The Doctor Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 Finland has one of the highest suicide rates in the developed world, so I guess that's that argument out of the window Really, because according to the WHO it's 18th, behind Belgium, Croatia, Russia, Japan, South Korea to name a few. Scandinavian suicide rates are nowhere near as high as people seem to think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicsmac Posted 19 May 2013 Author Share Posted 19 May 2013 Finland has one of the highest suicide rates in the developed world, so I guess that's that argument out of the window I was referring to teen/school age suicides. And most Far Eastern countries have more of those than Finland does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MooseBreath Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 Really, because according to the WHO it's 18th, behind Belgium, Croatia, Russia, Japan, South Korea to name a few. Scandinavian suicide rates are nowhere near as high as people seem to think. Yes that qualifies as "one of" in my opinion. I was referring to teen/school age suicides. And most Far Eastern countries have more of those than Finland does. Source? Let's see if we can get some real evidence on the table that suggests these Finnish kids are turning out so much better than the Asian kids. All I see so far is speculation. What is so wrong with rote learning? I did my entire degree through rote and look how I turned out. What is so amazing about all these wonderful practical experiences the Finnish kids are having? I mean it sounds great for teachers, no doubt about that whatsoever, but if it's really so effective and affordable then why isn't the entire world doing it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilo Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 The Philippines, South Korea and Japan all have higher suicide rates than Finland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavrentis Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 The Philippines, South Korea and Japan all have higher suicide rates than Finland. Japan I know is for a multitude of reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theessexfox Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 My friends who went to this said that there was no heckling or jeering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleckneymike Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 Well Mr Gove likes Finland so now we are in a bit of a paradox. I am a teacher and I find it expedient to express the following opinion as soon as anyone finds out I am a teacher "I do **** all, it's easy and I am way overpaid" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Facecloth Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 Yes that qualifies as "one of" in my opinion. I did my entire degree through rote and look how I turned out. Yeah you turned out to be an over opinionated ill informed ****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MooseBreath Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 Yeah you turned out to be an over opinionated ill informed ****. I left that low hanging fruit there to draw out the short man We have a winner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilo Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 Japan I know is for a multitude of reasons. One of which is known to be the ultra competitive nature of society, endorsed and perpetuated by their education system. It's fantastic if you're one of the high flyers but god help you if you struggle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavrentis Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 One of which is known to be the ultra competitive nature of society, endorsed and perpetuated by their education system. It's fantastic if you're one of the high flyers but god help you if you struggle. Well one would argue the education system is not the cause of it but a mere consequence of the mentality of the Japanese which stems back into the samurai times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 But then the high suicide rates in Scandinavian countries is often down to the fact they get no fvcking sunlight during the winter. But for those quoting the stats lets see them, what are the teen suicide rates across the various countries and what is it that makes the Scandinavian teaching model so good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilo Posted 19 May 2013 Share Posted 19 May 2013 Well one would argue the education system is not the cause of it but a mere consequence of the mentality of the Japanese which stems back into the samurai times. A major part of the British mentality used to be militarism and a feeling of ethnic superiority over African nations, education ironed that out. The Japanese education system enforces the ultra competitive element, an element which can be extremely damaging to those who do not achieve the very highest grades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicsmac Posted 2 July 2013 Author Share Posted 2 July 2013 Yeah, I know I'm bumping this, and I know it's the Grauniad - but judging by the results across a variety of fields the Finnish education system is pretty damn good. Even the corporate boys think it's strong, though apparently they don't like the high taxes, which is fair enough. I like the split into 'general' and 'vocational' post-16 (90% of kids do one or the other) and the idea of just one competitive university entry exam too. http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2013/jul/01/education-michael-gove-finland-gcse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charl91 Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 Michael Gove is an idiot, and has no idea what he's talking about. Anyone who knows anything about education can tell you that. He just does things for the sake of making it look like he's doing things. Of course, it's never been a popular position, but least it generally splits opinion. I don't think there has ever before been someone so unanimously hated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon the Hat Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 In the meantime, the NUT showing they dont agree with anyone about anything, again. Clearly a perfectly good idea, and demonstating a failure to understand supply and demand economics. Hopefully she is not an economics teacher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pSinatra Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 In the meantime, the NUT showing they dont agree with anyone about anything, again. Clearly a perfectly good idea, and demonstating a failure to understand supply and demand economics. Hopefully she is not an economics teacher. Why are the unions so against it? I don't know what the advantages or disadvantages are, but their only argument seems to be the cost of 2 weeks in Majorca. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rincewind Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 I thought this was news of him pushing Osbourne off a cliff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilo Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 I personally don't think it's all that bad an idea. It would save the ridiculous situation where identical holidays cost £350 at the start of July and £600 three weeks later by spreading the summer rush over a longer period of time. I've been extremely fortunate in bagging a bargain of a holiday in Turkey, outside the Eurozone of course, but some of the prices were genuinely eye watering. I almost don't blame parents for taking their kids out of school in term time due to costs, especially when the fine for doing so is often less than the premium for taking Little Johnny away in August. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 I personally don't think it's all that bad an idea. It would save the ridiculous situation where identical holidays cost £350 at the start of July and £600 three weeks later by spreading the summer rush over a longer period of time. I've been extremely fortunate in bagging a bargain of a holiday in Turkey, outside the Eurozone of course, but some of the prices were genuinely eye watering. I almost don't blame parents for taking their kids out of school in term time due to costs, especially when the fine for doing so is often less than the premium for taking Little Johnny away in August. Quite right, excellent idea. It's Gove though so it will get absolutely panned by everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon the Hat Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 Quite right, excellent idea. It's Gove though so it will get absolutely panned by everyone. Labour even support it, but not the NUT no! They object to everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rincewind Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 Not read it so can't comment. Is it something to do with school hours and holidays? The schools have stayed the same while the rest of the work force have been more flexible. If it's better for parents then it could be a better Tory policy. But I am not at school, not a teacher or do not have children so am not affected directly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alf Bentley Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 I thought this was news of him pushing Osbourne off a cliff. I personally don't think it's all that bad an idea. Quite right, excellent idea. Labour even support it. With Labour and the full A-list of Foxes Talk talent behind the initiative, the Gove-Osborne murder/suicide pact must happen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charl91 Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 It's not an amazing idea, but it's not particularly offensive. Hardly ground breaking stuff though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox in the North Posted 2 July 2013 Share Posted 2 July 2013 I personally don't think it's all that bad an idea. It would save the ridiculous situation where identical holidays cost £350 at the start of July and £600 three weeks later by spreading the summer rush over a longer period of time. I've been extremely fortunate in bagging a bargain of a holiday in Turkey, outside the Eurozone of course, but some of the prices were genuinely eye watering. I almost don't blame parents for taking their kids out of school in term time due to costs, especially when the fine for doing so is often less than the premium for taking Little Johnny away in August. The pessimist in me just sees the holiday companies making it just as expensive but for longer to cover the gap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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