Our defence

[oxford blue]

Ok, it goes without saying this has been poor this season {partly because of the lack of a good defensive midfielder). Also, Huth is not the player of the last 18 months - he loses his player he is marking too easily; we seem weak down the right hand side; Simpson is not the best RB,demonstrated by being run ragged by Anichebe on Saturday. 

However, the main points are these: many of the goals we have conceded have come because opposition players have no-one within yards of them showing a general lack of concentration and awareness. Secondly: we aren't closing down the opposition and - highlighted by Sunderland's second goal - players often have their hands behind their backs which makes it harder to move towards the attacking player and make an effective block. I realise why this is done, but the lack of mobility caused by this is too much of a liability. I think this should stop - defenders should defend naturally even if there is an occasional poor refereeing decision, such as the one against Morgan last season.

[DANGEROUS TIGER]

I cannot come to the defence of our defence.

[Guest the fox]

The sad fact is, our defence is beyond repair. It is not only the age factor. It is the ability factor too. No team should have 2 OLD "old school" CBs starting. And only lower table,championship and league 1 teams can  manage to have only 1 fullback helping the attack. Did people see van aanholt (their LB) yesterday . They looked like they are attacking with 3 left wingers at once. And yeah. Fuchs is old.  Sadly our defence can't be saved. Too old and too old schools.

[Monsell1976]

Morgan was average to poor before last season, and Huth was ok, both a year older, did anyone really expect them to replicate last season, as more so Morgan has never hit them heights before at their ages. 

Without a doubt centre halfs should have been brought in.

[sdb]

It's not beyond repair. The full backs have been ok (bar Simpson yesterday) and we just need to add a player with pace, or go to a 3/5. It is woeful at present though I admit. 

[Buzzell]

Our defence...... is shit.

 

Get Hernandez in at CB. Drop either Huth or Morgan.

[dylanlegend]

35 minutes ago, Monsell1976 said:

Morgan was average to poor before last season, and Huth was ok, both a year older, did anyone really expect them to replicate last season, as more so Morgan has never hit them heights before at their ages. 

Without a doubt centre halfs should have been brought in.

No offence but WTF are you talking about? They were class last year, we won the league by 10 points, solid last year.

 

Centre midfield is the issue

[Monsell1976]

15 minutes ago, dylanlegend said:

No offence but WTF are you talking about? They were class last year, we won the league by 10 points, solid last year.

 

Centre midfield is the issue

No offence, but WTF read my post, BEFORE last season ( BEFORE means not including).

Im going to edit and add more, as I stand by my point, the season before last, people were pretty much in agreement morgan was not good enough, by far.

So take away a one season wonder, should we not have brought and upgraded in that department, if some of these players haven't reached them levels before, or should  we just do what we have done and assume they have now become top premier players, and can deliver that standard every season, again which they have never done before, me personally would have brought 

[themightyfin]

39 minutes ago, Monsell1976 said:

No offence, but WTF read my post, BEFORE last season ( BEFORE means not including).

Im going to edit and add more, as I stand by my point, the season before last, people were pretty much in agreement morgan was not good enough, by far.

So take away a one season wonder, should we not have brought and upgraded in that department, if some of these players haven't reached them levels before, or should  we just do what we have done and assume they have now become top premier players, and can deliver that standard every season, again which they have never done before, me personally would have brought 

What?

[Monsell1976]

1 minute ago, themightyfin said:

What?

The defence should have been improved as morgan is shit, and Huth is past it and to slow, is that better.

oh I forgot they were good last season, so they will be this year.

 

[adam]

It looks like they have aged about 15 years over the summer. Only fuchs looks comfortable on the ball. The other three look petrified when it's at their feet. Surely it's time to give Hernandez a run at centre half. 

[themightyfin]

Just now, Monsell1976 said:

The defence should have been improved as morgan is shit, and Huth is past it and to slow, is that better.

oh I forgot they were good last season, so they will be this year.

 

Hummm...

[themightyfin]

2 minutes ago, Monsell1976 said:

The defence should have been improved as morgan is shit, and Huth is past it and to slow, is that better.

oh I forgot they were good last season, so they will be this year.

 

Do you not think it's more a case of they are not protected by Kante anymore and the reason why they and of lot of players don't seem to want the ball is due to a lack is confidence because of the run we are on?

when we went  in a roll last year it goes without saying it breads confidence and everyone wants the ball but when your in a rut it's the opposite.

I think the lack of confidence running through the whole team is clear to see and that's the reason we are struggling rather than good players becoming shit  players overnight.

with hindsight yes the defence should have been strengthened along with the midfield but how do we know that's CR fault ?

He don't make the signings he just tells them who he wants but he does not negotiate the deals so it's easy to blame him but he may have been just as frustrated in the transfer market certain areas were not improved on as us.

 

[foxes21]

They are getting no protection from the midfield, or strikers. We used to defend from the front, pressing as soon as teams entered our half.

 

That, combined with a lack of rotation is why our defence has been shit.

[Monsell1976]

1 minute ago, themightyfin said:

Do you not think it's more a case of they are not protected by Kante anymore and the reason why they and of lot of players don't seem to want the ball is due to a lack is confidence because of the run we are on?

when we went  in a roll last year it goes without saying it breads confidence and everyone wants the ball but when your in a rut it's the opposite.

I think the lack of confidence running through the whole team is clear to see and that's the reason we are struggling rather than good players becoming shit  players overnight.

with hindsight yes the defence should have been strengthened along with the midfield but how do we know that's CR fault ?

He don't make the signings he just tells them who he wants but he does not negotiate the deals so it's easy to blame him but he may have been just as frustrated in the transfer market certain areas were not improved on as us.

 

Let's make my stance on Claudio clear, I really like the bloke, and want him to succeed, and I don't blame him for the transfer failings, that falls on the scouts and the person who negotiates.

Claudio gets a list of players recommended by the scouts, and he picks which ones he prefers, I don't know how the negotiations went, or wether Claudio actually got his first choices.

Back to the defence, yes they had the luxury of Kante protecting them last season, and in fairness in my opinion made them appear better than they were, if you remember we were leaking goals like no tomorrow before kante was introduced and settled, hence the pizza, also they had the luxury of a team full of confidence.

Going back to my earlier point, the season before morgan was clearly lacking at this level, and was discussed on here, and in my circle of friends, and my feeling was, most thought he wasn't good enough, but when kante and the team settled, they were protected.

Huth, was a real bonus in the great escape when he came in, but he's getting no younger, and it's starting to show, he's slow and not reacting to the movement of the opponents, as prove at the weekend, with the  own goal, being one example.

So my point is, with the supposed 3 year plan , which we exceeded last season, in the progression of the plan, the players like morgan and Huth, and a few others should have been improved on, as I say because of either age, or performance before last season, as they weren't likely to be repeated.

Listen I didn't expect us to be world beaters after last season, but I didn't expect a defence and team to be this embarrassingly poor, I actually expected us to be lower mid table

 

[Monsell1976]

3 minutes ago, foxes21 said:

They are getting no protection from the midfield, or strikers. We used to defend from the front, pressing as soon as teams entered our half.

 

That, combined with a lack of rotation is why our defence has been shit.

I know what your saying, but a lot of goals are down to poor defending, especially at set pieces.

The amount of times the defence are ball watching, and not responding to the opponent movement is shocking.

[Realist Guy In The Room]

I think Huth looks so shit at defending set pieces now because one of his main weapons was physicality against whom he was marking, with the clampdown on holding he cant so much as raise his hand to an opponent.  

 

Last season Huth would have blocked off the guy for the first goal and he wouldn't have got the header in in the first place.

[Guest Col city fan]

I think it's a bit of both isn't it?

With King ambling about and Amartey nor having the faintest clue where to stand, our midfield gives the defence little cover.

But our defence has hardly covered itself in glory either has it? Morgan and Huth especially.

[FireFox]

Hernandez needs to start v Man City.

[Babylon]

8 hours ago, themightyfin said:

Do you not think it's more a case of they are not protected by Kante anymore and the reason why they and of lot of players don't seem to want the ball is due to a lack is confidence because of the run we are on?

when we went  in a roll last year it goes without saying it breads confidence and everyone wants the ball but when your in a rut it's the opposite.

I think the lack of confidence running through the whole team is clear to see and that's the reason we are struggling rather than good players becoming shit  players overnight.

with hindsight yes the defence should have been strengthened along with the midfield but how do we know that's CR fault ?

He don't make the signings he just tells them who he wants but he does not negotiate the deals so it's easy to blame him but he may have been just as frustrated in the transfer market certain areas were not improved on as us.

 

The lack of Kante doesn't explain the total lack of concentration and total lack of being arsed at set pieces. 

 

Once again on sat we go behind to a set piece. We get put on the back foot so many times this season because of our inability to defend them, it's laughable.

[Guest Col city fan]

33 minutes ago, Babylon said:

The lack of Kante doesn't explain the total lack of concentration and total lack of being arsed at set pieces. 

 

Once again on sat we go behind to a set piece. We get put on the back foot so many times this season because of our inability to defend them, it's laughable.

I think you've always tried to play down the loss of Kante. 

Kante is a wonderful box to box midfielder. And was absolutely crucial to both how we played and our success last season. 

That said, I agree. Our defence look shaky all over again. Personally I think having Kante in the side simply inspired confidence. But they are seasoned pros too and should be playing much better than they are doing.

[ZeGuy]

Drop Huth and try Amartey as CB. Can't get any worse.

[shen]

1 minute ago, ZeGuy said:

Drop Huth and try Amartey as CB. Can't get any worse.

Yes, it can actually get worse. Obviously we've previously seen Kisnorbo switch to a central defensive role with great success after having looked like a fish out of water in midfield, but I'd rather stick Hernandez in there. I believe sorting out the midfield problem will by proxy ameliorate the defense problem too. Just like when were shipping goals in our first season back and changed formation, it all changed. Or last season when we were pressing so high and shipping goals to dropping deep and looking rock solid.

[sylofox]

42 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

I think it's a bit of both isn't it?

With King ambling about and Amartey nor having the faintest clue where to stand, our midfield gives the defence little cover.

But our defence has hardly covered itself in glory either has it? Morgan and Huth especially.

personally Morgan and Huth are the weak links this season. Morgan especially for set pieces has looked lost and lost his man so many times. How can the midfield be at fault for those goals 3 at OT.

 

But wi so many playing poorly what chance do we have. Out field players I would play atm are Fuchs,Simpson,Drinky and Okazaki. (yes I know Simpson lacks going forward) Add to that Gray as a starter the rest really need to wake up or be dropped. Even if it means playing kids.

 

The other option is CR needs to find a system they will perform in. Then he needs to sort out attitudes if rumours are true. If we take it they are and Vardy and Mahrez have a problem put them both with the u23's.

[lgfualol]

10 hours ago, the fox said:

The sad fact is, our defence is beyond repair. It is not only the age factor. It is the ability factor too. No team should have 2 OLD "old school" CBs starting. And only lower table,championship and league 1 teams can  manage to have only 1 fullback helping the attack. Did people see van aanholt (their LB) yesterday . They looked like they are attacking with 3 left wingers at once. And yeah. Fuchs is old.  Sadly our defence can't be saved. Too old and too old schools.

This is what I'm thinking. I loved  the fact that we played two old-school defenders last season, but they've both been poor and since they can't grab their opponents, they look useless. It's surprising to me that teams haven't been playing the long ball against us more often, last season's Vardy would have a field day with our defence. Also their distribution, oh my god... every time I see Huth look up to play a long ball I die a little inside. On Saturday he just smashed it straight to one of their players. 

 

I doubt Morgan will be dropped as he is still the captain, but Morgan never plays well without Huth. Tricky situation. I say we replace both. Hernandez must start.