General Election, June 8th

[ramboacdc]

14 minutes ago, LiberalFox said:

 

Is this stuff publicly viewable?

it was on his facebook. now he's deleted me i can't see it but still if you are putting your personal profile pic as lib dem stuff you cant post stuff like that. 

[Foxxed]

The erstwhile solid blue Economist has come out in support of the Lib Dems.

 

It's unsurprising. May's economic policy is the abandon the 71 billion the financial sector pumps into the treasury.

 

And they've always been pro engagement with the world, and so far our foreign policy has involved leaving trading blocks and political isolation.

[Guest MattP]

11 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

I don't remember noticing the audience reaction at that point, but do remember her comment - quite an idealistic point, but well expressed ("I've enjoyed our freedom to travel, work, study and love in 27 countries" or something). It wouldn't surprise me if some people applauded who wanted immigration controls, but liked the sound of freedom for themselves, or who just enjoyed an idealistic point poetically expressed. It's easy to forget that some of the audience were probably non-committed but just excited to be at a big event.

 

Re. the allegations about audience bias: people making that point should demand to analyse Com Res' audience selection procedures and criticise anything untoward they find....otherwise they risk sounding like Wenger being interviewed after Arsenal have lost ("the ref made bad decisions against us, the other team was constantly fouling" etc.).

 

Anyway, I don't think many will have been swayed in any direction by that. Apparently Lynton Crosby has been put in sole charge of the Tory campaign now, so Corbyn better get his tin helmet on and prepare for a shitstorm of abuse! 

I wish we could find out how Comres did it, I hope the Toriy party does try to find out after the election and see if they can expose anything more sinister. (It's even weirder given ComRes are still producing huge leads for the Conservatives in their polls)

 

I don't think this is comparable to Wenger, usually it is as it's only us on the right complaining about it, this is very different as for the first time yesterday we had numerous left-wing journalists also stating a belief that the audience was biased and unable to fathom how it has come to this - http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/bbc-election-debate-left-wing-bias-jeremy-corbyn-labour-audience-theresa-may-conservatives-a7766311.html

 

I just think it's such a shame, the BBC got the balance spot on the EU referendum, all done now anyway and I certainly won't be tuning into their debate next time.

[Foxxed]

8 minutes ago, Foxxed said:

The erstwhile solid blue Economist has come out in support of the Lib Dems.

 

It's unsurprising. May's economic policy is the abandon the 71 billion the financial sector pumps into the treasury.

 

And they've always been pro engagement with the world, and so far our foreign policy has involved leaving trading blocks and political isolation.

I suspect their knife in the Tory back can be summed up with this tweet:

 

 

 

 

[Realist Guy In The Room]

1 minute ago, MattP said:

I wish we could find out how Comres did it, I hope the Toriy party does try to find out after the election and see if they can expose anything more sinister. (It's even weirder given ComRes are still producing huge leads for the Conservatives in their polls)

 

I don't think this is comparable to Wenger, usually it is as it's only us on the right complaining about it, this is very different as for the first time yesterday we had numerous left-wing journalists also stating a belief that the audience was biased and unable to fathom how it has come to this - http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/bbc-election-debate-left-wing-bias-jeremy-corbyn-labour-audience-theresa-may-conservatives-a7766311.html

 

I just think it's such a shame, the BBC got the balance spot on the EU referendum, all done now anyway and I certainly won't be tuning into their debate next time.

They're probably amazed that its swumg from Corbyn and his cronies potentially being wiped out to them actually having a chance in the space of 6 weeks.

 

I cant believe it so why should they?  Why should you?  It must be a conspiracy eh?

[Alf Bentley]

2 minutes ago, MattP said:

I wish we could find out how Comres did it, I hope the Toriy party does try to find out after the election and see if they can expose anything more sinister. (It's even weirder given ComRes are still producing huge leads for the Conservatives in their polls)

 

I don't think this is comparable to Wenger, usually it is as it's only us on the right complaining about it, this is very different as for the first time yesterday we had numerous left-wing journalists also stating a belief that the audience was biased and unable to fathom how it has come to this - http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/bbc-election-debate-left-wing-bias-jeremy-corbyn-labour-audience-theresa-may-conservatives-a7766311.html

 

I just think it's such a shame, the BBC got the balance spot on the EU referendum, all done now anyway and I certainly won't be tuning into their debate next time.

 

I'd imagine that it would be easy enough to find out how Com Res selected the audience. They presumably had to report to the BBC as to how they had done it. 

If some people have doubts and the BBC and Com Res are having their impartiality challenged, it would surely be easy and in everyone's interests for the data/methods to be made available?

 

I suspect it was just one "set of fans" making a lot more noise than the other, despite being there in equal numbers - something we've all experienced at football matches.

 

Anyway, unless there is a smoking gun, it's a matter of no interest to 99.9% of voters, the election will move on with most people just experiencing it as the odd item on the TV News or Internet, or maybe a brief chat with friends or colleagues.

[Guest MattP]

14 minutes ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

They're probably amazed that its swumg from Corbyn and his cronies potentially being wiped out to them actually having a chance in the space of 6 weeks.

 

I cant believe it so why should they?  Why should you?  It must be a conspiracy eh?

But Comres still gives Corbyn no chance. 

[ramboacdc]

1 hour ago, Innovindil said:

Foxestalk has become infected with lib dems adverts!

 

 

adblocker is your friend. 

then set up a donation to the forum every month. @Mark will thank you. 

[LiberalFox]

I don't think it's bias at all. From my experience lefties are much more likely to be the sort of people to cheer their side and boo the opposition at a debate. You could add another 1000 members of the blue rinse brigade to the audience and it still wouldn't stop the crowd sounding left wing.

[Guest MattP]

Comres guy on the Daily Politics to defend the audience selection, basically saying what @Alf Bentley put forward - left wingers more likely to scream and whoop than those on the right.

 

It does work out, certainly if you think back to the Labour manifesto launch when anyone who dared to ask Corbyn a tough question got booed.

[Alf Bentley]

1 minute ago, MattP said:

Comres guy on the Daily Politics to defend the audience selection, basically saying what @Alf Bentley put forward - left wingers more likely to scream and whoop than those on the right.

 

It does work out, certainly if you think back to the Labour manifesto launch when anyone who dared to ask Corbyn a tough question got booed.

 

Did you see the TV News footage of Corbyn arriving at the studio in Cambridge? There was a massive crowd, cheering him as if he were Madonna or George Clooney.

 

I doubt that many of them were in the audience - it wasn't Corbyn who was getting cheered during the event, so much as pro-liberal, anti-Tory sentiments, mainly from the minor parties.

If that was the mood around the event, I can imagine it encouraging those of a liberal/left persuasion.

 

You'll have to get down there and do some whooping for the Tories next time, Matt. 

[Jon the Hat]

This is exactly why Theresa didn't join the debate.  If you give equal billing to 7 parties when only two have the huge majority of the vote, then you just get the incumbent - who actually has a track record to aim at - being shot down, while the others get to talk freely about their theories and plans without any risk of looking bad.  Stupid idea.  One on one yes, the format Sky / C4 did the other day also fine, this, waste of time.

[EnderbyFox]

 

[Guest MattP]

5 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

Did you see the TV News footage of Corbyn arriving at the studio in Cambridge? There was a massive crowd, cheering him as if he were Madonna or George Clooney.

 

I doubt that many of them were in the audience - it wasn't Corbyn who was getting cheered during the event, so much as pro-liberal, anti-Tory sentiments, mainly from the minor parties.

If that was the mood around the event, I can imagine it encouraging those of a liberal/left persuasion.

 

You'll have to get down there and do some whooping for the Tories next time, Matt. 

If you ever see me whooping for a politician you have permission to shoot me!

[ramboacdc]

5 minutes ago, EnderbyFox said:

 

isn't that just 1 constituency? 

[Sharpe's Fox]

8 minutes ago, EnderbyFox said:

 

 

Changes from last GE for reference.

[Alf Bentley]

4 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

This is exactly why Theresa didn't join the debate.  If you give equal billing to 7 parties when only two have the huge majority of the vote, then you just get the incumbent - who actually has a track record to aim at - being shot down, while the others get to talk freely about their theories and plans without any risk of looking bad.  Stupid idea.  One on one yes, the format Sky / C4 did the other day also fine, this, waste of time.

 

True to an extent as regards the nature of the debate. The others mainly attacked Rudd, and Corbyn to a slightly lesser extent. There was the odd predictable attack on Nuttall for mentioning Islamism and on Farron re. the Lib Dems in the Coalition, but the Plaid, SNP & Green representatives got away with it a bit. Though the presenter did try to challenge them the odd time - should probably have done it more, to balance the attacks on Rudd & Corbyn. Either that or have separate debates in Wales and Scotland, involving SNP and Plaid and leave them out of the UK-wide debate.

[Nick]

Some weird tactics from May, after all if you are too busy running the country and sorting Brexit to attend the debate then err why call a snap election? 

 

Its all a bit poor and disingenuous. 

 

I can see peoples points regarding the audience - though whilst I smiled at the idea that conservatives have so many plums in their mouths and their Britishness prevents them from doing anything more than applauding in smatters  I do think that the left have a bit of a movement going on (albeit @MattP a cult of morons as you describe in recent pages...) and that the policies being promoted by the latter involve issues that people care about and have anger and passion toward... Comparatively there is absolutely nothing sexy whatsoever about Tory policy - their slogan may as well be 'vote more of the same' - there's no real incitement to change anything - just a generic monotony and perhaps it's that that didn't get the audiences juices flowing?

[The Horse's Mouth]

**** these polls making me optimistic

[Foxxed]

I bet the Financial Times doesn't support the Tories either.

 

The Economist and Financial Times are, for the most part, great publications but I doubt they will sway it much.

[Guest]

Just now, Foxxed said:

I bet the Financial Times doesn't support the Tories either.

 

The Economist and Financial Times are, for the most part, great publications but I doubt they will sway it much.

The ft has come out for the tories.

[Foxxed]

1 minute ago, toddybad said:

The ft has come out for the tories.

Eh, fair enough. Not had any notifications from them in a while.

[AKCJ]

Corbyn played a blinder yesterday.

[Alf Bentley]

3 minutes ago, The Horse's Mouth said:

**** these polls making me optimistic

 

I'm not getting optimistic until I see a run of similar polls from the North and Midlands.

I reckon it's quite likely that Labour could take a few seats in London and the South, yet lose a stack more in the North and Midlands, giving the Tories an increased majority (50-100?), particularly if they pick up a few from the SNP.

 

If the result is at the lower end of that (50 majority or less), the main winners could be the Tory Right as May might be more vulnerable to pressure to take a hard line over Brexit.

It would probably also be enough to consolidate Corbyn's power over the Labour Party.....not sure that's a good thing in the long run.

[Foxxed]

I was reading about the young vote earlier - how it will probably not help Labour that much.

 

Young voters are university are already in Lib Dem or Labour seats if they've registered to vote in their new home.

 

And when they go to work in cities they're already in Labour seats again.

 

It'll only work with young voters not at university who are in rural constituencies.

 

The young vote will do nothing apart from protect existing Labour seats I suspect - even if they do come out and vote.