it ?

[AoWW]

can you post some pics of happy donkeys and sad donkeys so i can learn to tell the difference ?

Happy donkey - smiley face, perky ears, good body language

Sad donkey - worried expression, furrowed brow, down-turned mouth. submissive body language.

[Zingari]

Ah i would have been fooled ,.

I'd have said the first donkey was coquettish and flirty rather than happy , the second donkey looks more disappointed and wistful than sad.

Donkeys are quite inscutable if the truth be told

[The Doctor]

You might be right, but it doesn't explain why some sharks come back for seconds. They obviously enjoy what they're chomping. Maybe some surfers are more nutritious than others?

Fucking bloodlust man, once they start chowing down on Billy T. Surfer over there and the water's filling up with blood they're going to be like John Prescott at an all you can eat buffet.

Animals aren't here just for our use or enjoyment, although a lot of people obviously think otherwise. I see a day when the only animals we have left bigger than a dog, are domesticated one's we're going to eat.

Ironic that we're spending a fortune looking for life on another planet, yet we're doing our best to wipe out life on this one. I bet if we did find a little colony of Martians, we'd immediately build roads, a housing estate and a great big fvcking shopping mall right in the middle of their habitat. It's what we do to everything else after all.

Well, no - I never said they were. However, they are a food source to us, as fish are to sharks, deer are to tigers, seals are to polar bears, penguins are to some seals and so on.

[I am Rod Hull]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDFh5JdYh7I

[acooling08]

Eating meat will soon become more crucial to people than it already is. With the amount of people being born now with allergies to seeds and nuts, meat will always be the main source of protein/iron etc to most people. It's obvious that the things in meat are crucial for growing children; good luck getting a kid to eat pumpkin seeds over any type of meat!

I also have to challenge the view that we evolved to eat meat due to climatic conditions. I assume you mean the ice age? I remember a 'Walking with Beasts' episode vaguely where our ancestors scavenged a carcass. This was way before the ice age. If you didn't mean the ice age then please explain what you mean.

[Daggers]

Eating meat will soon become more crucial to people than it already is. With the amount of people being born now with allergies to seeds and nuts, meat will always be the main source of protein/iron etc to most people. It's obvious that the things in meat are crucial for growing children; good luck getting a kid to eat pumpkin seeds over any type of meat!

I also have to challenge the view that we evolved to eat meat due to climatic conditions. I assume you mean the ice age? I remember a 'Walking with Beasts' episode vaguely where our ancestors scavenged a carcass. This was way before the ice age. If you didn't mean the ice age then please explain what you mean.

The "things in meat"?

An episode of "Walking With Beasts"?

You are the singlemost retarded poster on this forum. How the flip did they ever let you onto an HNC in Sticklebrick Assembly?

[ozleicester]

Was it the gays or the vegetarians that got upset about it ?

Can i just say that it wasnt me... Im not sure if that answers your question though .......having glanced at a few of MB's comments in other topics i dont know that the poster really adds value to any discussion.

I have attempted to answer most questions (be they sensible or less so) and im happy to continue, but i dont think ive seen one answer to my question....

Why are you happy to eat an animal, that has a greater level of intellect, suffers more, and understands what is happening around it... than you are to eat a less intelligent, less capable and less understanding baby that will in truth, suffer less overall?

or a simplified question

Pig Vs Baby... which and why?... maybe i need a poll?

[OzFox]

Pig Vs Baby... which and why?... maybe i need a poll?

Here's chickens vs baby. will that do?

[OzFox]

****ing bloodlust man, once they start chowing down on Billy T. Surfer over there and the water's filling up with blood they're going to be like John Prescott at an all you can eat buffet.

What a thought...

Well, no - I never said they were. However, they are a food source to us, as fish are to sharks, deer are to tigers, seals are to polar bears, penguins are to some seals and so on.

Well yeah, some are a food source for us. What about all the others we're displacing so that our 7 billion have a nice place to live? That's what I have a problem with.

Mind you, this bear seems to have adapted nicely to shopping malls. He would have made an interesting contributer to the chocolate bar wars thread

[OzFox]

What, like in the niches occupied by sharks? We've got a family of Angler fish moved in next door because they were displaced by a shopping mall development.

Westfield haven't found a way to build a mall on the barrier reef yet, so sharks get the slaughter and soup option.

In Asia they're running out of sharks, so they knock off manta rays instead. They believe the gills "cool the blood". Dickheads.

[Zingari]

Can i just say that it wasnt me... Im not sure if that answers your question though .......having glanced at a few of MB's comments in other topics i dont know that the poster really adds value to any discussion.

I have attempted to answer most questions (be they sensible or less so) and im happy to continue, but i dont think ive seen one answer to my question....

Why are you happy to eat an animal, that has a greater level of intellect, suffers more, and understands what is happening around it... than you are to eat a less intelligent, less capable and less understanding baby that will in truth, suffer less overall?

or a simplified question

Pig Vs Baby... which and why?... maybe i need a poll?

Maybe the simple answer as to why we don't human meat is either emotional attachment to a fellow human and/or fear of reprisal from other humans if you eat their offspring

Every animal is fiercely protective of it's own which shows some sore of survival/emotional drive to protect and nurture it's own kind at the expense of others.

We may have evolved to attain reason and morality , but we still retain our base instincts that are more hardwired than recent changes.

I'm not sure if you consider this as an answer , but it's all i've really got .

i totally accept all the arguments about ill treatment of animals , and very strict laws should be in place to ensure a good environment etc ,

Moosey seems a very good poster to me and has the ability to stimulate debates and expand the boundaries , I think sometimes he rises to baiting too easily though rather than just ignoring it .

[marty78]

Can i just say that it wasnt me... Im not sure if that answers your question though .......having glanced at a few of MB's comments in other topics i dont know that the poster really adds value to any discussion.

I have attempted to answer most questions (be they sensible or less so) and im happy to continue, but i dont think ive seen one answer to my question....

Why are you happy to eat an animal, that has a greater level of intellect, suffers more, and understands what is happening around it... than you are to eat a less intelligent, less capable and less understanding baby that will in truth, suffer less overall?

or a simplified question

Pig Vs Baby... which and why?... maybe i need a poll?

A baby has the potential to exceed the intelligence of a pig so I would go for a pig (and regularly do).

I have one more for you though if you will, how do we protect our crops to feed a worldwide vegetarian population without the risk to insects, slugs etc?

[Captain...]

Can i just say that it wasnt me... Im not sure if that answers your question though .......having glanced at a few of MB's comments in other topics i dont know that the poster really adds value to any discussion.

I have attempted to answer most questions (be they sensible or less so) and im happy to continue, but i dont think ive seen one answer to my question....

Why are you happy to eat an animal, that has a greater level of intellect, suffers more, and understands what is happening around it... than you are to eat a less intelligent, less capable and less understanding baby that will in truth, suffer less overall?

or a simplified question

Pig Vs Baby... which and why?... maybe i need a poll?

I've already answered this, babies are much more time consuming to farm with longer gestation periods and require more time to develop, pigs have much shorter pregnancies and require much less work to bring them to maturity.

An 8 month old pig is already mature, or ripe as I like to call it, whereas an 8 month old baby isn't, so you should compare an 8 month old pig with say an 16 year old child (all figures used are illustrative and not necessarily factually accurate). Then it is very expensive to raise a child to maturity.

In terms of taste, I don't know but, pig is one of the tastiest of animals.

Then there is the evolutionary argument, by eating your young you are not passing on your seed, which is a base instinct for all animals, although some do still eat their young, normally out of desperation (I hope). It would also be a complete waste of energy in terms of delivering a baby, only to eat, it is easier to hunt an animal and eat that.

The only argument in favour of eating babies is that it will probably save a lot of money to eat your baby than put it through university.

Your argument that a pig feels more pain than a baby, just means we should eat pigs before they are fully developed, all animals will feel some form of pain, and defining your eating habits by which animal suffered the least physical pain in being killed is nonsense, I'm not going to eat a slug because it feels less pain than a cow, it is about how tasty/nutritious it is. Sorry, but that is how us barbaric meat eaters view things.

[MooseBreath]

If we gave pigs the choice between living in safe captivity and then dying without feeling pain, or living in the wild and probably being mauled to death by a deer, or more likely not existing altogether, which would they choose?

Also, I think my earlier post which got deleted contained the ultimate truth of vegetarianism - that in seeking to prevent pain inflicted on animals, vegetarians are indirectly hoping to prevent pain being inflicted on themselves because they are cowards.

[OzFox]

If we gave pigs the choice between living in safe captivity and then dying without feeling pain, or living in the wild and probably being mauled to death by a deer, or more likely not existing altogether, which would they choose?

Also, I think my earlier post which got deleted contained the ultimate truth of vegetarianism - that in seeking to prevent pain inflicted on animals, vegetarians are indirectly hoping to prevent pain being inflicted on themselves because they are cowards.

I think they'd probably rather take their chances with the deer, especially as deer aren't known for maulings. Pigs are lined up, stunned, shackled by a leg and hoisted upside down, then a bloke sticks a knife into their throat. The stunning is sometimes inadequate, meaning the pig comes to and is kicking/convulsing while the bloke is trying to stick the knife into an artery. It's gruesome stuff. Probably videos on Youtube but I can't be arsed to find them.

[AdamN]

I think they'd probably rather take their chances with the deer, especially as deer aren't known for maulings. Pigs are lined up, stunned, shackled by a leg and hoisted upside down, then a bloke sticks a knife into their throat. The stunning is sometimes inadequate, meaning the pig comes to and is kicking/convulsing while the bloke is trying to stick the knife into an artery. It's gruesome stuff. Probably videos on Youtube but I can't be arsed to find them.

Whereas I suppose a 'natural' predator sits the pig down, calmly explains what is going to happen, and mercifully puts the pig to sleep without a fuss?

[OzFox]

Whereas I suppose a 'natural' predator sits the pig down, calmly explains what is going to happen, and mercifully puts the pig to sleep without a fuss?

The point is we are (supposedly) intelligent, compassionate, humane...whatever you want to call it. There's simply no need for the slaughter to be as painful and as cruel as it often is. And we do it on an industrial scale.

[AdamN]

The point is we are (supposedly) intelligent, compassionate, humane...whatever you want to call it. There's simply no need for the slaughter to be as painful and as cruel as it often is. And we do it on an industrial scale.

I agree with you on that point. If it can be helped then there's no reason for an animal to go through an unnecessary amount of pain. If it can be raised and killed in the most humane way possible then that's absolutely how it should be done.

[acooling08]

The "things in meat"?

An episode of "Walking With Beasts"?

You are the singlemost retarded poster on this forum. How the flip did they ever let you onto an HNC in Sticklebrick Assembly?

I already said what the 'things in meat' were on my previous sentence; iron/protein etc.

And what's wrong with referring to the 'Walking with...' documentaries? The ones that consult scientists to make it as realistic as it possible with current knowledge.

Why don't you leave your hatred of me out of this unrelated discussion? I don't go on your duck thread and call you a retard.

[I am Rod Hull]

I already said what the 'things in meat' were on my previous sentence; iron/protein etc.

And what's wrong with referring to the 'Walking with...' documentaries? The ones that consult scientists to make it as realistic as it possible with current knowledge.

Why don't you leave your hatred of me out of this unrelated discussion? I don't go on your duck thread and call you a retard.

[Guest MattP]

I already said what the 'things in meat' were on my previous sentence; iron/protein etc.

And what's wrong with referring to the 'Walking with...' documentaries? The ones that consult scientists to make it as realistic as it possible with current knowledge.

Why don't you leave your hatred of me out of this unrelated discussion? I don't go on your duck thread and call you a retard.

lol

[OzFox]

I don't go on your duck thread and call you a retard.

No, but you could go on there and call him a mallard

[Captain...]

No, but you could go on there and call him a mallard

Or un canard.