Nick Posted 9 July 2017 Posted 9 July 2017 12 minutes ago, Buce said: Legal challenge to May's deal with DUP: https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/09/theresa-may-dup-deal-legal-challenge-crowdfunded-campaign-good-friday-agreement http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-40547775 Yeah was just reading that McLean was having a pop!
Nick Posted 9 July 2017 Posted 9 July 2017 I can see arguments for both the GFA breach and contrevening the Bribery Act but I don't think it'll stick.
Buce Posted 9 July 2017 Posted 9 July 2017 5 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said: I can see arguments for both the GFA breach and contrevening the Bribery Act but I don't think it'll stick. Dunno, it's the same QC that made the successful challenge to May's attempts to trigger Article 50 without a vote.
Nick Posted 9 July 2017 Posted 9 July 2017 8 minutes ago, Buce said: Dunno, it's the same QC that made the successful challenge to May's attempts to trigger Article 50 without a vote. It'll be interesting viewing, thats for sure.
Rincewind Posted 9 July 2017 Posted 9 July 2017 Some may see the deal as a way to save Mays arse and help her cling onto power. thus breaking an agreement not to take sides in a dispute between two sets of murderers and terrorists. Others will say, 'Yeah maybe they are a load of homophobic sexist crazy bible bashing creationists but at least they are not Jeremy Corbyn sympathisers'
Guest Posted 9 July 2017 Posted 9 July 2017 1 hour ago, Rincewind said: Some may see the deal as a way to save Mays arse and help her cling onto power. thus breaking an agreement not to take sides in a dispute between two sets of murderers and terrorists. Others will say, 'Yeah maybe they are a load of homophobic sexist crazy bible bashing creationists but at least they are not Jeremy Corbyn sympathisers' That's about the level of debate about labour tbh. All the right has to keep it afloat is bile at this moment.
Guest Posted 9 July 2017 Posted 9 July 2017 4 hours ago, Swan Lesta said: Vince coming out now saying what a few of us have been mooting on here for a while... That he can see us not leaving Europe. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40547733 A tad early perhaps
Thracian Posted 9 July 2017 Posted 9 July 2017 (edited) On 08/07/2017 at 18:04, toddybad said: Not sticking around to listen to the bile of the right but thought I'd give them a chance to watch the next PM in action. Takes me back a long way but how his speaking style reminds me of someone. And it's strange: i don't see this Marxist-worshipping advocate saying much about the distribution of wealth in the world's greatest bastions of the Marxism/Communism he so advocates. http://www.cnbc.com/2016/09/01/russia-is-the-most-unequal-major-country-in-the-world-study.html https://www.ft.com/content/3c521faa-baa6-11e5-a7cc-280dfe875e28 Edited 9 July 2017 by Thracian
Rincewind Posted 9 July 2017 Posted 9 July 2017 2 hours ago, toddybad said: That's about the level of debate about labour tbh. All the right has to keep it afloat is bile at this moment. True. It helps if you have the backing of the media to do the the talking. In a short while the very same words are repeated by 'Joe Bloggs' et al Its all about spin doctors now. They can twisy a story in favour of their employer and make the opposition look bad. Wasn't there a speech writer who wrote for Blair and the opposition. He wrote the speech for Blair just before the invasion of Iraq and said he hated it because he disahreed with it. But he was being paid to give valid reasons and make Blair look good.
Buce Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 UK shoppers 'completely in the dark' about Brexit - they face higher prices, less choice, and poorer quality - former Sainsbury's boss: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40530700
Buce Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 Not strictly on topic, but I don't know where else to put it and it's far too interesting to not post: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40189959
Guest Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 Theresa May to invite Labour to help create policy amid Tory plot to oust her https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/09/may-to-invite-labour-to-help-create-policies-amid-tory-plot-to-oust-her
Guest MattP Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 Some of the intimidation of the moderates from the hard-left is quite frightening, I do fear if it's not reigned in we could end up with another dead MP. I wouldn't have the guts to stand over someone like that and take a picture of them.
Buce Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 8 minutes ago, MattP said: Some of the intimidation of the moderates from the hard-left is quite frightening, I do fear if it's not reigned in we could end up with another dead MP. I wouldn't have the guts to stand over someone like that and take a picture of them. Let's just remember that the only dead MP was killed by a member of the far right. 4
Guest Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 8 minutes ago, MattP said: Some of the intimidation of the moderates from the hard-left is quite frightening, I do fear if it's not reigned in we could end up with another dead MP. I wouldn't have the guts to stand over someone like that and take a picture of them. I'm sure the tactic of getting the photo was less frightening than those used by tabloid photographers. I'd agree that the left wingers need to show more respect for the more centrist wing of the party.
Guest Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 23 minutes ago, toddybad said: Theresa May to invite Labour to help create policy amid Tory plot to oust her https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/09/may-to-invite-labour-to-help-create-policies-amid-tory-plot-to-oust-her Rebel MPs form cross-party group to oppose hard Brexit https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/10/rebel-mps-form-cross-party-group-to-oppose-hard-brexit? Looks like a really interesting time for parliament watchers.
Captain... Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 On 08/07/2017 at 22:15, MattP said: EU-Japan potential trade deal, amazing, we need to stay. UK-US potential trade deal - horrible, all our food will be wrong. Donald Trump!! EU-Japan trade deal, 6 years in the making, 15 years to phase in, a huge amount of negotiation and research has gone in to this to find acceptable trade terms on both sides. It is also a lot further along than "potential". UK - US trade deal is pure speculation at the moment and based on the comments after a meeting of 2 people one has a habit of talking before thinking and promising things he can't deliver (how's that wall coming along) the other most likely won't be in power by the time Brexit is done. The EU has tried to negotiate trade deals with the US and did come to an agreement over TTIP, including accepting their produce that doesn't meet EU health and safety regulations: hormone injected meat, use of banned pesticides, GM crops and pathogen killing treatment of chicken. Not to mention a whole raft of other proposals giving US access to our financial service markets and healthcare and pharmaceutical markets. In a bizarre twist it was Trump who pulled out of it, despite it seeming to favour the US and showed huge amount of compromise from the EU. So three years of trade negotiations (they take a while) down the pan because of Trumps protectionist agenda (also scrapping the TPP). This is not the action of a man interested in mutually beneficial trade deals. He has one goal in mind when it comes to trade negotiations and that is winning them, he has seen that the UK will be over a barrel and desperate to do some sort of trade deal and he sees an opportunity to exploit. This isn't a criticism of Trump, it is how he operates and he is good at it.
Innovindil Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 11 hours ago, Strokes said: Couldn't keep away @toddybad? We should all chip in for a ticket to hamburg so he can let off steam with the other lefties instead of frothing on here and spitting his dummy out every couple of days.
Guest MattP Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 37 minutes ago, Buce said: Let's just remember that the only dead MP was killed by a member of the far right. Actually many MP's have been killed over our lifetime, most by Irish terrorists. But yes, most recently it was, but just because of that we shouldn't ignore threats from the hard left. I don't have any sympathy if the moderates are "deselected" - they have brought this on themselves, but people sneakily taking photos of people on trains (especially women) to call them ***** isn't something that sits right with me at all.
Guest MattP Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 20 minutes ago, Captain... said: EU-Japan trade deal, 6 years in the making, 15 years to phase in, a huge amount of negotiation and research has gone in to this to find acceptable trade terms on both sides. It is also a lot further along than "potential". UK - US trade deal is pure speculation at the moment and based on the comments after a meeting of 2 people one has a habit of talking before thinking and promising things he can't deliver (how's that wall coming along) the other most likely won't be in power by the time Brexit is done. The EU has tried to negotiate trade deals with the US and did come to an agreement over TTIP, including accepting their produce that doesn't meet EU health and safety regulations: hormone injected meat, use of banned pesticides, GM crops and pathogen killing treatment of chicken. Not to mention a whole raft of other proposals giving US access to our financial service markets and healthcare and pharmaceutical markets. In a bizarre twist it was Trump who pulled out of it, despite it seeming to favour the US and showed huge amount of compromise from the EU. So three years of trade negotiations (they take a while) down the pan because of Trumps protectionist agenda (also scrapping the TPP). This is not the action of a man interested in mutually beneficial trade deals. He has one goal in mind when it comes to trade negotiations and that is winning them, he has seen that the UK will be over a barrel and desperate to do some sort of trade deal and he sees an opportunity to exploit. This isn't a criticism of Trump, it is how he operates and he is good at it. TTIP was further along at one point than the Japan trade deal, I'd still back us to have one completed before the EU one takes effect, we've seen the form of the voting patterns in the EU parliament. From my memory TTIP collapsed just before the EU referendum so long before Trump took office? https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/06/transatlantic-trade-partnership-ttip-canada-eu - that's from before he was elected, German and French ministers confirming it has failed. I know we like to blame everything on Donald Trump but let's not start pinning things on him when he wasn't even President. He'll be responsible for the Iraq War at this rate.
Nick Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 10 minutes ago, MattP said: TTIP was further along at one point than the Japan trade deal, I'd still back us to have one completed before the EU one takes effect, we've seen the form of the voting patterns in the EU parliament. From my memory TTIP collapsed just before the EU referendum so long before Trump took office? https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/06/transatlantic-trade-partnership-ttip-canada-eu - that's from before he was elected, German and French ministers confirming it has failed. I know we like to blame everything on Donald Trump but let's not start pinning things on him when he wasn't even President. He'll be responsible for the Iraq War at this rate. https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.independent.co.uk/voices/donald-trump-trade-deals-tpp-ttip-american-business-workers-boost-short-term-destroy-long-term-a7543706.html%3Famp He wasn't responsible for the Iraq war directly but maybe we can find something incriminating given time.
Guest Foxin_mad Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 21 hours ago, MattP said: The Conservatives also are prioritising tariff free access to the single market. Both parties agree leaving the single market is going to happen, in reality it's going to probably come down to how much money we'll have to pay for it. The whole "jobs first" Brexit line is just rhetoric that means absolutely nothing that you can only get away with in opposition. I'd like to know what his answer would be to if the European Union refuses that unless we adhere to the four pillars, because he's also committed to seeing freedom of movement end. Not that it matters anyway, it's the Tories who are doing the negotiation. Labour are about as far from a 'jobs first' party as one can get. What they actually mean is Public sector first. They do not give a flying crap about private sector jobs or businesses and despise the nasty rich men. Ironic considering they need all of these to even try to fund their absolutely mad funding spree. 26% Corporation Tax and a £10 a hour minimum wage are not 'jobs first' policies they are a 'more people on state benefits' hence more voters policies! Many millions of jobs would be lost under a labour government that is pretty much a fact. Its funny the bile spewing hate mongering violent depressed left claim that the west is such a bad place in a capitalist system, yet people still want to migrate here? Odd they would want to come to somewhere so shit!? Britain and America are pretty much the top destinations migrants head for why is that if they are so crap and nasty? Even the migrants could not understand why these left wing fools were destroying their own beautiful city and turning into a warzone? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4677108/Second-night-violence-Hamburg-G20-leaders-meet.html On the subject of cross party discussions on policies for the good of the country, I am all for that. Lets have discussions on all polices and try and evolve they into something practical. Conversely I am not against most of the ideas Labour have except mass uncontrolled unskilled immigration but what I am against is funding policy with Money that we don't have. We need to look at this from all angles, some services need to be made more efficient, some need better funding, some need better management. I mostly agree that infrastructure may benefit from being renationalised as it is most run by foreign government backed companies who have us over a barrel and use us as a funding stream for projects back home.
Buce Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 31 minutes ago, MattP said: Actually many MP's have been killed over our lifetime, most by Irish terrorists. But yes, most recently it was, but just because of that we shouldn't ignore threats from the hard left. I don't have any sympathy if the moderates are "deselected" - they have brought this on themselves, but people sneakily taking photos of people on trains (especially women) to call them ***** isn't something that sits right with me at all. On that we agree.
Jon the Hat Posted 10 July 2017 Posted 10 July 2017 Quite happy to see good ideas come from across parliament, especially for BREXIT negotiations, as something this important should involve all our elected representatives. People don't seem to realise that the main blocker for multiparty trade deals (the EU being a lot of parties) is that if say Italian strawberry growers don't want strawberries coming in from Egypt then we lose a bargaining chip over the demands of another nation. It is a lot easier, and hence quicker, to align on the needs of Great Britain in a deal with the US, or Japan etc, than it is for the EU who have to settle terms with all member states despite what they might say about a united front. 1
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