NotTheMarketLeader Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 It was an instinctive reaction. A little gentler touch on it and it would've been a brilliant finish. If he'd tamed the ball and swung at it, it would have given the defender the chance to recover and the keeper time to adjust. You can't criticise him for trying that flick and under the circumstances, it was a decent effort from a chance that wasn't straight-forward. We've always known he's not a great goalscorer at this level, in that respect his international stats are deceiving. His record isn't great, but then again is Troy Deeney's? He's been lauded and praised and is part of what is widely recognised as the best front pairing in the Prem this season. Yet he has 8 goals, where 5 have come from penalties. He has a couple of assists to his name, so he's got marginally more end product from open play than Shinji. Now I know the two have different roles and play styles, but it just goes to show that you can't just measure Okazaki's contribution through goals alone, just because he's classed as a "striker". After all, Deeney is doing alright despite him lacking the same stat padding. That said, I fully accept and understand that his limitations mean we're not likely to ever see much more than the odd goal every handful of games. Ideally, we should get the same type of player but whose weaknesses aren't as pronounced. Seems like that player wasn't available in January. He didn't miss 4 sitters, come on. Doesn't really matter if he scores home or away, point is he hasn't scored many, which I fully accept. We don't know the circumstances in January if you're referring to Musa. Funny you should talk about context though, because in the context of this game, Vardy was just as guilty if not more so, of missing chances. In the context of this season, Vardy has scored more than we expected and Shinji has scored less (which is also in part due to different roles in the team, no one denies this surely?). Shinji obviously cost 8 times more than Vardy as well (different circumstances, but still). Does that mean Vardy should get some slack and Shinji shouldn't? Come on Jamie is one of the best strikers in the PL on all round play, and he has 19 goals to his name so far - topping the charts. That's why he gets some slack when he doesn't convert every time. Plus he creates a lot of his chances himself, while Shinji misses stuff served up on a silver platter. And I think you will find JV has some assists to his name. Shinji - I like the bloke, to the extent I was in favour of him starting last night when some wanted to put Ulloa in, but we can't avoid the facts that his assists are almost non existent with what.... 2 or three goals all season? That beggars belief for a striker in a top of the table team who are the league's top scorers. At the time I suggested the Club should move heaven and earth to get someone in to take the pressure a little off Mahrez and Vardy in January, but we now have only to hope Oka finds his goal scoring touch.
Countryfox Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 If you can't hit the target from 4 yards, regardless of how awkward (it wasn't that awkward) it is then it's poor. He panicked, nothing else. Deeney has 6 assists. 33 key passes. Shinji has 0. 15 key passes. Deeney wins over 50% of his aerial battles Shinji wins just above half that Do not even try to compare Deeney with Shinji. Vardy scores almost every week and is a big reason we are where we are, that's why he gets slack for missing the odd few, and often is heavily involved in making his own chances. Shinji isn't a massive part of why we are there, has often been carried by the team, misses a lot of guilt edge chances, and doesn't create many either. Hence he doesn't get slack. Comittment, Hard work, harassing is all I ever hear. Did we ever get any less than that from Nugent? I have noticed that several times in the past SO has been in a better position than JV but the ball goes to JV ... nothing wrong with that but it might have a bearing on Shinjis goal scoring. Imo he is important to the team and is a big part of our success.
ImBlue Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Yeah, in the context of the season, this is probably true. By contrast we "should've" been losing a lot of the games we've already played, but no team ever wins all the games they're favourites in. We haven't beaten West Brom at home in over 24 years, so statistically we shouldn't be beating them anyway You can't win them all, and it could be a good point. Not too disheartened, shows how far we've come when they celebrate a point here like they did. They treated us like traditional four, which for our playing style isn't ideal, but it's a respect all the same.
Izzy Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Unfortunately I wasn't at the game last night, what was the reaction like at the final whistle? I loved the roar when we conceded, both times (something I'd missed with our superb home defence form), and I hope the players got a good reception going off the pitch, I'm thinking back to the reception they got after the Spurs home game last year where we did everything but score in the last half an hour and were superb and despite the defeat got a standing ovation going off. Last night was similar in many ways. The commentators on my stream (Jon Champion and Andy Townsend i think) mentioned this when we conceded both times. They pretty much said they couldn't think of another set of supporters who'd do this, and you could tell how impressed they were with the positive reaction. The fans who were there last night and every game are a credit to our club and do us proud week in week out.
Len Finsbury Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 I find it difficult that us, of all people, are criticising a striker that doesn't score considering we had Heskey for so long. Everyone has their jobs to do, yes it'd be nice if they were all perfect at those jobs but you need to pay absolute fortunes for players that tick all the boxes. You want Shinji to score more? You need to sacrifice his cloying down. It all depends on what's more important to the team's set up.
ImBlue Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 I have noticed that several times in the past SO has been in a better position than JV but the ball goes to JV ... nothing wrong with that but it might have a bearing on Shinjis goal scoring. Imo he is important to the team and is a big part of our success. I have noticed this, and it's down to lack of confidence in him from the players. Drinkwater plays the quick incisive football with Mahrez, Vardy, Albrighton, but hardly ever pings it into Shinji, and it's a personal opinion but in not sure he fancies his touch.
Len Finsbury Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 It shows how far we have come. WBA had some very good players in their team but nowadays it doesn't bother me who we play against as we just run them off the park and attack like our tails are on fire. Our defence looks very solid now and we have one of the best midfield pairings in the prem. It was 2 points dropped but not for lack of effort or commitment and that is the big positive that I clung on to keep my spirits up. Can't wait for the next one. Rather than 2 points dropped, I see it more as a point gained by WBA. They wouldn't have harboured any designs on winning at a place where a team hasn't conceded a single goal since the end of WW2 or whatever it was, so their 'best case scenario' would have been an away point. They'd probably settled on 0-0 pre match. They achieved what they set out to do, despite the pressure we put them under. To consider it 2 points dropped is to assume an arrogant stance that we have some right to win every week, and this is reserved purely for those fans of the traditional top four.
Manwell Pablo Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Rather than 2 points dropped, I see it more as a point gained by WBA. They wouldn't have harboured any designs on winning at a place where a team hasn't conceded a single goal since the end of WW2 or whatever it was, so their 'best case scenario' would have been an away point. They'd probably settled on 0-0 pre match. They achieved what they set out to do, despite the pressure we put them under. To consider it 2 points dropped is to assume an arrogant stance that we have some right to win every week, and this is reserved purely for those fans of the traditional top four. Yeah but some of our lot are taking to that like ducks to water and totally forgetting the bigger picture.
Countryfox Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 I have noticed this, and it's down to lack of confidence in him from the players. I think its more to do with the fact that JV is the best striker in the prem ... and thats why they pass to him ... who wouldn't !
ImBlue Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 I think its more to do with the fact that JV is the best striker in the prem ... and thats why they pass to him ... who wouldn't ! That could be it
Countryfox Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 . To consider it 2 points dropped is to assume an arrogant stance that we have some right to win every week, and this is reserved purely for those fans of the traditional top four. Not really Len I think it was 2 points dropped cus we were better than them and had enough chances to put it to bed.
shen Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 If you can't hit the target from 4 yards, regardless of how awkward (it wasn't that awkward) it is then it's poor. He panicked, nothing else. Deeney has 6 assists. 33 key passes. Shinji has 0. 15 key passes. Deeney wins over 50% of his aerial battles Shinji wins just above half that Do not even try to compare Deeney with Shinji. Vardy scores almost every week and is a big reason we are where we are, that's why he gets slack for missing the odd few, and often is heavily involved in making his own chances. Shinji isn't a massive part of why we are there, has often been carried by the team, misses a lot of guilt edge chances, and doesn't create many either. Hence he doesn't get slack. Comittment, Hard work, harassing is all I ever hear. Did we ever get any less than that from Nugent? If I didn't know any better, I'd think you were on some kind of anti-Okazaki crusade. Didn't Vardy hit the post with an even easier chance against Bournemouth? No-one's infallible. I'm not saying Okazaki has been as good as Deeney, I'm saying that stats don't tell the whole story, that's why I made the comparison. Likewise, I could ask you how many goals Vardy scored as support striker last season. Statistically, he wasn't much better off than Shinji is this year, but we both know that circumstances were different and that he was instrumental in our revival. I suppose that's the curse of the "support striker" role. So stop emphasizing these stats so much as if they are the only thing that matters. You say Vardy fashions his own chances, which is true, but he also gets the very best chances served by his teammates. When Shinji is back putting pressure in midfield, Vardy is ready to pounce once possession has turned over (which Shinji does regularly). Shinji will never get those opportunities, and especially not when he plays in the support striker role. Yesterday Shinji actually DID fashion chances on his own, why don't you give him credit for that?
Len Finsbury Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Not really Len I think it was 2 points dropped cus we were better than them and had enough chances to put it to bed. Well it's all about perspective. If our goal was to win the game and their's was to come away with a point, surely they played their game better than we did, no?
Countryfox Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Well it's all about perspective. If our goal was to win the game and their's was to come away with a point, surely they played their game better than we did, no? No. Imo. They played their game and got a point .... but only cus we were unlucky in front of goal ... and that was nothing to do with them. Yes ?
MPH Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 No human keeper I bet this guy could of! ( by blocking the entire net, maybe... ).
Countryfox Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 I bet this guy could of! ( by blocking the entire net, maybe... ). Looks fit for a fat bloke !
shen Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Come on Jamie is one of the best strikers in the PL on all round play, and he has 19 goals to his name so far - topping the charts. That's why he gets some slack when he doesn't convert every time. Plus he creates a lot of his chances himself, while Shinji misses stuff served up on a silver platter. And I think you will find JV has some assists to his name. Shinji - I like the bloke, to the extent I was in favour of him starting last night when some wanted to put Ulloa in, but we can't avoid the facts that his assists are almost non existent with what.... 2 or three goals all season? That beggars belief for a striker in a top of the table team who are the league's top scorers. At the time I suggested the Club should move heaven and earth to get someone in to take the pressure a little off Mahrez and Vardy in January, but we now have only to hope Oka finds his goal scoring touch. Yup, in the context of the season you're absolutely right. In the context of the one game yesterday, it's not. I really don't think anyone should be singled out for criticism after last night's performance, because it was sound all around. It's not fair that people are having a go at Shinji's performance, because people feel he hasn't scored enough over the course of the season, while happily ignoring Vardy's missed chances. It might be futile, but I hoped my defense of Shinji would make people think twice and be more fair and realistic with their criticism.
Len Finsbury Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 No. Imo. They played their game and got a point .... but only cus we were unlucky in front of goal ... and that was nothing to do with them. Yes ? Luck? To hit the woodwork isn't down to bad luck, the shots were simply not on target. Either because of WBA's intervention or because our strikers weren't accurate enough. Bad luck is if a goal bound shot was deflected wide by a passing pigeon or something
Countryfox Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Luck? To hit the woodwork isn't down to bad luck, the shots were simply not on target. Either because of WBA's intervention or because our strikers weren't accurate enough. Bad luck is if a goal bound shot was deflected wide by a passing pigeon or something Didn't you see the pigeon Len ??
M0901 Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Best we played going forward for a while. 2 Poor goals cost us a win Well... did you see Drinkwater's goal...?
Fox Ulike Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Yup, in the context of the season you're absolutely right. In the context of the one game yesterday, it's not. I really don't think anyone should be singled out for criticism after last night's performance, because it was sound all around. It's not fair that people are having a go at Shinji's performance, because people feel he hasn't scored enough over the course of the season, while happily ignoring Vardy's missed chances. It might be futile, but I hoped my defense of Shinji would make people think twice and be more fair and realistic with their criticism. Errr, you do realise this is Foxestalk don't you? It's a good post. . A lot of people just think that Okazaki is a striker therefore he should just score goals. It's the same argument that raged on here for years about Nugent, and I've taken a sacred vow to myself not to get dragged in to it again.
Babylon Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 The only thing that cost us a win was poor finishing and poor final balls. The amount of times we managed to get free in the area just kicked it straight at the keeper at into one of their defenders was criminal.
shen Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Errr, you do realise this is Foxestalk don't you? It's a good post. . A lot of people just think that Okazaki is a striker therefore he should just score goals. It's the same argument that raged on here for years about Nugent, and I've taken a sacred vow to myself not to get dragged in to it again. Good point, but one shouldn't give up on education. Otherwise we'll end up with Trumps all over the world.... can't have that! I get into these lengthy and ultimately tedious debates once in a while and every time I end up thinking it's not worth it, but after a game like last night emotions run high and I get provoked enough to jump in. Please teach me to stop!
Countryfox Posted 2 March 2016 Posted 2 March 2016 Please teach me to stop! Look at my eyes ... my eyes .... not around my eyes ... look at my eyes. STOP. 3 2 1 you're cured !
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