Animal rights

[Zingari]

I've remembered my profound question!

Oz, how do you feel about pets? Do you have or have had any? Because if we're talking about animal rights, then surely the keeping of pets is just enslavement?

I know a fair few vegetarians who are vegetarians because they view eating meat as "cruel", and often they have 3 or 4 pets. They don't see that removing the animal from it's natural environment and forcing it to live with them as "cruel".

You have often mentioned that the animals we eat don't have a choice, but pretty much all pets, if not confined or put on a leash, will make a bid for freedom, with the exception of properly trained dogs who view their family as their pack.

I think the keeping of pets is cruel (though I've had plenty as a child) with the exception of dogs as mentioned above, but I eat meat - at least that's over and done with quickly; it's not life imprisonment.

Please tell me you own pets!

good point

is it cruel to treat women this way too?

[Trav Le Bleu]

good point

is it cruel to treat women this way too?

You have to be Alpha dog Zin.

[Charl91]

I've remembered my profound question!

Oz, how do you feel about pets? Do you have or have had any? Because if we're talking about animal rights, then surely the keeping of pets is just enslavement?

I know a fair few vegetarians who are vegetarians because they view eating meat as "cruel", and often they have 3 or 4 pets. They don't see that removing the animal from it's natural environment and forcing it to live with them as "cruel".

You have often mentioned that the animals we eat don't have a choice, but pretty much all pets, if not confined or put on a leash, will make a bid for freedom, with the exception of properly trained dogs who view their family as their pack.

I think the keeping of pets is cruel (though I've had plenty as a child) with the exception of dogs as mentioned above, but I eat meat - at least that's over and done with quickly; it's not life imprisonment.

Please tell me you own pets!

I have a cat. If it wants to go anywhere, then it does.

[cambridgefox]

I appreciate your input and your approach to hunting is very interesting, so im not trying to be a cvnt or anything.. more im trying to understand. How do you enjoy killing something?

Good question,I've nurtured birds with broken wings as a kid with the help of my mates dad a gamekeeper and shooter, and the joy we had releasing this jackdaw ,on one occasion was immense and no lie every time we went to the release place this jackdaw would fly to us.The next week we were shooting pigeons for the pot,it's very odd I admit.My mates dad was the same,he told me and my mate that if we ever shot anything but pigeons he would break our legs!Just last night me and my little lad went down the wash for a bike ride,saw some Egrets and stayed for ages watching,made my evening.im weird yes.

I can think of better ways to get kicks than causing pain and suffering to an animal. Even catch and release leaves the fish mangled half the time.

Me and Ozleicester also had a little spat about fishing,but I think we respect yet disagree with each others views.i do a lot of pike fishing and follow strict guidelines for protection of the fish,proper education,proper equipment and proper conditions should stop damaging fish and the pike being a magnificent creature that gets my every respect.

I'm not sure what I've done but I've just posted under oz name and made him look like a true fen hunter.ha ha

Edited 18 July 2012 by cambridgefox

[Saxondale]

cambridgefox, do you still get coypus in the fens?

[cambridgefox]

cambridgefox, do you still get coypus in the fens?

Not seen one myself but I have heard they are about.How did you know about that?

[Saxondale]

Not seen one myself but I have heard they are about.How did you know about that?

My dad tells me about when he was a boy (in the late 50s, I suppose) and he was visiting his friend in Soham, walking home from the pub down a fen lane at night and being scared shitless by a bloody great coypu. His fen friend thought nothing of it, because he was used to them, but my dad (being a Loughborough boy) had never seen one before in his life and was terrified!

Edited 18 July 2012 by BornBlue

[cambridgefox]

My dad tells me about when he was a boy (in the 60s, I suppose) and he was visiting his friend in Soham, walking home from the pub down a fen lane at night and being scared shitless by a bloody great coypu. His fen friend thought nothing of it, because he was used to them, but my dad (being a Loughborough boy) had never seen one before in his life and was terrified!

I'm near Soham,been through it today.Locals scary too.

[OzFox]

I thought they killed the wolves because they were attacking and killing their cattle, not so they would have more stuff to shoot, but to protect their livelihood, I guess the BBC lied to me then.

As for the man bear baiting, I don't approve of that, it is just retarded.

While you are here, and as the other Aussie ignored my question last time.

What do you think about Cane toads and what the problems they have caused in Australia? Do you do your civic duty and kill any you find?

Nope. The wolf cull is to boost game populations. There's enough articles about it. Ranchers will give you crap about protecting their herds as a way of legitimising the cull. A few have had cattle killed but they choose not to employ non lethal methods that would keep wolves away. You're talking about serious redneck country here...Idaho, Montana, Wyoming...shoot first ask questions later. Rather than lug their fat arses around the mountains, they use helicopters to shoot them, or traps and snares. The animal dies slowly and painfully, not that trappers care. The bloke grinning while the wolf bleeds in a steel trap is actually a forest service employee, Josh Bransford. The wolf had already been shot a couple of times. And judging by the bloodlust on the hunting/trapping websites, this legalised torture is commonplace.

Bear baiting is legal in several states of America. They kill thousands every year like this. And they still have the nerve to call themselves "sportsmen"

As for the toads, that's yet another human induced stuff up that needs to be "controlled" apparently. We don't get them down here in sydney (yet). Locals in Queensland have fun on the roads squashing as many as they can

Edited 19 July 2012 by OzFox

[OzFox]

is it cruel to treat women this way too?

I don't think so.

In my house it's the other way round. I'm well fed, get a bit of grooming and let off the leash occasionally.

[cambridgefox]

Nope. The wolf cull is to boost game populations. There's enough articles about it. Ranchers will give you crap about protecting their herds as a way of legitimising the cull. A few have had cattle killed but they choose not to employ non lethal methods that would keep wolves away. You're talking about serious redneck country here...Idaho, Montana, Wyoming...shoot first ask questions later. Rather than lug their fat arses around the mountains, they use helicopters to shoot them, or traps and snares. The animal dies slowly and painfully, not that trappers care. The bloke grinning while the wolf bleeds in a steel trap is actually a forest service employee, Josh Bransford. The wolf had already been shot a couple of times. And judging by the bloodlust on the hunting/trapping websites, this legalised torture is commonplace.

Bear baiting is legal in several states of America. They kill thousands every year like this. And they still have the nerve to call themselves "sportsmen"

As for the toads, that's yet another human induced stuff up that needs to be "controlled" apparently. We don't get them down here in sydney (yet). Locals in Queensland have fun on the roads squashing as many as they can

I remember the toads in Cairns rather large,but nice to see.Where abouts in Sydney are you?love that city,I was staying with a friend many years ago in Newport near palm beach,Dee Why area of the northern beaches seemed a nice area.

[OzFox]

I remember the toads in Cairns rather large,but nice to see.Where abouts in Sydney are you?love that city,I was staying with a friend many years ago in Newport near palm beach,Dee Why area of the northern beaches seemed a nice area.

Lilyfield in the Inner West. Not as posh as the northern beaches but it takes me ten minutes to get into the city which is convenient

Yeah toads are everywhere in Cairns. They just discovered that the tadpoles are attracted to the toxins produced by the adults, so think they can use that to capture them and knock 'em off

[Reynard Bleu]

The way we treat our animals for food, pets, sport, etc had developed (if thats the right word) over thousands of years. Intensive animal farming perhaps over the past 50-60 years. There is some evidence of change, but its a slow process. I still eat meat, but try and buy stuff where I can be reasonably sure that its not been intensively farmed. Its not easy, labels in most cases are worthless. To many its not worth the effort and of course to many the cost is the prime factor. Me I eat less but try and eat what I know has been reasonably reared without fear, overcrowding or cruel treatment (although I guess killing it is pretty cruel).

Fox hunting, badger bating and such like have no place in our society. Its cruelty and death for the sake of it. Game shooting in the UK, I blow hot and cold on. People who shoot game to eat beacuse they live in the country and its always been a source of food for that community is one thing, the huge corporate shoots where thousands of birds are bred for shooting is another I think.

We have dogs, a horse, chickens and two minature goats. They roam freely within the bounds of my land and are well cared for. My dogs are without doubt my best friends.

[OzFox]

The way we treat our animals for food, pets, sport, etc had developed (if thats the right word) over thousands of years. Intensive animal farming perhaps over the past 50-60 years. There is some evidence of change, but its a slow process. I still eat meat, but try and buy stuff where I can be reasonably sure that its not been intensively farmed. Its not easy, labels in most cases are worthless. To many its not worth the effort and of course to many the cost is the prime factor. Me I eat less but try and eat what I know has been reasonably reared without fear, overcrowding or cruel treatment (although I guess killing it is pretty cruel).

Yeah it's a tricky one. Big effort and like you say you can't trust the label anyway. They seem to be constantly moving the goalposts on the definition of "free range". Egg producers over here want the definition to change from 1500 chickens a hectare to 20,000

There probably isn't enough space left to feed our population free range anyway, even if people could afford it

[Darkon84]

Nope. The wolf cull is to boost game populations. There's enough articles about it. Ranchers will give you crap about protecting their herds as a way of legitimising the cull. A few have had cattle killed but they choose not to employ non lethal methods that would keep wolves away. You're talking about serious redneck country here...Idaho, Montana, Wyoming...shoot first ask questions later. Rather than lug their fat arses around the mountains, they use helicopters to shoot them, or traps and snares. The animal dies slowly and painfully, not that trappers care. The bloke grinning while the wolf bleeds in a steel trap is actually a forest service employee, Josh Bransford. The wolf had already been shot a couple of times. And judging by the bloodlust on the hunting/trapping websites, this legalised torture is commonplace.

Bear baiting is legal in several states of America. They kill thousands every year like this. And they still have the nerve to call themselves "sportsmen"

As for the toads, that's yet another human induced stuff up that needs to be "controlled" apparently. We don't get them down here in sydney (yet). Locals in Queensland have fun on the roads squashing as many as they can

Id love to smash that smug cvnts face in with a baseball bat, complete with protruding nails.

[OzFox]

Id love to smash that smug cvnts face in with a baseball bat, complete with protruding nails.

Maybe you can mention that to his boss, Nez Perce National Forest Supervisor Rick Brazell [email protected]

The good thing about youtube and camera phones is that these fvckers are dumb enough to post stuff on the internet and brag to each other. What they get up to in the woods is no longer a secret. Unfortunately there's thousands of them.

[Darkon84]

Maybe you can mention that to his boss, Nez Perce National Forest Supervisor Rick Brazell [email protected]

The good thing about youtube and camera phones is that these fvckers are dumb enough to post stuff on the internet and brag to each other. What they get up to in the woods is no longer a secret. Unfortunately there's thousands of them.

Might take the time to write something this afternoon than, because that picture says a thousand words, and none of them are good.

No doubt his boss probably has that very same picture up on the wall with 'Employee of the month' underneath it though.

I take it you have contacted him before then?

[OzFox]

Might take the time to write something this afternoon than, because that picture says a thousand words, and none of them are good.

No doubt his boss probably has that very same picture up on the wall with 'Employee of the month' underneath it though.

I take it you have contacted him before then?

Only today when I saw the email address. I think a lot of people were sickened by it so there was a lot of protest. They were trying to get him prosecuted for cruelty.

[Darkon84]

Only today when I saw the email address. I think a lot of people were sickened by it so there was a lot of protest. They were trying to get him prosecuted for cruelty.

How old is that photo then? Fairly recent?

Culling happens, its fact. Im not totally happy about it, but have to accept it. In such a situation, we can only hope that its quick, but to taunt a severely injured animal in such a way and appear to take pleasure in it, is plain sick and wrong. Makes you wonder how many other animals have been teased and wounded by him and other sick fvcks. I cant get my head round how they can stand there and allow the animal to be in such pain, and not be sick to the stomach.

[OzFox]

How old is that photo then? Fairly recent?

Culling happens, its fact. Im not totally happy about it, but have to accept it. In such a situation, we can only hope that its quick, but to taunt a severely injured animal in such a way and appear to take pleasure in it, is plain sick and wrong. Makes you wonder how many other animals have been teased and wounded by him and other sick fvcks. I cant get my head round how they can stand there and allow the animal to be in such pain, and not be sick to the stomach.

Mid March I think. There was already a crowd there taking pot shots before he got there apparently.

Snares are horrible things as the animal takes ages to die but a lot of people get a kick out of it. Here's a couple of guffawing idiots

there's plenty worse out there

[Darkon84]

Inbred morons.

[Rincewind]

Hunters use the wrong weapons.

[OzFox]

Hunters use the wrong weapons.

They say it's the most dangerous animal in America. Kills more people than bears, mountain lions and snakes (usually when people swerve to avoid them and smash into a tree)

[ozleicester]

I thought they killed the wolves because they were attacking and killing their cattle, not so they would have more stuff to shoot, but to protect their livelihood, I guess the BBC lied to me then.

As for the man bear baiting, I don't approve of that, it is just retarded.

While you are here, and as the other Aussie ignored my question last time.

What do you think about Cane toads and what the problems they have caused in Australia? Do you do your civic duty and kill any you find?

Sorry Shrap i mustve missed your initial question about toads.

Bloody shambles is what led to the cane toads, they were introduced to assist with farming of sugar cane by eating grubs that were eating the cane...sadly the fvckwits who brought them in, didnt realise the grubs lived at the top of the cane...out of reach of the toads.. duh (at least thats my understanding, i stand to be corrected). However the toads discovered (much like most immigrants to Oz) that this is the perfect place to relax, get laid and produce multiple offspring..in their case millions of offspring.

However as to how to address the little buggers, no i dont support a cull, im sure there are ways to reduce their reproductive abilities which i support.

I've remembered my profound question!

Oz, how do you feel about pets? Do you have or have had any? Because if we're talking about animal rights, then surely the keeping of pets is just enslavement?

I know a fair few vegetarians who are vegetarians because they view eating meat as "cruel", and often they have 3 or 4 pets. They don't see that removing the animal from it's natural environment and forcing it to live with them as "cruel".

You have often mentioned that the animals we eat don't have a choice, but pretty much all pets, if not confined or put on a leash, will make a bid for freedom, with the exception of properly trained dogs who view their family as their pack.

I think the keeping of pets is cruel (though I've had plenty as a child) with the exception of dogs as mentioned above, but I eat meat - at least that's over and done with quickly; it's not life imprisonment.

Please tell me you own pets!

I "own" a cat he is 14 years old, balding and has 3 teeth, he was saved from an animal shelter. i dont own him, he allows me to feed and provide him with warmth and shelter. He does not leave the house as even as a simple old man he is still capable of threatening the native wildlife, so he sits in the window and dreams.

Your next question wuill undoubtably be what do we feed him... he is mostly vegetarian with 5 of his seven days being vegetable based, after his previous 10 or so years before we got him i imagine to completely deny him meat would be unfair and so we have progressed him through to this point over the 3 years weve had him.

How old is that photo then? Fairly recent?

Culling happens, its fact. Im not totally happy about it, but have to accept it. In such a situation, we can only hope that its quick, but to taunt a severely injured animal in such a way and appear to take pleasure in it, is plain sick and wrong. Makes you wonder how many other animals have been teased and wounded by him and other sick fvcks. I cant get my head round how they can stand there and allow the animal to be in such pain, and not be sick to the stomach.

No..no we dont HAVE to accept it, Unless we are little more than sheep incapable of independent thought and decision - if that is you though..just watch out, its not a big step from killing stupid animals, to killing stupid (human) animals.

I think earlier someone mentioned killing bugs etc, so to address that...

Ive never put myself up as perfect, im not even a completely successful Vegan....just someone who tries very hard to do what i feel is right...

I avoid leather goods where i can, (to be honest, leather is a crappier, less long wearing and weaker material than synthetics these days) but i have owned a car with leather seats (it was secondhand so thats part of my internal justification).

In the garden if i see a row of ants, or a bug etc.. i will change my step or direction or deliberatley try to avoid harming it, theres a more than good chance by avoiding one, i will step on another unknowingly, but that i think is the crux of my opinion... where i can, I TRY TO AVOID HARMING OTHERS.

[OzFox]

In the garden if i see a row of ants, or a bug etc.. i will change my step or direction or deliberatley try to avoid harming it, theres a more than good chance by avoiding one, i will step on another unknowingly, but that i think is the crux of my opinion... where i can, I TRY TO AVOID HARMING OTHERS.

Same here. Doesn't always work out though. I once spent ages getting a spider out of the bath, took it to the back door and tossed it out onto the back porch. Within seconds a sparrow flew down, picked it up and ate it.