Monk Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 This thread is in desperate need of some George Carlin https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RT6rL2UroE
Babylon Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 It's really not. Have you travelled much in the Muslim world? Insert joke here about Leicester.
Merging Cultures Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Just a quick point to those complaining that religious types offend them. Saying someone's belief is sh!t, or silly, could be as offensive as saying you will burn in Hell if you don't believe. If you don't hold any value in it, then why does it bother you if someone thinks you'll spend eternity in a 'fictitious' place? It really shouldn't bother you at all, and you probbaly should pity the fool. The same for me, because my relationship with God is secure the criticism about Christianity and religion doesn't matter. I know what I have experienced, and the relationship I have, saying it is silly or sh!t, is just a rather poor argument.
Christoph Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 It's really not. Have you travelled much in the Muslim world? Regardless of the fact I know little about Mohammed, its quite clear their similar. Both prophets iwhose mission in life was to spread the word of God and tell people there was only one true God. Ok their not exactly the same...Mohammed sounds like a violent version of Jesus that seemed to kill a lot more people. This is all distracting from the real point i was making which is that people's decision on which religion they choose is based on cultural geography. You Christian because you live in western society / muslim in middle eastern society / Hindu/Sikh in India bla bla bla "My religion is correct because my mum was a muslim and so was her mum before" Believing in God is one thing. But there are so many holes in each religion that how anyone could believe in them I'll never know. Noahs ark? Toads falling from the sky? A bloke coming back to life after being crucified? David vs Golaith (quoted as over 9 foot in the bible... wut). The simple argument is...you just need faith. AKA horse blinkers over your eyes.
Babylon Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Just a quick point to those complaining that religious types offend them. Saying someone's belief is sh!t, or silly, could be as offensive as saying you will burn in Hell if you don't believe. If you don't hold any value in it, then why does it bother you if someone thinks you'll spend eternity in a 'fictitious' place? It really shouldn't bother you at all, and you probbaly should pity the fool. The same for me, because my relationship with God is secure the criticism about Christianity and religion doesn't matter. I know what I have experienced, and the relationship I have, saying it is silly or sh!t, is just a rather poor argument. The only time it offends me is when it wanders into my life and the lives of others without me asking it to. Like someone knocking on my door at 9am on a Saturday morning to hand me a leaflet, someone blowing themselves up in the name of it, or using it as a tool to abuse boys and so on. What you think day to day about it doesn't bother me.
Monk Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Bunch of Jehovah Witnesses trying to hand out leaflets outside Edinburgh Haymarket all day every day. Never ceases to astound me how these regular looking wearing suits folk get drawn into what is essentially a cult. It's just WIERD!
Christoph Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Bunch of Jehovah Witnesses trying to hand out leaflets outside Edinburgh Haymarket all day every day. Never ceases to astound me how these regular looking wearing suits folk get drawn into what is essentially a cult. It's just WIERD! Pfft...who wants to give their children blood transfusions and birthday/christmas presents anyway.
Mark_w Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 The same for me, because my relationship with God is secure the criticism about Christianity and religion doesn't matter. I know what I have experienced, and the relationship I have, saying it is silly or sh!t, is just a rather poor argument. How much credence do you put in the Bible out of interest?
Buce Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Yeah I meant Muhammed...my mistake. Although maybe he isn't the son of God. Same thing though. Prophet comes down and tells people to believe in him. People do because their parents/people around them believe in it. It's a central tenet of their faith that there is no son of God: "there is only one God, and that is Allah, and Mohammed is his Prophet".
Merging Cultures Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 How much credence do you put in the Bible out of interest? I would probably say I am a 'red letter Christian', and that I think that the words attributed to Christ are very meaningful and powerful, and because a lot of the language used is metaphorical and allegorical much can be open to interpretation, either for good or bad.
Rincewind Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 The messages can also be attributed to Secularism which does not require you to pray to a God or promise a reward of eternal life for being a good person. I do not need bribing to do this.
Mark_w Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 The messages can also be attributed to Secularism which does not require you to pray to a God or promise a reward of eternal life for being a good person. I do not need bribing to do this. Whether people (at least the sort of people who are going to join Foxes Talk) are good or not generally has absolutely nothing to do with their faith. Plenty of athiests are absolute c***s, and plenty of religious people are good not because they're being bribed but for the same reasons you consider yourself good. I have no idea what on Earth you're trying to accomplish here?
Merging Cultures Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 The messages can also be attributed to Secularism which does not require you to pray to a God or promise a reward of eternal life for being a good person. I do not need bribing to do this. Indeed, you can be a good person and not religious. Nothing wrong with a little sweetener though!
Monk Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Indeed, you can be a good person and not religious. Nothing wrong with a little sweetener though! So long as your definition of 'good' matches the bible...
The Doctor Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Just a quick point to those complaining that religious types offend them. Saying someone's belief is sh!t, or silly, could be as offensive as saying you will burn in Hell if you don't believe. If you don't hold any value in it, then why does it bother you if someone thinks you'll spend eternity in a 'fictitious' place? It really shouldn't bother you at all, and you probbaly should pity the fool. The same for me, because my relationship with God is secure the criticism about Christianity and religion doesn't matter. I know what I have experienced, and the relationship I have, saying it is silly or sh!t, is just a rather poor argument. Well obviously people thinking that I'm going to burn in hell for all eternity would annoy me, even though hell doesn't exist (and according to the bible is colder than heaven) because what they're saying is essentially that they're better than me and they want to see me be punished for holding a different opinion. If a political party said they'd want to see everyone who voted against them deported, we'd be grossly offended at such an abuse of power, but once a God comes into it, that sort of attitude is fine?
Buce Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Whether people (at least the sort of people who are going to join Foxes Talk) are good or not generally has absolutely nothing to do with their faith. Plenty of athiests are absolute c***s, and plenty of religious people are good not because they're being bribed but for the same reasons you consider yourself good. I have no idea what on Earth you're trying to accomplish here? I think what he's trying to say is that one can live a moral existence, without there being a god involved. For example, I have no religious belief, but the way I try to live my life is not a million miles short of what we think of as 'Christian values'.
Babylon Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 I think what he's trying to say is that one can live a moral existence, without there being a god involved. For example, I have no religious belief, but the way I try to live my life is not a million miles short of what we think of as 'Christian values'. I covet my neighbours wife, what I'd do to her is probably frowned upon in the bible as well.
Buce Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 I covet my neighbours wife, what I'd do to her is probably frowned upon in the bible as well.I'm not about to judge you. Personal morality is just that - personal.
Christoph Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Well obviously people thinking that I'm going to burn in hell for all eternity would annoy me, even though hell doesn't exist (and according to the bible is colder than heaven) because what they're saying is essentially that they're better than me and they want to see me be punished for holding a different opinion. If a political party said they'd want to see everyone who voted against them deported, we'd be grossly offended at such an abuse of power, but once a God comes into it, that sort of attitude is fine? Totally agree with you. Some of 'God's' demands from Christianity/Islam and other religions are just ridiculous. Some videos worth watching -
Merging Cultures Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 So long as your definition of 'good' matches the bible... I am not sure what point you are making, because Rince was talking about being 'good' from a secularist point of view.
Merging Cultures Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Well obviously people thinking that I'm going to burn in hell for all eternity would annoy me, even though hell doesn't exist (and according to the bible is colder than heaven) because what they're saying is essentially that they're better than me and they want to see me be punished for holding a different opinion. If a political party said they'd want to see everyone who voted against them deported, we'd be grossly offended at such an abuse of power, but once a God comes into it, that sort of attitude is fine? But surely they are loons? So, who cares if they think they are better than you? You know they are not, because they don't believe in 'science'. A political party could have everyone departed, but God doesn't exist does he... so what's the problem?!
bovril Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 So long as your definition of 'good' matches the bible... One could see the morality parts of the Bible as merely a document of what is 'good' according to our Judeo-Christian heritage. The Bible didn't invent those morals, it merely put them down on paper. What is 'good' according to other faiths and texts can differ quite dramatically.
1993fox Posted 8 April 2015 Posted 8 April 2015 Good and bad etc are things the world has unfortunately forgotten. Imo law should be based on good/bad i.e. moral/immoral rather than 'legal'/'illegal'. Very strict definitions of law lead to serious injustices. There was a case in Hong Kong where a flight attendant who was sexually assaulted during a flight couldn't press charges since laws relating to sexual assault didn't cover airplanes. She ended up being fired because of the kerfuffle that followed. Is this justice? Unfortunately we are straying too far from good/bad and this has started because of hatred towards anything remotely biblical/religious, which more often than not are solid indicators of decent morality.
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