Manwell Pablo Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 I know Portugal are much more than just Ronaldo but he could win the World Cup by himself given a chance... He's bound to get at least one goal per match. Nah Ronaldo, thus far, has a tendency to vanish, sometimes when Portugal need him the most, fair enough he's turned up in the play offs this time around but he turned up in the play offs for Euro 2012 and when it came down to the tournament he failed to make an impression on a number of games. I can't see this changing, in the biggest games Ronaldo and in fact Messi can be marked out of a game by a world class back four, it's football when your playing against the best defenders the world has to offer you can't always light up every game. This has been evident in top level Champions League and World Cup games they two have played in. It is incorrect to say either of them "always go missing" but you can expect both of them to have games when they don't score, do very little, and everyone is wondering what all the fuss is about just because a top class defender has done a job on them. Argentina might have the quality in other areas of the pitch to go far in the tournament but Portugal rely on Ronaldo far too much. Like us, they'll do well to get to the quarters if you ask me.
Zingari Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 I wish England had a player that vanished liked Ronaldo
Bobby Hundreds Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 Nah Ronaldo, thus far, has a tendency to vanish, sometimes when Portugal need him the most, fair enough he's turned up in the play offs this time around but he turned up in the play offs for Euro 2012 and when it came down to the tournament he failed to make an impression on a number of games. I can't see this changing, in the biggest games Ronaldo and in fact Messi can be marked out of a game by a world class back four, it's football when your playing against the best defenders the world has to offer you can't always light up every game. This has been evident in top level Champions League and World Cup games they two have played in. It is incorrect to say either of them "always go missing" but you can expect both of them to have games when they don't score, do very little, and everyone is wondering what all the fuss is about just because a top class defender has done a job on them. Argentina might have the quality in other areas of the pitch to go far in the tournament but Portugal rely on Ronaldo far too much. Like us, they'll do well to get to the quarters if you ask me. He's their top scorer with 47 and scores roughly once ever two games. I think that's a well above average record for international duty.
Manwell Pablo Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 He's their top scorer with 47 and scores roughly once ever two games. I think that's a well above average record for international duty. His overall scoring record is completely irrelevant to any point raised above, so what's your point.
Manwell Pablo Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 I wish England had a player that vanished liked Ronaldo As do I, but again, not relevant to anything I've said
ScouseFox Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 It's almost as if some people didn't watch Euro 2012. Ronaldo single handedly took a pretty shite Portugal team to penalty kicks away from the final. Not many have them a chance of getting out the group. He destroyed Holland by himself, scored twice and MOTM, he won the quarter, scoring and MOTM. He wasn't up to much against Spain but look at the rest of his team vs Spain's, not a lot he could've done. Add to that his performances in play offs recently (2011 and 2013), him being their captain and record scorer etc and Id say it was very harsh to keep believing this media bullshit that hes never played well for his country. And he's much, much better now than he even was then. A bit of luck with the draw and he could win the World Cup by himself. He won't, I don't think, but he could in this form.
Manwell Pablo Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 It's almost as if some people didn't watch Euro 2012. Ronaldo single handedly took a pretty shite Portugal team to penalty kicks away from the final. Not many have them a chance of getting out the group. He destroyed Holland by himself, scored twice and MOTM, he won the quarter, scoring and MOTM. He wasn't up to much against Spain but look at the rest of his team vs Spain's, not a lot he could've done. Add to that his performances in play offs recently (2011 and 2013), him being their captain and record scorer etc and Id say it was very harsh to keep believing this media bullshit that hes never played well for his country. And he's much, much better now than he even was then. A bit of luck with the draw and he could win the World Cup by himself. He won't, I don't think, but he could in this form. Yeah that's the problem here Or Denmark, Or Germany. Go back to previous tournaments, you'll see the same pattern in every tournament he's played, go's missing in certain games. I'll say it again, reading and understanding seems to be difficult for you certain, certain. You could perhaps say some or not every. Here http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/Certain?s=t I'm getting a little frustrated now, do people have severe comprehension issues on this site? He doesn't go missing in every game, he does however go missing in some, and when he does, the rest of his team aren't up to the task of beating a world class opposition, and they lose, and they go out. Therefore, he is, in my eyes, incapable of "winning a world cup by himself" and there is very little to suggest otherwise. Not for a second denying he's one of the best players in the world but he's not capable of that. EDIT: In fact, looking back at this, your even arguing my own point for me, what could he have done against the Spanish? Won the game single handily according to you! You can't say Ronaldo is capable of winning a World cup cup by himself (disclaimer: unless they play Spain or Germany)
ScouseFox Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 He couldn't win it by himself 2 years ago, no, hence he didn't. He's a better player now, ridiculously. I also said with the luck of the draw, ie. avoiding Spain or Germany until a final or something. Think it's a bit harsh to criticise him when he does turn up quite often (47 goals, a few in major tournaments and a lot in play offs) because he doesn't win every game by himself. Cut him a bit of slack man ! If he is in this form in the World Cup and Portugal can put 10 other players capable of passing him the ball in their team then they could get very far. If he "goes missing" or his form drops then game over because the rest of them are pretty shite.
Dan Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 It's Messi's year in 2014. Ronaldo deserves the Ballon D'Or and I actually think if Messi wins it then it'll devalue the whole accolade in general because there's no way he's had a better 2013 than Ronaldo, but I can see him bouncing back by lifting the WC trophy - dispelling this utter myth that he's shit for Argentina as well.
Manwell Pablo Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 He couldn't win it by himself 2 years ago, no, hence he didn't. He's a better player now, ridiculously. I also said with the luck of the draw, ie. avoiding Spain or Germany until a final or something. Think it's a bit harsh to criticise him when he does turn up quite often (47 goals, a few in major tournaments and a lot in play offs) because he doesn't win every game by himself. Cut him a bit of slack man ! If he is in this form in the World Cup and Portugal can put 10 other players capable of passing him the ball in their team then they could get very far. If he "goes missing" or his form drops then game over because the rest of them are pretty shite. Massive sigh. I'm not criticsing him, saying I don't think he or Portugal are going to win the World Cup for the reasons I have stated is not criticsem. How many footballers in the history of World Football have teared up all 5 stages of a World Cup with a average team behind them, hardly any, you can't rely on one man to win a World Cup he's not impossible to mark and better defenses will do a job on him half of the time. Which has happened at every single tournament he's played in so far since 2004, on occasions where they have had players capable around him as well, so I don't see whats wrong with suggesting it might happen again.
MC Prussian Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 On a sidenote, Mexico have now definitely secured their ticket - a ticket that was never in real danger. Beat New Zealand comfortably 4-2 in the second leg today.
leicsmac Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 It's Messi's year in 2014. Ronaldo deserves the Ballon D'Or and I actually think if Messi wins it then it'll devalue the whole accolade in general because there's no way he's had a better 2013 than Ronaldo, but I can see him bouncing back by lifting the WC trophy - dispelling this utter myth that he's shit for Argentina as well. He had a pretty piss poor WC2010 (by his own very high standards) to be fair, especially against Germany. This will be a better opportunity for him, mind.
Pride_Of_The_Midlands Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 Ronaldo performs better for Portugal than Messi does for Argentina. Messi has never scored at the World Cup and I don't remember him doing anything good at the Copa America in his own country.
Amin Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 Ronaldo performs better for Portugal than Messi does for Argentina. Messi has never scored at the World Cup and I don't remember him doing anything good at the Copa America in his own country. He scored at the World Cup in 2006 IIRC.
Dan Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 He had a pretty piss poor WC2010 (by his own very high standards) to be fair, especially against Germany. This will be a better opportunity for him, mind. Messi had a poor cup by his standards, to not score was very disappointing I agree. But other than that, he really isn't bad for Argentina. Look at his goals ratio and tell me how poor he is for them.
Bobby Hundreds Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 His overall scoring record is completely irrelevant to any point raised above, so what's your point. That it's a myth that he doesn't perform or has a tendency to vanish when he plays for Portugal.
Manwell Pablo Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 Messi had a poor cup by his standards, to not score was very disappointing I agree. But other than that, he really isn't bad for Argentina. Look at his goals ratio and tell me how poor he is for them. About as good as Wayne Rooney is for us by the looks of it, which is nothing to write home about.
Manwell Pablo Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 That it's a myth that he doesn't perform or has a tendency to vanish when he plays for Portugal. Yes, and pointing out that he's scored 47 goals in 109 appearances really shows that he never goes missing for Portugal in major finals. I see reading and understanding is a problem for someone else, I said he does in certain big games in Major Finals, not every time he plays for Portugal. Where as casting your mind back to, Denmark Germany Spain 2012. Spain 2010 (scored one goal all tournament against North Korea) Germany 2008. Even against us and again against Germany in 2006 you'll remember that Ronaldo does go missing in big tournament games sometimes, as that's exactly what he did in all of those games, funnily enough against organised sides because as I've said, there are defenders in the game that can live with him. Especially when he's the only major threat they have to worry about. Fortunately for him hardly any of them play in Spain.
Dan Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 About as good as Wayne Rooney is for us by the looks of it, which is nothing to write home about. Messi plays against far better opposition. The poorest teams they play are the likes of Peru, Bolivia and Venezuela. All sides who'd be around 3rd/4th in European qualifying groups.
Manwell Pablo Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 Messi plays against far better opposition. The poorest teams they play are the likes of Peru, Bolivia and Venezuela. All sides who'd be around 3rd/4th in European qualifying groups. That's grabbing at straws if ever I've seen it. But ok then. Less effective than Gonzalo Higuain, which is nothing to write home about
Dan Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 That's grabbing at straws if ever I've seen it. But ok then. Less effective than Gonzalo Higuain, which is nothing to write home about How is it? He's playing against far better quality teams than Rooney is. Then again, he's in a better quality team than Rooney. Higuain is criminally under-rated.
leicsmac Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 Messi had a poor cup by his standards, to not score was very disappointing I agree. But other than that, he really isn't bad for Argentina. Look at his goals ratio and tell me how poor he is for them. I agree, but for me the problem with him and Ronaldo is similar: they've both delivered at the highest possible level for their clubs (well, with Ronaldo its a bit tenuous) but they are both yet to do so for their country in the truly critical games against tough, tough opposition in knockout matches. I know international football is no longer the be all and end all, but the question mark still remains for them to set one World Cup alight in the way that many other true legends of the game have.
Manwell Pablo Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 How is it? He's playing against far better quality teams than Rooney is. Then again, he's in a better quality team than Rooney. Higuain is criminally under-rated. Not really I think you've somewhat over estimated Bolivia and Venezuela somewhat and you're only referring to World Cup Qualifying your forgetting friendlies and the Euro's a competition which only comprises the best 16 teams in Europe. I don't agree with pointing to the goals for column to back up a players ability anyway but to do so with Messi, a man capable of a goal at club level yet can't even make one in two at international level seems silly to me. agreed but he's some distance from best player in the world would you not say.
Haydos Posted 20 November 2013 Posted 20 November 2013 Fair play to Ronaldo for finishing them but who played those first and third passes? Absolutely unbelievable. As for Ronaldo winning the world cup alone, eh, pretty sure people said that last time and he was awful. As were Portugal. Think they were both Moutinho, he got 2 assists anyway.
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.