Hodgson Out?

[Grandad.]

The Liverpool players in England shirts looked like kids thrown onto a motorbike who had only learned how to ride a tricycle as they never needed to learn about the motorbike.

Not really, they were just put into a system that restricted them and had them in a system that wasn't the norm to them.

And Manwell, no manager would choose Joel Campbell over Daniel Sturridge.

[Col city fan]

"Yes, we aren't that good, but no worse than many other nation who have done much better."

I'd like to know what you mean by that.

Either a team (or nation) does better than another or not.

Surely you'll either keep on banging about how good the England team is (and stay deluded), or you accept the fact that, apart from most qualification stages, England have nothing to show for in the past roughly 50 years. Which is an appalling record given the importance and history of football within the country. Whomever's accepting a sudden change of manager after only two years (with no alternative at hand) also accepts continuous failure and heartbreak. The problem lies much deeper and doesn't stop with Hodgson. People ought to be more critical of the celeb culture, mixed with obscene amounts of money and a comparatively bad working ethic, coupled with living in a comfort zone.

Yep.. read above... they are all factors IMO. And you'll also see (if you ever really look) that I've said we are not a very good team. Are you not an England fan MC? You seem critical?

[Guest MattP]

Not really, they were just put into a system that restricted them and had them in a system that wasn't the norm to them.

And Manwell, no manager would choose Joel Campbell over Daniel Sturridge.

Which probably again comes back to a point Glenn Hoddle made quite well about our players not being adaptable enough and not smart enough.

You get the feeling everything has to be so basic for them from the conditions to playing position to manager to team mates for them to not look like they have never played football before. Something other countries manage to do with far more ease, Phillip Lahm has been tossed across every position in the back six apart from goalkeeper already.

[One Legged Beaver]

Yep.. read above... they are all factors IMO. And you'll also see (if you ever really look) that I've said we are not a very good team. Are you not an England fan MC? You seem critical?

He's Swiss.

[Dan LCFC]

And the over-rating of our players & league continues.

Christ. It's all hype. Our clubs have been getting embarrassed for years in Europe and our national team crumbles in tournaments. It doesn't keep happening by co-incidence.

[Col city fan]

Which probably again comes back to a point Glenn Hoddle made quite well about our players not being adaptable enough and not smart enough.

You get the feeling everything has to be so basic for them from the conditions to playing position to manager to team mates for them to not look like they have never played football before. Something other countries manage to do with far more ease, Phillip Lahm has been tossed across every position in the back six apart from goalkeeper already.

Glenn Hoddle! Arry's a much better tactician! Roy out, Redknapp in Matt?

(Mods... I'm joking, I'm joking....)

Phew. ....

[Col city fan]

And the over-rating of our players & league continues.

Christ. It's all hype. Our clubs have been getting embarrassed for years in Europe and our national team crumbles in tournaments. It doesn't keep happening by co-incidence.

Eh? Chelsea..

[Guest MattP]

Glenn Hoddle! Arry's a much better tactician! Roy out, Redknapp in Matt?

(Mods... I'm joking, I'm joking....)

Phew. ....

I would love to see Redknapp get the job just to see in what way, shape or form he would manage to bankrupt the richest footballing body in the World.

[Stadt]

In terms of progress now, winning the World Cup is the worst thing that we've ever done - we stuck with a system that won us one tournament and never evolved like the rest of the world.

[Grandad.]

Which probably again comes back to a point Glenn Hoddle made quite well about our players not being adaptable enough and not smart enough.

You get the feeling everything has to be so basic for them from the conditions to playing position to manager to team mates for them to not look like they have never played football before. Something other countries manage to do with far more ease, Phillip Lahm has been tossed across every position in the back six apart from goalkeeper already.

Lahm has been tossed across the park for his club side too though mate, second nature for him, that is why they are succeeding.

Yeah, I agree with everything you say regarding us. Our players aren't smart enough, this is why I was so critical of my hero Steven Gerrard, he as Captain should have been smart enough and as a leader told Hodgson after the Italy game it wasn't working in that system - not wait for us to be knocked out of the tournament v Uruguay to then change the system v Costa Rica!

For me, you play your best players in the system they are best suited too.

[Grandad.]

Nah Wookie, the rest of the world evolved in football when Sven was our manager and he couldn't see past 4-4-2 and David Beckham.

Any other manager in 2004 would have realised a midfield three of Gerrard, Lampard and Scholes was the way forward then, not playing Beckham at all.

[Guest MattP]

In terms of progress now, winning the World Cup is the worst thing that we've ever done - we stuck with a system that won us one tournament and never evolved like the rest of the world.

I was watching an interesting program the other night about the great Hungarian side of the 50's.

They turned up at Wembley for this, the match dubbed the game of the century. They beat us 6-3 with a new style and formation that we couldn't cope with.#

On 25 November 1953, an international football match was played between Hungary—then the world's number one ranked team, the Olympic champions and on a run of 24 unbeaten games, and England. Hungary won 6–3; England were shown to be technically and tactically inferior to the Hungarian side. The result led to a review of the antiquated training and tactics used by the England team, and the subsequent adoption of continental practices at an international and club level in the English game.

We then had a return match a year later...

Despite realising all that we turned up with the exact same style and formation. Just blind hope. As you can imagine, we got battered again.

England approached the game in the hope that the 6–3 result had been an aberration; instead, Hungary provided a masterclass of football, and thrashed England 7–1.

Even 70 years later we still seem to be relying on blind hope and not learning.

[One Legged Beaver]

Eh? Chelsea..

Chelsea consistently only play two English players, the better of which (Terry) wasn't in the England squad and the other (Cahill) who tends to require Terry's leadership to play to his full potential.

[Guest MattP]

Nah Wookie, the rest of the world evolved in football when Sven was our manager and he couldn't see past 4-4-2 and David Beckham.

Any other manager in 2004 would have realised a midfield three of Gerrard, Lampard and Scholes was the way forward then, not playing Beckham at all.

Spot on.

What a side that could have been with those three and two playing off a front man. But king Beckham had to have his spot, we always intent of falling all our hopes on one player mo matter how poor they continue to be.

[Col city fan]

Chelsea consistently only play two English players, the better of which (Terry) wasn't in the England squad and the other (Cahill) who tends to require Terry's leadership to play to his full potential.

It's still 'one of our clubs'.. .?

[Guest MattP]

To be honest the fact Chelsea have been the best of our clubs just shows again how further we are slipping behind, a team whose whole intention was to throw 11 men behind the ball as soon as they faced any quality really does sum up the state of our league.

[Stadt]

I was watching an interesting program the other night about the great Hungarian side of the 50's.

They turned up at Wembley for this, the match dubbed the game of the century. They beat us 6-3 with a new style and formation that we couldn't cope with.#

We then had a return match a year later...

Despite realising all that we turned up with the exact same style and formation. Just blind hope. As you can imagine, we got battered again.

Even 70 years later we still seem to be relying on blind hope and not learning.

Have you read inverting the pyramid, Matt? It really highlights how inflexible English football is/was.

[Col city fan]

To be honest the fact Chelsea have been the best of our clubs just shows again how further we are slipping behind, a team whose whole intention was to throw 11 men behind the ball as soon as they faced any quality really does sum up the state of our league.

Come on Matt! Teams have been doing this for years. The Italians...nick a goal then 'shut up shop'.. the old Arsenal and their famous 'offside trap'.

Give us a bit of credit... a win is a win. Dont be too down on any success we've had.. we need all we can bloody get!

[Guest MattP]

Have you read inverting the pyramid, Matt? It really highlights how inflexible English football is/was.

I certainly will do.

Come on Matt! Teams have been doing this for years. The Italians...nick a goal then 'shut up shop'.. the old Arsenal and their famous 'offside trap'.

Give us a bit of credit... a win is a win. Dont be too down on any success we've had.. we need all we can bloody get!

Exactly, methods long since tossed in the bin and our most successful curerent club in Europe is still losing them despite having an open chequebook.

[Manwell Pablo]

Not really, they were just put into a system that restricted them and had them in a system that wasn't the norm to them.

And Manwell, no manager would choose Joel Campbell over Daniel Sturridge.

Probably not in club football, at the moment, he's only 22 though and Sturridge was hardly expected to produce the form he had done when he was 22. As I say internationally there a bit more to think about. Quite clear who who had the best tournament. I don't think Sturridge is anywhere near as good as you think he is anyway, depending on who he plays with I'll be surprised if you see him hit 20 goals again this season.

[Grandad.]

Probably not in club football, at the moment, he's only 22 though and Sturridge was hardly expected to produce the form he had done when he was 22. As I say internationally there a bit more to think about. Quite clear who who had the best tournament. I don't think Sturridge is anywhere near as good as you think he is anyway, depending on who he plays with I'll be surprised if you see him hit 20 goals again this season.

I don't have to think anything about Daniel Sturridge mate, 31 goals in 43 games says it all for me in his Liverpool career.

Joel Campbell did only score 1 goal at this tournament, I will just remind you of that little fact as well, the same as Daniel Sturridge.

[Manwell Pablo]

I don't have to think anything about Daniel Sturridge mate, 31 goals in 43 games says it all for me in his Liverpool career.

Joel Campbell did only score 1 goal at this tournament, I will just remind you of that little fact as well, the same as Daniel Sturridge.

He's had a great start, no chance on earth he'll score 31 in his next 43 though.

I know that, your not going to tell me he had a better tournament though as you know it's not true, Sturridge should been in the mix for the golden boot by the end of the Costa Rica game.

[Grandad.]

He's had a great start, no chance on earth he'll score 31 in his next 43 though.

I know that, your not going to tell me he had a better tournament though as you know it's not true, Sturridge should been in the mix for the golden boot by the end of the Costa Rica game.

But right now he has 31 in 43, so he is as good right now as I think he is.

Sturridge should have had a few more goals, but Joel Campbell was hardly electric was he. For crying out loud mate, in 5 games he scored 1 and 1 assist. Don't go boasting about a player having a better tournament compared to an English player with them stats. Costa Rica as a team were fantastic, Joel Campbell worked his bollocks off, that is it as far as he is concerned.

[Manwell Pablo]

But right now he has 31 in 43, so he is as good right now as I think he is.

Sturridge should have had a few more goals, but Joel Campbell was hardly electric was he. For crying out loud mate, in 5 games he scored 1 and 1 assist. Don't go boasting about a player having a better tournament compared to an English player with them stats. Costa Rica as a team were fantastic, Joel Campbell worked his bollocks off, that is it as far as he is concerned.

Nah if he was as good as you think he is you'd be confident of him repeating that feat, which you're clearly not.

I didn't say he was electric, I just said he was better than Sturridge, which he was.

[Guest ttfn]

Spot on.

What a side that could have been with those three and two playing off a front man. But king Beckham had to have his spot, we always intent of falling all our hopes on one player mo matter how poor they continue to be.

Beckham consistently played well for England. Not well enough to have a team built around him, but he was an important player in an England side that reached 3 consecutive quarter finals.

Beckham would have fitted into a 3 himself, and he would certainly have offered a different option to Gerrard and Lampard who are well-acknowledged to be similar players. You'd have good variety with beckham, Scholes and AN Other.