How many games do you require to judge a player or new signing?

[fuchsntf]

2 hours ago, Sharpe's Fox said:

If I see one bad touch or misplaced pass when I'm in a bad mood I'll hate that player till he fvcks off.

Yeh..but you yourself are just beginning, and make the odd bad post...but we dont want to sell ya

 

 

You went on to be  further mentioned in dispatches, but still lost ya head..(G.O.T)

[Dan]

I think you can make a fair assumption after about 5-10 to be honest. Obvious exceptions but by and large I think if you guess after that many games, you won't be far off.

[Dan]

2 hours ago, ZeGuy said:

To me, 10-15 games would be about right to see if the guy has potential and just needs to adjust or is just a flop.

 

I needed two games to see that Ndidi was the real deal. 

 

10-12 to completely write off Musa (although I never was impressed from the very beginning).

 

Slim is a good striker. Played to his strength he'd bag at least 15 in a season. You don't need 20 games to see it and anyone saying otherwise is either biased or knows jack about football. Don't care about the transfer fee, he didn't set it himself. But I doubt he'll ever find his place in this team.

 

Mendy is a hard one. He didn't particularly attract my attention every time he played and I found him average at best, mediocre at wort like against Millwall. That said, the injuries might play a huge role and I didn't see him in a team performing. So he's on stand by. Question is will he ever play again with a blue shirt?

This is a point too. Certain players you just know are great. Mahrez I said within about 3 games was going to be class. You could see it.

 

I'm not saying I'll write a player off after 10 games but you can tell by that point which way it's going I think.

[Dan]

2 hours ago, Foxxed said:

Our best striker took more than a season. It took us a season and a half to appreciate Shinji - and he managed to help us win the Premier League in that time!

Even in his first season, for all he lacked quality on the ball, he had some qualities about him. He's quite a one-off though.

[Yes N'Didi]

The most important thing I look for when judging a player is attitude. Start with the right attitude, then the fans will give you a certain credit or grace until such time as your adaption to the game (if from a different league) or ability comes through.

 

Leo's not always been our most technically gifted player, and he came through as our most expensive signing, but it's been clear since day one that his heart was in the right place and he was passionate for this club. Amartey has shown that since day one as well.

[fuchsntf]

3 hours ago, STUHILL said:

There are a lot of factors for me, including if they are coming from abroad, their age and also in Mendy's case, any injury issues but generally after about 15 games, I expect to see some real signs of their ability and whether they are able to have a positive impact in the league. 

 

Mendy still has some way to go before I can judge him as well as Slimani, although I can see why any are quicker to judge Slimani, due to his transfer fee. I've seen more of Musa and although many of these have only been from the bench, I think we can all agree that he has pace in abundance, but not much else so far. 

We dont mix and find those players, like the real big boys around Europe.Those clubs expect their newbies to be up and running

in 5-7 games, or invest knowing they can park for 1-3 seasons.

In the old days, one would expect ca 5-8 games, turn around, but those days were local or UK lads.

Then came the new foreigners, they were given time and breaks to bed in.

Since the PL, great foreigners costing over the odds, were still given at least a season, if not Jelling Immediately.

Now with Leicester we have a Dozen mitigating circumstances, Super greats still would not come to us.

 

A manager who still wanted to change an ethos that won the title.Setting up a new mental rebuild

You have investment Newbies like Amartey, Gray, even Lawrence.

Then slimani, Musa, Mendy then Ndidi, you still cant compare..Each individual.

They didnt come, as we now know to a settled Champions set up.

 

Its too early for our new group

Ndidi could wane, Mendy and Musa are young enough to be given  another full season.

Slimani who one might put more expectations Upon, yet again he came into a confused

enviroment, where it wasnt meshing like one would expect at a champions club, ffs our own

heroes were misfiring and shooting more to the abysmal than further hero worship.

Sporting wise if I was Slimani, I would feel a bit let down.He Would of been   expecting to

be playing with the Dynamicity of Forward play from the previous season, not the dire trash

he suddenly found himself with....

 

No my friends this New group of players, in my view dont deserve to be judged or analysed over

This seasons outrageous displays from the rooted title winners. I cant see how any fan would expect

New players to change the dynamic of The  PL title winners (not 1-3 championship leagues), they should slot

normally into an already well Oiled organised Squad...That I suppose was the dilema, sand was being thrown

Unwittingly not on purpose or with malice, into the gears.

Backroom staff and whole platform changed and reorganised, plus an Italian wanting his Mongrels to suddenly

start to hold the ball, make close not quick passes.

I dont know Which players will move or stay , but I wont criticise new lads from within, nor the new buys, on this season.

They have cart blanche imo until xmas next season, January business should sort it out, not forgetting other issues will

also see this area take their natural course.

Dont take me wrong I still see it fitting that some posters open up the gates, to the individual players seen performances.

The difference is I dont go OTT  on short, great or poor displays.

I still would love to see Vardy/Slimani/Mahrez  play together now The team has re -  found Itself.

[Kitchandro]

Judging is something people naturally do straight away. They may keep it to themselves, but there's always a first impression and once that happens, you need something to change your mind.

 

You can't know everything about a player within 90 minutes, but if a player is really good or really shit it's usually obvious pretty early on. You can tell by the basics. How long it takes them to get the ball under control is a big one, and how comfortable they are with it, especially under pressure.

 

It's harder with defenders because you can be a shit footballer like Huth and still be of worth. When you're judging an attacking player at this level though, you have to be able to make an impact, and quickly. That doesn't mean you have to be perfect, but if you don't show some potential early on, why should a club persist with you? There's too much riding on it and our club, for example, can afford to go out and buy a better player.

 

I'm all for giving players a chance when they've got something about them, but we've signed several in the last 18 months where I could not make a serious argument in defence of the person who scouted them. I wonder what they could possibly have seen in such players.

 

 

[StriderHiryu]

I'd usually say 10-20 games over a sustained period would do it, especially in the premier league. However, more than perhaps any other team, LCFC have seen insane turnarounds. 

 

Vardy - we all thought he was crap in both the championship and premier league. His start in the Man U 5-3 game made me see potential but who could ever imagine him turning into the beast he has become? Literally defies belief. 

 

Mahrez - always looked classy, but PFA player of the year?! You're having a laugh! (Apparently we were!)

 

Drinkwater - couldn't get into the team during  the great escape but was arguably the 2nd best CM in the league last year after Kante. But that said he was way too good for the championship.  

 

Morgan - looked like a car crash in slow motion when we first got promoted and early this season. Lifted the bloomin PL trophy!

 

There's plenty more like that too!

 

You can only hope that some of the other signings also turn it around as they seem like nice lads, but the signs don't look good. 

[TheUltimateWinner]

I've been wrong about so many players this season and in the past.

 

After Vardy gave away that penalty against Middlesbrough I think it was in his first season I said I never want to see him in a Leicester shirt again.

 

Every players different, some hit the ground running, some take around a season to bed in. I don't think you can give a full judgment until a full season has passed, however, some players you can say certainly show promise and talent within their first few games - Ndidi, Mahrez etc... But they can also fizzle out ie. Wood... So yeah, full season is needed IMO.

 

[SkidsFox]

4 hours ago, Detroit Blues said:

All you have to do is look at the old posts to see how people thought of our players when times we're tough. Various positions I've seen held by people:

 

Schmeichel will never be good enough, we should be starting Hamer.

Kramaric is class, he's the future. Start him over Vardy / Ulloa / Nugent, etc.

Simpson isn't very good, no reason to hold onto him while he's going through legal troubles.

Morgan should be dropped, and his captaincy given to Cambiasso, Schmeichel, etc.

 

 

 

 

Get your point, but it does seem a different issue with goalkeepers. They often need a few seasons to mature and reach their peak. They also tend to have longer careers (not always though).

[fuchsntf]

1 hour ago, Kitchandro said:

Judging is something people naturally do straight away. They may keep it to themselves, but there's always a first impression and once that happens, you need something to change your mind.

 

You can't know everything about a player within 90 minutes, but if a player is really good or really shit it's usually obvious pretty early on. You can tell by the basics. How long it takes them to get the ball under control is a big one, and how comfortable they are with it, especially under pressure.

 

It's harder with defenders because you can be a shit footballer like Huth and still be of worth. When you're judging an attacking player at this level though, you have to be able to make an impact, and quickly. That doesn't mean you have to be perfect, but if you don't show some potential early on, why should a club persist with you? There's too much riding on it and our club, for example, can afford to go out and buy a better player.

 

I'm all for giving players a chance when they've got something about them, but we've signed several in the last 18 months where I could not make a serious argument in defence of the person who scouted them. I wonder what they could possibly have seen in such players.

 

 

Yehhhh  just like Drinkwater, who on his first PL season, and again this season in the darkdays.Coukdnt control a ball to save his life,

Couldnt put 2 simple passes together....

Oh another thing if Huth is shit, that makes all of us worse than an aftermath of diarrhea...

I bet you Wish you  could play has shit as he does..Come on Kitch your better than this post...

[Trav Le Bleu]

8 hours ago, StanSP said:

none.

give me YouTube videos all day long.

First or second tweet for me.

[Guest Col city fan]

4 hours ago, Dan LCFC said:

Even in his first season, for all he lacked quality on the ball, he had some qualities about him. He's quite a one-off though.

Vardy has improved dramatically. He always had pace and a finish but in his first season for us, his first touch was awful. Time over the ball would bounce off his foot and he'd lose control. That's been the biggest improvement in his game by far. And credit to Vardy and to City for the development of what was a very raw talent.

[Tuna]

2-3 matches.

 

We could all see Inler wasn't up to it fairly early on.

[fuchsntf]

5 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

Vardy has improved dramatically. He always had pace and a finish but in his first season for us, his first touch was awful. Time over the ball would bounce off his foot and he'd lose control. That's been the biggest improvement in his game by far. And credit to Vardy and to City for the development of what was a very raw talent.

So lets give Musa and club that time to develope that raw talent...

[Guest Col city fan]

7 minutes ago, fuchsntf said:

So lets give Musa and club that time to develope that raw talent...

How many more times mate. Seriously, read the forum cos there's so many points just go round and round in circles.

There is no comparison to be made between Vardy and Musa.

Vardy came to us from Fleetwood Town. Musa joined us from a team for which he'd played Champions League Football. Musa shouldn't need time 'to develop'. He's either taking an awfully long time to adjust to the Prem (possible) OR he's actually just not very good. Ndidi is 20 years old and is taking to the Prem like a fish to water. He's also very very good.

[Guest Col city fan]

8 minutes ago, Tuna said:

2-3 matches.

 

We could all see Inler wasn't up to it fairly early on.

No WE couldn't. There were some crying out for his inclusion week in week out. 

Inler was very poor for City and a complete waste of money.

[foxes21]

Its easy to reference Vardy because he took a year to settle. But he must have worked his socks off on the training pitch to become the player he is today. Does someone like Musa for example, have that type of mind set & the desire to improve like Vardy did? Probably not.

[STUHILL]

6 minutes ago, foxes21 said:

Its easy to reference Vardy because he took a year to settle. But he must have worked his socks off on the training pitch to become the player he is today. Does someone like Musa for example, have that type of mind set & the desire to improve like Vardy did? Probably not.

How can you possibly know if he has that type of mindset or not? He may be the hardest worker in training and the first to arrive and last to leave for all we know. 

 

I do actually think out of all the signings, he is the least likely to make it here from what I've seen, but to now be making judgements on his mind set and desire, is stretching! 

[fuchsntf]

13 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

How many more times mate. Seriously, read the forum cos there's so many points just go round and round in circles.

There is no comparison to be made between Vardy and Musa.

Vardy came to us from Fleetwood Town. Musa joined us from a team for which he'd played Champions League Football. Musa shouldn't need time 'to develop'. He's either taking an awfully long time to adjust to the Prem (possible) OR he's actually just not very good. Ndidi is 20 years old and is taking to the Prem like a fish to water. He's also very very good.

His experience and what the front cover says doesnt mean there is a must that he has to be the end product...

Developement is relative. Different players shine bright then wither, others flicker and stay on low burn longer,

then Repay the investment profi football at all levels show this, Keane, Kane, de gea etc.

Ndidi, I hope his star, like Kantes keeps on Shiningi bright, but they are still only potential superstars, one poor season

then knee-jerkers have a party.

Musa hit the Ground running, then nose dived, but then so did the whole team..

Lets be fair in argument and discussion, many English football fans know they might have to give their new

Foreign buys a season, no matter what they cost..A player goes to Chelsea or Barca, has WClass players in every 

Position around him, their bad  days are covered, but rightly more is expected. We dont play at that High consistent level.

Plus even Chelsea last season didnt play has abysmal and turgid  as we have this season. 

The newbuy total game awareness in this atmosphere displaying their potential imo, would be nion impossible.

Even basics go awry...Drinkwater, Fuchs, Morgan etc Previous and recent  examples.

Messi himself would have imploded in our team this season...

[mozartfox]

None. I have complete trust in Rudders. If he thinks they are good enough, then that is good enough for me. Gerrimin. 

[Bob Weasel Fox]

7 hours ago, Alf Bentley said:

I've gone 20-38 as something of an average, but it varies to a ridiculous extent.

 

After a whole season, it looked 50-50 whether Vardy was good enough for the top half of the Championship.

After several seasons, Schmeichel was probably lower Premier standard...now he's arguably one of the best keepers in the PL

Yet I'd have been confident about N'Didi becoming a top player after about 3 games....maybe 5 for Kante.

 

Too soon to tell for Mendy. I'd be confident that Slimani will be OK at this level, but possibly no better than OK, at least with our team formation/tactics (he has good finishing/heading/physicality/anticipation, but lacks pace & creativity).

Sadly, I'd be fairly sure that Musa won't make the grade here, just because his confidence must be shot. But he might be one of those who goes on to do well elsewhere....or maybe here next season? Not confident about that....

 

 

Spot on post Alf

[Wizerud]

Sounds like a cop-out answer but all of the above! You form an opinion after game #1 but that opinion is fluid. It's always changing. My opinion changes about a player going from game 245 to 246 but by that time you have a foundation of history to view it through. By then the differences in opinion from one game to the next should be minor. I'd guess for the majority of players half a season is enough to provide you with what should be a 90%+ accurate opinion.

[Dan]

Vardy was better in his first year than Musa has been, and Vardy at least had the excuse of having never kicked a professional ball. Musa's played in the World Cup and the Champions League. I get it's a step up too, but he's ****ed up some of the absolute basics. He wouldn't look out of place playing for someone like Walsall.

[Detroit Blues]

Let me play devil's advocate: He was brought into the club when we thought we we're losing Vardy to Arsenal. We wanted a pacey CF that could run the channels and put defenders under pressure. Vardy ended up staying, so we ended up with a bit of redundancy built into the squad.

 

At CSKA Moscow, he made 99 appearances as a center forward, 54 appearances as a winger, and 4 appearances as a #10. We've started him exactly 3 games in the premier league at his primary position. The only consistent starting time we gave him was a run of 4 matches (as a winger) in October, and he scored 2 goals in that span.

 

He's started only 6 games in the premier league, mostly out of position, in a time where the whole team was massively struggling, yet we know Ahmed Musa is terrible and will never be any use to the squad... okay, sure