marbelladave Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 The Pozzos make money by using their massive scouting network. Recent finds have been Christian Zapata(sold to Villareal) Gokhan Inler (Napoli), and Alexis Sanchez (Barcelona). They turn a profit every year. Once Vydra gets his mojo back he'll fetch £15m. This is the downside - our best players will be moved on when they hit peak value. That is excellent business but as you point out you may lose your best players on a regular basis. That said, those are the circumstances that all but a very few of the top clubs have to operate in anyway. If Watford can keep it's identity as a 'separate' club than this could really work well for you but you have to remember, in this sort of setup the future of your club is in the hands of others, you may be benefiting tremendously from this setup at the moment but what happens when the Pozzo family shifts emphasis and suddenly all your better players find themselves loaned out to Granada for a season or two? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilo Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 That is excellent business but as you point out you may lose your best players on a regular basis. That said, those are the circumstances that all but a very few of the top clubs have to operate in anyway. If Watford can keep it's identity as a 'separate' club than this could really work well for you but you have to remember, in this sort of setup the future of your club is in the hands of others, you may be benefiting tremendously from this setup at the moment but what happens when the Pozzo family shifts emphasis and suddenly all your better players find themselves loaned out to Granada for a season or two? Totally agree. With Udinese an established Serie A club in regular European action and in the Pozzo's domestic sphere, Watford and Granada will always be the junior clubs in the network. If Vydra et al do become genuinely top class players, they will either be sold on or returned to Udinese quicker than you can say arrivederci. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz63 Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 Totally agree. With Udinese an established Serie A club in regular European action and in the Pozzo's domestic sphere, Watford and Granada will always be the junior clubs in the network. If Vydra et al do become genuinely top class players, they will either be sold on or returned to Udinese quicker than you can say arrivederci. Not entirely true. While Udinese is their spiritual home, they are no longer financially strong. TV money is sparse, and clubs below the top 5 get pittance. IF we got promoted, we would become the richest club in their network by a country mile - and in turn we would become their most important asset. Udinese won't make europe this year as well as it stands. They make money from buying and selling players, no Watford fan has a problem with that. They've transformed our club for the better both on and off the pitch this year, and our identity is stronger than its ever been - contrary to what the media might say. We were on the verge of bankruptcy last year under our former crook of a chariman, so having the Pozzo's at the helm is a massive blessing for us. Say what you will about us....'tin pot club etc....' , but we've not dropped below the Championship in going on 16 years - can you say the same? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonaldinho Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 Not entirely true. While Udinese is their spiritual home, they are no longer financially strong. TV money is sparse, and clubs below the top 5 get pittance. IF we got promoted, we would become the richest club in their network by a country mile - and in turn we would become their most important asset. Udinese won't make europe this year as well as it stands. They make money from buying and selling players, no Watford fan has a problem with that. They've transformed our club for the better both on and off the pitch this year, and our identity is stronger than its ever been - contrary to what the media might say. We were on the verge of bankruptcy last year under our former crook of a chariman, so having the Pozzo's at the helm is a massive blessing for us. Say what you will about us....'tin pot club etc....' , but we've not dropped below the Championship in going on 16 years - can you say the same? What is your identity? That you've loaned in a load of foreigners that you hadn't heard of before this season? That youre just one of three clubs that your owners control? Doesn't seem like much of an identity to me. No we can't say the same, but we have only spent one season down there, compared to the dozens of years you've spent down there. An odd point to use against us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbelladave Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 Totally agree. With Udinese an established Serie A club in regular European action and in the Pozzo's domestic sphere, Watford and Granada will always be the junior clubs in the network. If Vydra et al do become genuinely top class players, they will either be sold on or returned to Udinese quicker than you can say arrivederci. Not entirely true. While Udinese is their spiritual home, they are no longer financially strong. TV money is sparse, and clubs below the top 5 get pittance. IF we got promoted, we would become the richest club in their network by a country mile - and in turn we would become their most important asset. Udinese won't make europe this year as well as it stands. They make money from buying and selling players, no Watford fan has a problem with that. They've transformed our club for the better both on and off the pitch this year, and our identity is stronger than its ever been - contrary to what the media might say. We were on the verge of bankruptcy last year under our former crook of a chariman, so having the Pozzo's at the helm is a massive blessing for us. Say what you will about us....'tin pot club etc....' , but we've not dropped below the Championship in going on 16 years - can you say the same? Interesting posts both, the idea of your club being part of a 'stable' of clubs is one that it is quite difficult to 'get your head around'. Not knocking it, banding together may well be a viable way forward for clubs unable to compete at the highest level on their own As I said it is about emphasis, Watford in the EPL may be the moneymaker but if the Pozzos chose to put all their effort into making Udine a top Serie A club you could still find yourself playing second fiddle. Could be an interesting ride....... And Gaz, no need for the dig in the last line, this is an interesting topic, worthy of sensible discussion. And ignore jonaldinho, he hasn't a clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilo Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 Not entirely true. While Udinese is their spiritual home, they are no longer financially strong. TV money is sparse, and clubs below the top 5 get pittance. IF we got promoted, we would become the richest club in their network by a country mile - and in turn we would become their most important asset. Udinese won't make europe this year as well as it stands. They make money from buying and selling players, no Watford fan has a problem with that. They've transformed our club for the better both on and off the pitch this year, and our identity is stronger than its ever been - contrary to what the media might say. We were on the verge of bankruptcy last year under our former crook of a chariman, so having the Pozzo's at the helm is a massive blessing for us. Say what you will about us....'tin pot club etc....' , but we've not dropped below the Championship in going on 16 years - can you say the same? We could equally ask how many top ten Premiership finishes, League Cups and European qualifications you've had in the same time period. Or point out the fact we've spent one season outside the top two divisions in 129 years of football, our aspirations are clearly rather different. I'm sure it has been a fun ride for you this year but the fact remains that you still have no say over these players' futures. If a bigger fish than Watford, you could even argue Cardiff fall into that category with billionaires at the helm, fancy Vydra or Abdi then the Pozzos will sell them. No recompense for Watford because they aren't your players, nothing. I would feel uncomfortable knowing my club was part of a multi-national network of clubs, there could always be a conflict of interest coming in to play. Say Udinese had a resurgence and looked like qualifying for the UCL, where do you think the energies and resources would be directed? Top 4 in Serie A or 17th in the Premiership? For all the Thais' faults, I'm pleased we're the only football club they have an interest in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonaldinho Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 Interesting posts both, the idea of your club being part of a 'stable' of clubs is one that it is quite difficult to 'get your head around'. Not knocking it, banding together may well be a viable way forward for clubs unable to compete at the highest level on their own As I said it is about emphasis, Watford in the EPL may be the moneymaker but if the Pozzos chose to put all their effort into making Udine a top Serie A club you could still find yourself playing second fiddle. Could be an interesting ride....... And Gaz, no need for the dig in the last line, this is an interesting topic, worthy of sensible discussion. And ignore jonaldinho, he hasn't a clue. Interesting posts both, the idea of your club being part of a 'stable' of clubs is one that it is quite difficult to 'get your head around'. Not knocking it, banding together may well be a viable way forward for clubs unable to compete at the highest level on their own As I said it is about emphasis, Watford in the EPL may be the moneymaker but if the Pozzos chose to put all their effort into making Udine a top Serie A club you could still find yourself playing second fiddle. Could be an interesting ride....... And Gaz, no need for the dig in the last line, this is an interesting topic, worthy of sensible discussion. And ignore jonaldinho, he hasn't a clue. I was questioning Watford's identity when they don't own over half of their squad and when they're owners have other footballing priorities. I wasn't fond of the number of loans we brought in a couple of seasons ago, as I prefer being able to know the playing squad and have the same players around for more than a few months. So why don't I have a clue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz63 Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 As I said, promotion to the Premiership would mean we would be the strongest side financially in their group. Udinese bring in the same crowds as we do - so its not hard to believe that we would be their priority. 4th in Serie A doesn't bring you as much money as staying in the Premiership. Abdi has stated his desire to stay with us regardless, as have the majority of the other loan players. Vydra may well be sold, but the consensus is that Fernando Forestieri is the better player. That being said, I wouldn't put it past Vydra staying if we were promoted. Of course they'll want to sell these lads eventually, we're not blind to that fact. But given a month in the summer, they put together a group of players that have seen us score 84 goals, and in with a shout for automatic promotion. They've got plenty of players at their disposal, and whoever leaves will be replaced. They've secured the futures of about 6/7 youth team players this year as well, with Tommie Hoban and Jonathan Bond playing vital roles, with Smith, Thompson, Hodson and Murray all playing a part. They've invested a large amount of money in our side, and they'll want to make sure their investment pays off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonaldinho Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 As I said, promotion to the Premiership would mean we would be the strongest side financially in their group. Udinese bring in the same crowds as we do - so its not hard to believe that we would be their priority. 4th in Serie A doesn't bring you as much money as staying in the Premiership. Abdi has stated his desire to stay with us regardless, as have the majority of the other loan players. Vydra may well be sold, but the consensus is that Fernando Forestieri is the better player. That being said, I wouldn't put it past Vydra staying if we were promoted. Of course they'll want to sell these lads eventually, we're not blind to that fact. But given a month in the summer, they put together a group of players that have seen us score 84 goals, and in with a shout for automatic promotion. They've got plenty of players at their disposal, and whoever leaves will be replaced. They've secured the futures of about 6/7 youth team players this year as well, with Tommie Hoban and Jonathan Bond playing vital roles, with Smith, Thompson, Hodson and Murray all playing a part. They've invested a large amount of money in our side, and they'll want to make sure their investment pays off. I understand where you're coming from, and going from what you've said were you to get promoted then you'd be able to secure the current crop of players to permanent contracts on relatively cheap deals, and there would be plenty of money to spend. It's what happens if you don't get promoted which would bother me. You've alluded there to a fresh batch of players coming in to replace the current crop. I don't know how many will leave, as many look capable of top flight football, but does it not bother you that you could just have a whole new team of loans next season? I can see the fa changing the rules regardless so you won't be able to bring in as many, nor play as many at once. Aside from that however, what I was trying to get at earlier, before Dave pointed out that I didn't know what I was talking about, is that don't you feel like you've lost some of your 'identity' with this inevitable revolving door of loan players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz63 Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 The media has made the false assumption that we are going to repeat this every single season. The truth is that we were under a transfer embargo last summer, when the FL were alerted by our new owners about the wrongdoings of our previous owner. This meant that when we were granted permission to sign players, that it was just simply easier for the Pozzo's to loan the players, rather than transferring registration. It also served as a way of being able to see who could cut it at this level, and who couldn't. As it is, maybe 4 players are surplus to requirements - and we've got the option to make every loan permanent. The identity thing would bother me if I sensed the loanees showed no commitment, but every single one of them (even the duff ones) has been determined to prove their worth for the side. Cassetti for example has been an absolute warrior for us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theessexfox Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 Hello enjoyed last night obviously. Here's my report. Better luck next season... FWIW I thought Morgan and Keane did really well, your midfield couldn't contain ours as others have pointed out. http://bhappy.wordpr...ord-2-26042013/ M Superb read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fox and The Crow Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 I suspect there's very few forms of ownership or investment in football that are entirely ethical or fair, we could argue all day about who is worse. One thing we can individually control however, is the manner by which we conduct ourselves on our own or other people's forums. Currently we seem to have adopted several who are acting like utter c*nts; remember boys, you are what you is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJS Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 The media has made the false assumption that we are going to repeat this every single season. The truth is that we were under a transfer embargo last summer, when the FL were alerted by our new owners about the wrongdoings of our previous owner. This meant that when we were granted permission to sign players, that it was just simply easier for the Pozzo's to loan the players, rather than transferring registration. It also served as a way of being able to see who could cut it at this level, and who couldn't. As it is, maybe 4 players are surplus to requirements - and we've got the option to make every loan permanent. The identity thing would bother me if I sensed the loanees showed no commitment, but every single one of them (even the duff ones) has been determined to prove their worth for the side. Cassetti for example has been an absolute warrior for us Hmm. I dispute that loan signings were made only because it was an easier way to sign players. Granada had eleven Udinese owned players on their books when they won promotion to La Liga, six of whom started the day they sealed promotion. It's what the Pozzos do. I don't have a particular problem with it; it's within the rules. But I can't say I'd like to see it here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbelladave Posted 27 April 2013 Share Posted 27 April 2013 I was questioning Watford's identity when they don't own over half of their squad and when they're owners have other footballing priorities. I wasn't fond of the number of loans we brought in a couple of seasons ago, as I prefer being able to know the playing squad and have the same players around for more than a few months. So why don't I have a clue? We have 'loaned' something approaching £100 million from our owners. This, with FFP on the horizon puts us into, arguably, a worse position than Watford. At the end of the day we are both modest sized clubs trying to make our way within the rules imposed upon us. Watford are obeying the rules as are we, no real difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woddyuk Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 What a goal from Chalobah. Still can't believe we were comfortable in the playoffsIn February and we've completely bottled it. Goal of the season contender to be fair. Deserves more recognition. If it were scored by Rooney,Suarez,Lampard etc the media would still be wanking over it. But as its an unknown from Watford have 4 seconds on SSN instead, now back to the darts.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KFS Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 Can't be arsed to read any more Watford fan drivel. At the end of the day, you're just a Pozzo franchise. Sure, you see stars in your shirt but not for long, I personally wouldn't be happy to see it happen at Leicester- that isn't because i'm bitter or jealous, I genuinely wouldn't like it. For me it's a step down from changing your colours and badge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super_horns Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 Can't be arsed to read any more Watford fan drivel. At the end of the day, you're just a Pozzo franchise. Sure, you see stars in your shirt but not for long, I personally wouldn't be happy to see it happen at Leicester- that isn't because i'm bitter or jealous, I genuinely wouldn't like it. For me it's a step down from changing your colours and badge. I';d be honesy and say some of our fans didn't like the idea and probably wouldn't if it was lets say Ipswich but the success and style of play has meant its been pretty positive. Plus the fact we don't have the bankrupt Bassini at the club now - I mean yes we all get stick for having overseas owners but if he is the standard of the british ones then that is a worry too as he easily got pas the "fit and proper" persons test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KFS Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 I';d be honesy and say some of our fans didn't like the idea and probably wouldn't if it was lets say Ipswich but the success and style of play has meant its been pretty positive. Plus the fact we don't have the bankrupt Bassini at the club now - I mean yes we all get stick for having overseas owners but if he is the standard of the british ones then that is a worry too as he easily got pas the "fit and proper" persons test. I'll just add that you seem to be the only invader with a brain in your head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super_horns Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 I'll just add that you seem to be the only invader with a brain in your head. Well Matt R. I've been here long term - think I'd get banned if I started to kick off! Anyway we aren't up yet and well unless we get lucky the Premier league might not be great results wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz63 Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 Can't be arsed to read any more Watford fan drivel. At the end of the day, you're just a Pozzo franchise. Sure, you see stars in your shirt but not for long, I personally wouldn't be happy to see it happen at Leicester- that isn't because i'm bitter or jealous, I genuinely wouldn't like it. For me it's a step down from changing your colours and badge. I honestly don't get the hatred towards what we've done. We know players will leave, this is exactly the same situation at all bar a few clubs in the world! Do you feel that your best players will stay at Leicester forever and ever? We're a small club, who as of last summer were on the verge of being taken under by a crook. This situation suits the fans down to the ground. The owners are football people, and in turn they don't sugar coat anything. Forestieri is the best player I've seen in a Watford shirt in my lifetime, and the owners took little time in getting him tied down to a 5 year deal. Does that mean he'll stay for 5 years? Not a chance. But it shows the commitment they have towards making us a half decent side Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shiv Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 Just watched the highlights and yet again the FLS manage to make a fairly even game look like we got battered. Such a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie Z Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 Just watched the highlights and yet again the FLS manage to make a fairly even game look like we got battered. Such a joke. That would be because you did...you were shite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KFS Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 That would be because you did...you were shite. We passed the ball better than you during some periods! Your number 12 was banana passing it over to De Laet every time he had the opportunity? If we were shite then so were you, I said it the other day, we were separated by a wonder goal- you passing it sideways until Vydra got pressed off the ball is not domination, sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KFS Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 Anyway, why are these gimps even here still? You've got playoffs and won the game? Not only have you come onto an opposing fans forum after fiddling with your pencil dicks, you've jumped up on the tallest tower to look down on us (probably that awful concrete block in your amazing stadium), not only that but you're still fvcking here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilo Posted 28 April 2013 Share Posted 28 April 2013 We passed the ball better than you during some periods! Your number 12 was banana passing it over to De Laet every time he had the opportunity? If we were shite then so were you, I said it the other day, we were separated by a wonder goal- you passing it sideways until Vydra got pressed off the ball is not domination, sorry. Why engage the child? He's thick as shit. Let him get back to his homework you bastard, you keep making him scribble outside the lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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