The OH Leuven Thread

[Lizhang]

49 minutes ago, lcfceaves said:

I noticed there was no Moore and Kaputska... was it our players messing everything up all along 

Like i said earlier. Moore was suspended, Kapustka was benched due to bad form (he was great in october-november, but the last few weeks he was rather dire), and Hirst, well (technically not a LCFC player) he didn't even make the bench (like i always said he wouldn't be near the bench with any other manager than pearson).

[UniFox21]

After watching the highlights, your number 22 looks to be a good player, great cross for the first and some good trickery for the second

[Lizhang]

Apparently, Pearson was about to get sacked when Vichai perished.

 

1 hour ago, UniFox21 said:

After watching the highlights, your number 22 looks to be a good player, great cross for the first and some good trickery for the second

He's an offensive winger, who now played as a fullback in a 5 men defense for the first time. His first half wasn't good (didn't know when he was allowed to move forward) but the second half was by far the best he's played for us.

[UniFox21]

48 minutes ago, Lizhang said:

He's an offensive winger, who now played as a fullback in a 5 men defense for the first time. His first half wasn't good (didn't know when he was allowed to move forward) but the second half was by far the best he's played for us.

So like a wing-back? The highlights make him seem a decent player, just hopefully he learns the position and his roles better!

[Lizhang]

21 minutes ago, UniFox21 said:

So like a wing-back? The highlights make him seem a decent player, just hopefully he learns the position and his roles better!

Yes, yesterday he played as a wingback, but normally he's a wing/forward.

[TMELcfc]

3 hours ago, Lizhang said:

Like i said earlier. Moore was suspended, Kapustka was benched due to bad form (he was great in october-november, but the last few weeks he was rather dire), and Hirst, well (technically not a LCFC player) he didn't even make the bench (like i always said he wouldn't be near the bench with any other manager than pearson).

Shocked that we spent a lot of time chasing/paying compensation on someone who isn’t actually any good? I’m sure the Sheff We’d fans were gutted to see him leave...

[Lizhang]

53 minutes ago, lcfceaves said:

Shocked that we spent a lot of time chasing/paying compensation on someone who isn’t actually any good? I’m sure the Sheff We’d fans were gutted to see him leave...

Hirst is physically a big kid. I'm sure the Seffield Wednesday supporters that saw him in the youth ranks, saw a kid that could bully defenders on physicallity and lenght alone. Unfortunatly, that's all he has working for him. And when he faces experienced defenders, that are just as tall as him, and likely stronger, then what is left? Killer instinct? Nope. Speed? Nope. Technique? Hahahaha (yes, i'm actually laughing while typing)... nope. He's in constant struggle with his own feet, gets powered off the ball, needs too much time and space, doesn't win any 1 on 1 situation.

 

He turned 20 earlier this week. If this is supposed to be the next Premier League star, then he has a long long way ahead of him. I honestly don't ever see him outgrow a Dutch/Belgian lower tier 1st division team level. Unless, daddy can pull some strings, like he did at Leuven. Get him in the team at the expense of the team, the manager and other (far better) strikers. I could be wrong, he's still young, but i haven't seen any performance of him, in 20 games, that indicates this kid is ever going to make it big time.

Edited 17 February 2019 by Lizhang

[TMELcfc]

1 hour ago, Lizhang said:

Hirst is physically a big kid. I'm sure the Seffield Wednesday supporters that saw him in the youth ranks, saw a kid that could bully defenders on physicallity and lenght alone. Unfortunatly, that's all he has working for him. And when he faces experienced defenders, that are just as tall as him, and likely stronger, then what is left? Killer instinct? Nope. Speed? Nope. Technique? Hahahaha (yes, i'm actually laughing while typing)... nope. He's in constant struggle with his own feet, gets powered off the ball, needs too much time and space, doesn't win any 1 on 1 situation.

 

He turned 20 earlier this week. If this is supposed to be the next Premier League star, then he has a long long way ahead of him. I honestly don't ever see him outgrow a Dutch/Belgian lower tier 1st division team level. Unless, daddy can pull some strings, like he did at Leuven. Get him in the team at the expense of the team, the manager and other (far better) strikers. I could be wrong, he's still young, but i haven't seen any performance of him, in 20 games, that indicates this kid is ever going to make it big time.

Welllets hope he is a mate developer... Harry Kane was bang average on loan with us and Norwich  

[Lizhang]

2 minutes ago, lcfceaves said:

Welllets hope he is a mate developer... Harry Kane was bang average on loan with us and Norwich  

It's too late for him to become a technically gifted player, so that's off the cards. He's not going to become any faster with age, so that's off the cards as well. He can become more cunning, less naive, learn to use his body more efficiently, become more powerfull... But the type of player he can become, best case scenario, well, the options are limited. He could still become a good target man, but even then, he has a long way ahead of him.

 

My main point is, that the Sheffield supporters, they only knew him from the youth ranks. A boy who is physically more "grown" can bully his opponents at that age, but when he no longer has that advantage, when he faces full grown men, only then can you determine what he's worth. So, maybe those supporters were gutted, but maybe the also didn't really have realistic expectations due to arguments stated above.

[Col city fan]

On 16/02/2019 at 17:43, Lizhang said:

Moore was suspended.

Kapustka benched.

Hirst not Selected. Finally.

Is Kaputska so shite he can’t even make the Leuven first 11?

[Lizhang]

1 minute ago, Col city fan said:

Is Kaputska so shite he can’t even make the Leuven first 11?

SInce new year, he hasn't been playing his best. In fact in Pearson's last two games he was rather... how should i put it, "absent"? I think on average, he's been good for us, fans like him, he's regarded as one of our better players, but he isn't ahead of the best of the rest. Moore has raised his game since new years, Kapustka went the other way.

[It'sblueupnorth]

39 minutes ago, Lizhang said:

SInce new year, he hasn't been playing his best. In fact in Pearson's last two games he was rather... how should i put it, "absent"? I think on average, he's been good for us, fans like him, he's regarded as one of our better players, but he isn't ahead of the best of the rest. Moore has raised his game since new years, Kapustka went the other way.

Find his case amazing really. Wanted us to sign him before the euros in 2016, he had a quality tournament and we signed him and thought he’d become a talisman for us. Seems like he’s regressed massively. Maybe a manager like Puel could have got the best out of him the season he signed but generally seems to have been a total waste of time in his career these last couple of seasons where really he should have been improving week by week. Should have stayed in Krakow for a couple of extra seasons before making the move possibly. 

[cal21212121]

5 hours ago, Lizhang said:

SInce new year, he hasn't been playing his best. In fact in Pearson's last two games he was rather... how should i put it, "absent"? I think on average, he's been good for us, fans like him, he's regarded as one of our better players, but he isn't ahead of the best of the rest. Moore has raised his game since new years, Kapustka went the other way.

What would you say his best position is? For us in preseason and U23's he's played as a holding midfielder, part of a midfield 3 with someone else holding, both wings and number 10 role but didn't really stand out in any position.

Could be one of those where there is obvious technical talent but isn't tactically astute enough to play at a higher level.

[Chester Dontlie]

12 hours ago, Lizhang said:

SInce new year, he hasn't been playing his best. In fact in Pearson's last two games he was rather... how should i put it, "absent"? I think on average, he's been good for us, fans like him, he's regarded as one of our better players, but he isn't ahead of the best of the rest. Moore has raised his game since new years, Kapustka went the other way.

 

11 hours ago, It'sblueupnorth said:

Find his case amazing really. Wanted us to sign him before the euros in 2016, he had a quality tournament and we signed him and thought he’d become a talisman for us. Seems like he’s regressed massively. Maybe a manager like Puel could have got the best out of him the season he signed but generally seems to have been a total waste of time in his career these last couple of seasons where really he should have been improving week by week. Should have stayed in Krakow for a couple of extra seasons before making the move possibly. 

I will hazard a guess (based on his (lack of) performances last couple seasons and the interview he gave a year ago to the Polish press) and say that mentality is Kapustka's biggest problem. 

In hindsight I'm inclined to agree the step from the pits of Polish Ekstraklasa to the heights of Premier League was perhaps too abrupt for him. He should've either stayed in Krakow and cement himself as the key player there for another season or two, or move to other team where he would have a better chance to start. But it's easy to say now. One can never predict how the player adapts. The confidence with which he walked into Poland team at 18 was quite striking, who could expect he will struggle not only at Leicester but at Freiburg and OHL as well. I've seen some cases of players regressing through my years as a football fan but have to say Kapustka is among the most glaring and also unexpected ones. I think if he falls out of favour at OHL then maybe loan back to Ekstraklasa could help to instill some confidence back. Last but not least, he's still very young, 22 is too early to cross anyone out. Vards was at Stockbridge Park Steelers at his age.

 

It's good to hear that OHL have the in form players to replace him but for a Poland supporter life is a mystery... The manager is a poser who says there are no wingers in the country and plays well seasoned 33 year old dead wood like his nephew (it's not a joke) on the wing, while 22 yr old Kapustka who was considered the biggest talent since Lewandowski is missing since 2016. It's all really hard to compute... 

 

Edited 18 February 2019 by Chester Dontlie

[Permafrost]

The relegation 'play-downs'...

I realise the teams involved (and therefore the fixtures) aren't sorted yet, but are there any dates set for these games yet?

If not, maybe based on previous years, roughly when are they?

 

 

[Bonanza]

2 hours ago, Permafrost said:

The relegation 'play-downs'...

I realise the teams involved (and therefore the fixtures) aren't sorted yet, but are there any dates set for these games yet?

If not, maybe based on previous years, roughly when are they?

 

 

I've read the play-downs start in the weekend of March 22 and they end in the weekend of April 26.

 

I'll keep you posted when they've actually drawn the fixtures.

[Lizhang]

12 hours ago, cal21212121 said:

What would you say his best position is? For us in preseason and U23's he's played as a holding midfielder, part of a midfield 3 with someone else holding, both wings and number 10 role but didn't really stand out in any position.

Could be one of those where there is obvious technical talent but isn't tactically astute enough to play at a higher level.

His best matches have been on the (left) wing, but somehow, he doesn't strike me as a typical winger. I always assumed he'd be better as a CAM, but so far, he hasn't really convinced in that position either.

2 hours ago, Permafrost said:

The relegation 'play-downs'...

I realise the teams involved (and therefore the fixtures) aren't sorted yet, but are there any dates set for these games yet?

If not, maybe based on previous years, roughly when are they?

Last year, there were 3 free weekends after the regular season ended. So, 4 weeks later, the play-downs started. This year, that would mean the play-downs would start during the weekend of 30-31 march. Unless they change it, because concerns were raised that there was too much time in between.

EDIT: looks like it, judging by Bonanza's post.

Edited 18 February 2019 by Lizhang

[Permafrost]

Thanks both. Might be able to combine my Easter break with a visit to Leuven. 

[SWFC_FAN]

On 17/02/2019 at 13:40, Lizhang said:

Hirst is physically a big kid. I'm sure the Seffield Wednesday supporters that saw him in the youth ranks, saw a kid that could bully defenders on physicallity and lenght alone. Unfortunatly, that's all he has working for him. And when he faces experienced defenders, that are just as tall as him, and likely stronger, then what is left? Killer instinct? Nope. Speed? Nope. Technique? Hahahaha (yes, i'm actually laughing while typing)... nope. He's in constant struggle with his own feet, gets powered off the ball, needs too much time and space, doesn't win any 1 on 1 situation.

 

He turned 20 earlier this week. If this is supposed to be the next Premier League star, then he has a long long way ahead of him. I honestly don't ever see him outgrow a Dutch/Belgian lower tier 1st division team level. Unless, daddy can pull some strings, like he did at Leuven. Get him in the team at the expense of the team, the manager and other (far better) strikers. I could be wrong, he's still young, but i haven't seen any performance of him, in 20 games, that indicates this kid is ever going to make it big time.

 

Bored on my day off and stumbled across this thread, was just curious to see how young Hirsty is getting on. Genuinely hope he makes a name for himself somewhere, but can't help but be slightly amused reading this.

 

He left us on the back of some goals for our U'23s and a few for England youth. All of a sudden he demands more money and thinks he has made it. I watched him plenty of times for our youth teams, and never did I see him as the physical type. It's clear his year in the wilderness was spent bulking up in the gym. What I saw was a very raw, quite quick, young lad who was scoring goals at youth level. You see the type time and time again. 

 

Let me emphasise, like I kept reminding Wednesdayites who got their knickers in a twist when he left, development football is COMPLETELY different to professional football. Young Hirsty still had so much to prove and his advisors appear to have bigged him up way too early for his own good. 

 

I'm sure he's on a decent wedge at Leuven, which his advisors will no doubt be happy about. But I cannot help but feel the lad has been terribly advised. He should have stayed at Wednesday knuckled down and earned a move somewhere else. He hasn't proven anything, and it's quite sad how it's turned out for him. Genuinely as a person hope he can turn it around for his own sake. As for his advisors, HAHA.

[SWFC_FAN]

On 17/02/2019 at 15:15, Lizhang said:

It's too late for him to become a technically gifted player, so that's off the cards. He's not going to become any faster with age, so that's off the cards as well. He can become more cunning, less naive, learn to use his body more efficiently, become more powerfull... But the type of player he can become, best case scenario, well, the options are limited. He could still become a good target man, but even then, he has a long way ahead of him.

 

My main point is, that the Sheffield supporters, they only knew him from the youth ranks. A boy who is physically more "grown" can bully his opponents at that age, but when he no longer has that advantage, when he faces full grown men, only then can you determine what he's worth. So, maybe those supporters were gutted, but maybe the also didn't really have realistic expectations due to arguments stated above.

We were only gutted because his Dad is a hero to many and we had this dream that George would follow in his footsteps. What on earth is he doing struggling in the Belgian second tier? Is that even National League standard?

 

We rejected a 2m pound bid from Leicester in August 2017. Hirst's advisors got upset by this, fell out with the club and chairman, demanded money which reflected that of a senior pro (Hirst had make 2 sub appearances for the first team, looked a boy against men in both), we quite rightly refused to let him play as he didn't have the clubs interests at heart. He spent a year not playing any football, apart from a couple of England youth appearances. That year can't have helped his development.

[Lizhang]

18 hours ago, SWFC_FAN said:

 

Bored on my day off and stumbled across this thread, was just curious to see how young Hirsty is getting on. Genuinely hope he makes a name for himself somewhere, but can't help but be slightly amused reading this.

 

He left us on the back of some goals for our U'23s and a few for England youth. All of a sudden he demands more money and thinks he has made it. I watched him plenty of times for our youth teams, and never did I see him as the physical type. It's clear his year in the wilderness was spent bulking up in the gym. What I saw was a very raw, quite quick, young lad who was scoring goals at youth level. You see the type time and time again. 

 

Let me emphasise, like I kept reminding Wednesdayites who got their knickers in a twist when he left, development football is COMPLETELY different to professional football. Young Hirsty still had so much to prove and his advisors appear to have bigged him up way too early for his own good. 

 

I'm sure he's on a decent wedge at Leuven, which his advisors will no doubt be happy about. But I cannot help but feel the lad has been terribly advised. He should have stayed at Wednesday knuckled down and earned a move somewhere else. He hasn't proven anything, and it's quite sad how it's turned out for him. Genuinely as a person hope he can turn it around for his own sake. As for his advisors, HAHA.

I find this rather baffling, that he used to be fast, because he isn't fast from where i'm sitting. It also might have something to do with him usually being outsmarted and is too late to react, which comes with a disadvantage when trying to get to the ball first. As well as his long legs, not helping in the first couple of meters. But when i spoke about physicallity, i meant "length" first and foremost. I was also just trying to make sense of it, not stating facts. The player we saw deliver one terrible performance after an other, 20 games in a row, it's hard to see what the fuzz was about. So, i was speculating - based on his height and lack of other redeeming qualities, what could have made him stand out in the youth ranks. If this kid was 3 inches taller than other kids his age, i could see him bag some easy goals, against kids 16 years old. But if you say that's not the case, then i don't know what happened. He can't control a ball, he trips over his own feet (something you would expect from a 15 year old on a growth spurt), has aweful timing, isn't smart, isn't fast (whatever the cause), he doesn't keep cool, can't keep a ball, barely wins any headers... I mean, he was a starter under pearson for roughly 20 games, and he scored 2 times. Aside from Pearson not knowing a ball from his ass, Hirst is one of the reasons why we are where we are.

 

Or maybe he's just completely unhappy abroad, and needs to play close to home. Whatever the case, he's of no use to us. Didn't even make the bench under the new manager, and i didn't read anything about him being injured.

Edited 19 February 2019 by Lizhang

[SWFC_FAN]

1 hour ago, Lizhang said:

I find this rather baffling, that he used to be fast, because he isn't fast from where i'm sitting. It also might have something to do with him usually being outsmarted and is too late to react, which comes with a disadvantage when trying to get to the ball first. As well as his long legs, not helping in the first couple of meters. But when i spoke about physicallity, i meant "length" first and foremost. I was also just trying to make sense of it, not stating facts. The player we saw deliver one terrible performance after an other, 20 games in a row, it's hard to see what the fuzz was about. So, i was speculating - based on his height and lack of other redeeming qualities, what could have made him stand out in the youth ranks. If this kid was 3 inches taller than other kids his age, i could see him bag some easy goals, against kids 16 years old. But if you say that's not the case, then i don't know what happened. He can't control a ball, he trips over his own feet (something you would expect from a 15 year old on a growth spurt), has aweful timing, isn't smart, isn't fast (whatever the cause), he doesn't keep cool, can't keep a ball, barely wins any headers... I mean, he was a starter under pearson for roughly 20 games, and he scored 2 times. Aside from Pearson not knowing a ball from his ass, Hirst is one of the reasons why we are where we are.

 

Or maybe he's just completely unhappy abroad, and needs to play close to home. Whatever the case, he's of no use to us. Didn't even make the bench under the new manager, and i didn't read anything about him being injured.

When I saw him he was just a bit taller, not exceptionally quick- just quite gangly with long legs which travelled him far. Had a knack for scoring goals, decent finisher.

 

But again this was at under 18/under 23 football. It is nothing compared to professional standard at any level. The competitive edge, the physicality, the pressure is just not there, which makes it incredibly hard to form opinions on how a player will fair in the professional game.

 

I've seen plenty of kids with promise. From Hirst's age group, only two have established themselves as regulars in our first team squad. One young CB who I actually thought wouldn't make it and a young left back, who to be fair did stand out. My point is it's so hard to tell how these lads will fair when they make the step up. We had one lad who partnered Hirst upfront who was scoring on a similar level to George, he now looks set to be released to pursue a scholarship in America. 

 

For me I don't understand the move, it seems to me like it was just a way to stick two fingers up to Wednesday and screw us out of compensation money, genuinely. It was a huge gamble for a 19 year old to go to a Belgian 2nd League under a manager who lost the plot managerially quite some time ago. Did he think it would be easy and after 6 months Leicester will bring him back to England? I mean how does the partnership work? Why would Leicester buy him on his current form, what is he showing? A huge gamble from the Hist camp which so far looks to have backfired. He still has age on his side, hopefully he can find some kind of form over there- but your comments don't sound promising.

[Lizhang]

2 hours ago, SWFC_FAN said:

When I saw him he was just a bit taller, not exceptionally quick- just quite gangly with long legs which travelled him far. Had a knack for scoring goals, decent finisher.

 

But again this was at under 18/under 23 football. It is nothing compared to professional standard at any level. The competitive edge, the physicality, the pressure is just not there, which makes it incredibly hard to form opinions on how a player will fair in the professional game.

 

I've seen plenty of kids with promise. From Hirst's age group, only two have established themselves as regulars in our first team squad. One young CB who I actually thought wouldn't make it and a young left back, who to be fair did stand out. My point is it's so hard to tell how these lads will fair when they make the step up. We had one lad who partnered Hirst upfront who was scoring on a similar level to George, he now looks set to be released to pursue a scholarship in America. 

 

For me I don't understand the move, it seems to me like it was just a way to stick two fingers up to Wednesday and screw us out of compensation money, genuinely. It was a huge gamble for a 19 year old to go to a Belgian 2nd League under a manager who lost the plot managerially quite some time ago. Did he think it would be easy and after 6 months Leicester will bring him back to England? I mean how does the partnership work? Why would Leicester buy him on his current form, what is he showing? A huge gamble from the Hist camp which so far looks to have backfired. He still has age on his side, hopefully he can find some kind of form over there- but your comments don't sound promising.

Last season, Pearson wasn't playing great football either, but the team was still winning and we ended up second. I'm guessing they, Pearson & Hirst, were confident things would work out, when they teamed up during the summer. Assuming the level of our league would not be an issue. But as we know now, Pearson not only overestimated his own capabilities, but those of Hirst as well (or he simply underestimated the league alltogether).

[SWFC_FAN]

50 minutes ago, Lizhang said:

Last season, Pearson wasn't playing great football either, but the team was still winning and we ended up second. I'm guessing they, Pearson & Hirst, were confident things would work out, when they teamed up during the summer. Assuming the level of our league would not be an issue. But as we know now, Pearson not only overestimated his own capabilities, but those of Hirst as well (or he simply underestimated the league alltogether).

It does seem the case. It was a very risky move by both parties. Pearson and Hirst were Wednesday legends, without question. Now I don't think they'd get much of a reception if they came back to Wednesday. Which is incredibly sad.

 

Do you think you guys will stay up now Pearson has got the boot? What would the consequences of relegation be?

 

 

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, SWFC_FAN said:

It does seem the case. It was a very risky move by both parties. Pearson and Hirst were Wednesday legends, without question. Now I don't think they'd get much of a reception if they came back to Wednesday. Which is incredibly sad.

 

Do you think you guys will stay up now Pearson has got the boot? What would the consequences of relegation be?

 

 

Read the last 30 pages for the answers.