Politics Thread (encompassing Brexit) - 21 June 2017 onwards

[Fox Ulike]

6 minutes ago, Strokes said:

 

See it’s this kind of arrogance and assumptions that isolated remain in the first. We can just call them racist and put them back in their pen. Hopefully it won’t come to that and we get the hard brexit we all dream of.

 

Wanting less foreigners in the country isn’t racist. That’s your assumption.

 

I just don’t know why you refuse to tackle this issue head on - but just go all snowflake on me when I talk about immigration. Man up!

 

As Ealing has said, it’s laughable that you attribute 8.5m people voted to leave because of ECJ jurisdiction – make no similar figure for the number of people who voted leave because they don’t like lots of foreigners in the country.

[Guest MattP]

1 minute ago, toddybad said:

It isn't really a negotiation when one side gets everything they want 

But you only think that because you only read things like The Guardian, FT and believe everything the EU tells you.

 

We were told there were no moves onto the second stage by you until 100billion was paid, it's now half that and a "deal is nearly done", you told us that we had no chance of any transitional deal at the start, that now appears likely.

 

Whatever concession we get you'll call it a victory for the EU, that's what you want to hear and you'll refuse to consider anything else.

[Strokes]

11 minutes ago, Fox Ulike said:

 

As your average Leave voter will tell you: they voted Leave mainly because they objected to the arbitrary nature by which the Court of Justice can determine whether a Member State has fulfilled its obligations under Union law. Oh, and  they don’t like brown people.

 

Wow, how many brown people do you think are arriving from the EU?

 

7 minutes ago, MattP said:

FFS you sound like Will Self.

 

Yeah, it was all those brown people coming into the country from Poland, Lithuania, Slovakia and Bulgaria that won it, you aren't even thinking anymore are you?

 

I bet that's why Priti Patel was such a Brexiteer. Brown people.

You could argue it’s racist to assume only white people voted for leave. I wouldn’t sink so low though.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, MattP said:

But you only think that because you only read things like The Guardian, FT and believe everything the EU tells you.

 

We were told there were no moves onto the second stage by you until 100billion was paid, it's now half that and a "deal is nearly done", you told us that we had no chance of any transitional deal at the start, that now appears likely.

 

Whatever concession we get you'll call it a victory for the EU, that's what you want to hear and you'll refuse to consider anything else.

I've never declared a transitional deal unlikely - it would be impossible to not have one.

 

As for the £100b figure, I simply reported the figures that were in the Brexiteer Sun the other day...

[Strokes]

8 minutes ago, Fox Ulike said:

 

Wanting less foreigners in the country isn’t racist. That’s your assumption.

 

I just don’t know why you refuse to tackle this issue head on - but just go all snowflake on me when I talk about immigration. Man up!

 

As Ealing has said, it’s laughable that you attribute 8.5m people voted to leave because of ECJ jurisdiction – make no similar figure for the number of people who voted leave because they don’t like lots of foreigners in the country.

Where did I say there would be 8.5million you plank? This what you do read half of what people write and fill in the gaps with your drivel. You seem unable to take examples in their intended manner, maybe I should post with disclaimers.

[Fox Ulike]

8 minutes ago, Strokes said:

Where did I say there would be 8.5million you plank? This what you do read half of what people write and fill in the gaps with your drivel. You seem unable to take examples in their intended manner, maybe I should post with disclaimers.

I do apologise. What you actually said was that it would be 8.5m or more!

 

It depends on the deal, I’d say if it was just trade, divorce, customs union etc. You would talking much less [than 8.5m] but any concessions on freedom of movement and ECJ and you would be pushing that and more.

 

Anyway, second chance:

 

How many people do you think voted leave because of ECJ jurisdiction, and how many voted leave cos they want less foreigners in the country?

 

I am not a plank.

[leicsmac]

4 hours ago, MattP said:

Keep that in the Trump bashing thread.

 

He's finally getting some policy through one so we can see how it goes.

Haven't seen you in there recently, would be nice to see your views on what's going on in Utah, getting the travel ban through the Supreme Court and what Muellers up to right now.

[Guest MattP]

2 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Haven't seen you in there recently, would be nice to see your views on what's going on in Utah, getting the travel ban through the Supreme Court and what Muellers up to right now.

Nah I can't be doing with it, not you but so many people now are ready to jump on you as a fascist, racist etc if you don't fall into line and get outraged at every single thing Trump does, even now Nigel Farage saying TV he was more offended by a homosexual being murdered than a retweet is seen as "legitimising' or 'defending' Trump - because of this even a video of a fanatical Islamist smashing a statue of the Virgin Mary is somehow managed to be redefined as so-called Islamophobia by the media.

 

It happens to everyone, Piers Morgan defended something he said and he's hammered from all sides on including having people threaten to kill his children, Rees-Mogg was even being abused last week just for having a meeting with Steve Bannon. Yet you can cavort with people who order executions of politicians and it's all OK, bizarre World we live in. Mental.

 

We've lost all sense of perspective, logic and reality when the comes to talking about Trump and I have zero interest in it anymore.

[leicsmac]

2 minutes ago, MattP said:

Nah I can't be doing with it, not you but so many people now are ready to jump on you as a fascist, racist etc if you don't fall into line and get outraged at every single thing Trump does, even now Nigel Farage saying TV he was more offended by a homosexual being murdered than a retweet is seen as "legitimising' or 'defending' Trump - because of this even a video of a fanatical Islamist smashing a statue of the Virgin Mary is somehow managed to be redefined as so-called Islamophobia by the media.

 

It happens to everyone, Piers Morgan defended something he said and he's hammered from all sides on including having people threaten to kill his children, Rees-Mogg was even being abused last week just for having a meeting with Steve Bannon. Yet you can cavort with people who order executions of politicians and it's all OK, bizarre World we live in. Mental.

 

We've lost all sense of perspective, logic and reality when the comes to talking about Trump and I have zero interest in it anymore.

There's some doubts about the authenticity of the videos and had Trump retweeted them in a vacuum rather than bringing attention to Britain First then there might have been less fallout...but yeah, I know what you mean - his election has polarised things. However, I think that's what he and many people who voted for him wanted in the first place, clarity and a clear moral delineation between "good" and "bad" from a leader.

 

It's the people Trump enables rather than the guy himself that scares me tbh.

 

JRM (or any UK politician) being seen in the same room as Bannon is nigh-unforgivable though IMO - I hope he had a damn good reason.

[Buce]

3 hours ago, Strokes said:

What do we want.....economic arse-rape.

How do we want it........hard.

 

 

1 hour ago, Kopfkino said:

 

Once he realises there's 8.5m votes available, man of the people Jezza will save the day with his hokey cokey Brexit and offer the students free chicken nuggets to keep them onside. 

 

Don't be absurd.

 

Our Man of the People would never be so crass as to exclude the vegans.

 

1 hour ago, Strokes said:

Wow, how many brown people do you think are arriving from the EU?

 

You could argue it’s racist to assume only white people voted for leave. I wouldn’t sink so low though.

 

I seem to recall that one of the central planks to the Leave campaign was the imminence of millions of Turks coming over here to steal our jobs and rape our women.

 

Last time I was in Turkey, they looked fairly brown to me (you know, in a swarthy kind of way ).

Edited 5 December 2017 by Buce

[Guest]

David Davis et al now talking about regulatory alignment across the whole uk....

[lgfualol]

6 hours ago, MattP said:

It was always going to be hard, when the people vote against the elite you have to be prepared for a fight and hope that those in charge have the will to see it through. 

 

Trump was elected 12 months ago, the EU referendum was 18 months ago and the establishment are still trying to do everything they can to sabotage both of the results. That tells you all you need to know.

I saw a screengrab of your second sentence from that PrisonPlanet bloke, I hope you don't follow him, pretty sure he writes for Infowars and those nutters.

[Guest Kopfkino]

6 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

 

Don't be absurd.

 

Our Man of the People would never be so crass as to exclude the vegans.

 

They can't have falafel because the 8.5m racists won't want any of that foreign muck on these shores.

Edited 5 December 2017 by Kopfkino

[Buce]

6 minutes ago, Kopfkino said:

 

They can't have falafel because the 8.5m racists won't want any of that foreign muck on these shores.

 

The nut cutlet is out, too.

 

Any talk of nuts is going to anger the feminists.

[bovril]

Sate of this thread.

Remainer: Brexiters hate brown people!

Brexiter: No we don't we only hate white people, which is more acceptable!

Remainer: What about Turks. They're kind of brown. 

[Guest MattP]

14 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

There's some doubts about the authenticity of the videos and had Trump retweeted them in a vacuum rather than bringing attention to Britain First then there might have been less fallout...but yeah, I know what you mean - his election has polarised things. However, I think that's what he and many people who voted for him wanted in the first place, clarity and a clear moral delineation between "good" and "bad" from a leader.

 

It's the people Trump enables rather than the guy himself that scares me tbh.

 

JRM (or any UK politician) being seen in the same room as Bannon is nigh-unforgivable though IMO - I hope he had a damn good reason.

I know what you mean and I fully concur that Trump was wrong to retweet them, it just amazed me how the content of the videos was spun into what it was, picture this - a video of a guy from Britain First with a cross on entering a Mosque, destroying an Islamic artifact being posted online by Al-Muhajiroun on Twitter, then it being re-tweeted by Mohammed Bin Salman as an example of the religion and then the whole of the media deciding to describe the video as an "anti-Christian" one - the thought of it is so aburd and ridiculous but that actually happened in reverse. It wasn't just enough to say he tweeted unverified videos from the far-right.

 

I would happily meet Steve Bannon, (I'd also happily meet Seamus Milne from Labour as well) as I'd find it fascinating - why a politician shouldn't do that is absolutely beyond me but it's exactly what I'm talking about, the outrage now over two people meeting for a drink is something I can't get my head around. Why should he have to have a damn good reason for meeting the one time chief strategist of the Republican party? Because he writes for a website you don't like?

He can do what he wants, we probably have 150 politicians who have met far worse including those resposible for crimes upto and including murder but again, this one is kicked off about because it's related to Trump, it's almost laughable.

 

[Innovindil]

3 minutes ago, bovril said:

Sate of this thread.

Remainer: Brexiters hate brown people!

Brexiter: No we don't we only hate white people, which is more acceptable!

Remainer: What about Turks. They're kind of brown. 

Can't I just hate people in general? 

[bovril]

Just now, Innovindil said:

Can't I just hate people in general? 

Yes. Especially people who walk slowly on the street but then speed up when you try to overtake them.

[Buce]

11 minutes ago, bovril said:

Sate of this thread.

Remainer: Brexiters hate brown people!

Brexiter: No we don't we only hate white people, which is more acceptable!

Remainer: What about Turks. They're kind of brown. 

 

 

Irony meter working well then, Marmite.

[bovril]

2 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

 

Irony meter working well then, Marmite.

As is yours...  

Edited 5 December 2017 by bovril

[leicsmac]

3 minutes ago, MattP said:

I know what you mean and I fully concur that Trump was wrong to retweet them, it just amazed me how the content of the videos was spun into what it was, picture this - a video of a guy from Britain First with a cross on entering a Mosque, destroying an Islamic artifact being posted online by Al-Muhajiroun on Twitter, then it being re-tweeted by Mohammed Bin Salman as an example of the religion and then the whole of the media deciding to describe the video as an "anti-Christian" one - the thought of it is so aburd and ridiculous but that actually happened in reverse. It wasn't just enough to say he tweeted unverified videos from the far-right.

 

I would happily meet Steve Bannon, (I'd also happily meet Seamus Milne from Labour as well) as I'd find it fascinating - why a politician shouldn't do that is absolutely beyond me but it's exactly what I'm talking about, the outrage now over two people meeting for a drink is something I can't get my head around. Why should he have to have a damn good reason for meeting the one time chief strategist of the Republican party? Because he writes for a website you don't like?

He can do what he wants, we probably have 150 politicians who have met far worse including those resposible for crimes upto and including murder but again, this one is kicked off about because it's related to Trump, it's almost laughable.

 

Can certainly see what you mean regarding the Tweeting and the response to it too.

 

Yeah, perhaps I'm letting my personal feelings get in the way here but I find Bannon utterly odious and, more pertinently, dangerous, and I always have since I first got to know about the guy. He knows the power that he holds given that Breitbart has become a pretty major player in the media industry and he's always been trying to leverage it to get what he and some of the people that follow him want - an aggressively nationalist, authoritarian, utterly WASP-controlled US straight out of The Handmaids Tale where the future doesn't matter, only what can be exploited right now. Of course, since he got booted out of the inner circle he has less power now, but he's still something of a player and as much as I wish I could be sure that JRM was just meeting him for a convivial drink and chat, I'm thinking there was more to it than that. There's a difference between you and I (and tbh I wouldn't mind actually having a drink and finding out what makes a guy like that tick) meeting such a man and a sitting MP doing so IMO.

 

The point that other UK politicians have rubbed shoulders with much worse (yes Saudi and the PRC leadership, I'm looking at you, amongst others) is a fair one and more attention should be drawn to other odious representatives around the world too.

[Innovindil]

41 minutes ago, bovril said:

Yes. Especially people who walk slowly on the street but then speed up when you try to overtake them.

Tbf they are the worst kind of people. In the same vein as those ****s who press the button at traffic lights and cross while the person is still on red. 

[GaelicFox]

Is Britain racist 

 

hell yes 

 

read this thread 

 

 

[Bellend Sebastian]

My family are furious at the suggestion they're racist, not because of the accusation itself but because until relatively recently it wasn't a problem

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Innovindil said:

Tbf they are the worst kind of people. In the same vein as those ****s who press the button at traffic lights and cross while the person is still on red. 

Fun fact: the vast majority (as in almost all) of buttons at pedestrian crossings do nothing at all to affect when the traffic lights turn to red. 

 

I promise you that's absolutely true.

 

Everything you've ever believed in, shattered. 

Edited 5 December 2017 by Guest