Diego Maradona

[David Guiza]

I was listening to the latest Golazo Podcast on the way home from the game/town on Friday night which features Asif Kapadia (the filmmaker whom made Senna and Amy) talking about his forthcoming documentary, due to be released this year, about Diego Maradona in the 1980s. Being a podcast about Italian football the podcast only went into detail about his time at Napoli which was fascinating.

 

I vaguely knew about his time there with the infamous kick ups video and great Mars bar t-shirt, but not a great deal. The thing that really interested me though was how his time at Napoli transcended sport and he was almost practically a Godlike figure to the Neapolitan both on and off the field, how he dragged a poor and deprived city from the drags of Italy to become the first team to win the Scuedetto from the south of Italy and give a voice to a forgotten city. Naples was (and still is by some) regarded as the s**thole of Italy and was not even considered to be part of the country by others also. Maradona however was able to reunite the city with his persona and ability.

 

Napoli were also the equivalent of a side like Stoke, West Brom etc at the time and not the regular European giant that they are grown into in recent years and the league was absolutely littered with some of the greatest players to have ever played the game, and yet Maradona was that gifted by himself that he practically dragged them to the title alone.  

 

There's also quite an interesting article on his time at Napoli below:-

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/copa90/2017/may/11/diego-maradona-naples-napoli-fans-30-years-scudetto

 

Anyway, there is a reason for the topic that transcends a biography of Maradona and that is -

 

Do people believe that a player like Maradona will ever come about again, ability wise there undoubtedly will be (some may argue that Messi has already surpassed him that in regard), however will there be a player whom represents not just a team but a city and a region again in the way Maradona did; and would a player of his ability ever choose to play for such an unfancied side like Napoli were at the time? Or has football moved on so much that the likelihood of a player, in the peak of his career, moving to a less fashionable team to fight for the city and team is now impossible and the rest of us have to rely on a minor miracle to succeed? 

 

[Richard]

I spent some time in Argentina back end of last year and the general consensus there was that yes Messi is an outstanding player but he's not considered on the same level as Maradona, and never will be unless he wins the world cup this year. 

 

Maradona, at least in the eyes of the Argentinians I spoke with, won't be surpassed and is almost a demigod

[David Guiza]

7 minutes ago, Richard said:

I spent some time in Argentina back end of last year and the general consensus there was that yes Messi is an outstanding player but he's not considered on the same level as Maradona, and never will be unless he wins the world cup this year. 

 

Maradona, at least in the eyes of the Argentinians I spoke with, won't be surpassed and is almost a demigod

I think i'd probably agree with that. There is no doubting Messi's ability, but Maradona had the ability, persona and the international success to back it up as a complete package. Messi, and many others, will outscore Maradona twice over but the period they both represented are so vastly different. If Maradona had as much protection from referees as Messi has then his statistics would have been out of the world one would suspect.

 

The inability for this current Argentina side to succeed is somewhat baffling. Yes they're not necessarily gifted from 1-11 but there are some incredible players in that side and yet they barely made it through qualifying. They're such an enigma that they could either come bottom of the group stage or win the whole thing in the summer. 

[Dan LCFC]

1 hour ago, David Guiza said:

I think i'd probably agree with that. There is no doubting Messi's ability, but Maradona had the ability, persona and the international success to back it up as a complete package. Messi, and many others, will outscore Maradona twice over but the period they both represented are so vastly different. If Maradona had as much protection from referees as Messi has then his statistics would have been out of the world one would suspect.

 

The inability for this current Argentina side to succeed is somewhat baffling. Yes they're not necessarily gifted from 1-11 but there are some incredible players in that side and yet they barely made it through qualifying. They're such an enigma that they could either come bottom of the group stage or win the whole thing in the summer. 

i think it was @Finnegan who said this a while back and I agreed with it that Argentina are that loaded with top class attacking talent that they don't actually know what to do with them all and I thought there was something in that. They in theory should be an incredible side yet they're often so disappointing.

 

The Maradona story is fascinating. Pretty sure most people from Naples support Argentina over Italy.

 

In terms of icons I generally associate a lot of them with Italian clubs. Totti, Maldini, Zanetti, Buffon etc... Barcelona as well have had a few, then of course Gerrard for Liverpool.

Edited 19 February 2018 by Dan LCFC

[Izzy]

Fantastic player, once in a generation genius. He may be a demigod in Argentina and Naples, but I can't forgive him for this. Sorry...

 

[David Guiza]

16 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

i think it was @Finnegan who said this a while back and I agreed with it that Argentina are that loaded with top class attacking talent that they don't actually know what to do with them all and I thought there was something in that. They in theory should be an incredible side yet they're often so disappointing.

 

The Maradona story is fascinating. Pretty sure most people from Naples support Argentina over Italy.

 

In terms of icons I generally associate a lot of them with Italian clubs. Totti, Maldini, Zanetti, Buffon etc... Barcelona as well have had a few, then of course Gerrard for Liverpool.

Yeah I think there's almost certainly an element of that. You can build a team around two or three fantastic forward talents, but with them it's a case of trying to find the best balance to satisfy the squad and have the best effect. Sort of like the Gerrard, Lampard, Scholes debacle but on an even bigger scale. 

 

Yeah it certainly seems that way, I couldn't imagine one individual having that much of an effect on a city that the individual is favoured over the country. I think he even knocked Italy out of the 1990 World Cup in Naples and wasn't hounded like many would be in Italy. 

 

Absolutely, as good as it is to see English football have somewhat of a resurgence in European football it is a shame to see much of Italy continually struggle when they were so fantastic in the 90s and early 00s. I also sort of wish we played an Italian side during our CL escapades just for the experience. 

9 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

Fantastic player, once in a generation genius. He may be a demigod in Argentina and Naples, but I can't forgive him for this. Sorry...

 

 There was an interesting point in the podcast about how quite early in his career he was taught by a famous coach much before 86'(who I cannot remember the name of) that sport is about winning at all costs and gaining the edge on your opponent, if you can win 3-0 and play fair great, but if you can 'cheat' your way to victory then even better. 

 

I absolutely do not condone what he did as for me it is out and out cheating, the same with his drugs ban, although I do wonder how it would have gone were that to be Lineker or somebody on the England team.  

[the fox]

I think (iirc) a journalist said that people in argentina are expecting Messi to put the whole team on his back and drag them to glory.

Argentina has an amazing attacking core but that's about it. The keeper isn't that great, the fullbacks and CBs aren't world class and they have no great DM or a supplementary CAM.

They have a serial bottler in Higuain and their 2nd and 3rd player rarely crack the first team from what i saw.(icardi and dybala)

They have great talent but not a great team.

Edited 19 February 2018 by the fox

[Fox92]

3 hours ago, Richard said:

I spent some time in Argentina back end of last year and the general consensus there was that yes Messi is an outstanding player but he's not considered on the same level as Maradona, and never will be unless he wins the world cup this year. 

 

Maradona, at least in the eyes of the Argentinians I spoke with, won't be surpassed and is almost a demigod

For everything Messi has done he's never won them a World Cup. I understand why Maradona would be considered a God over there.

[Stadt]

Another reason why Messi isn't really revered in Argentina is that he left so young, he went abroad at what 13? Aguero and players like that are more popular because they did their time in Argentina so to speak.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2010/mar/27/lionel-messi-argentina

[Rogstanley]

Messi would have Maradona for breakfast. As would Ronaldo and probably three or four others from the modern era.

[purpleronnie]

30 minutes ago, Rogstanley said:

Messi would have Maradona for breakfast. As would Ronaldo and probably three or four others from the modern era.

It's difficult to look past Messi at the moment but Maradona took a poor Napoli side and completely transformed them single-handedly to title winners and uefa cup winners.

 

Now if Messi or Ronaldo went to stoke and did the same I'd say they were the greatest.

 

But for me Diego just edges Messi.

[leicsmac]

2 hours ago, Rogstanley said:

Messi would have Maradona for breakfast. As would Ronaldo and probably three or four others from the modern era.

 

1 hour ago, purpleronnie said:

It's difficult to look past Messi at the moment but Maradona took a poor Napoli side and completely transformed them single-handedly to title winners and uefa cup winners.

 

Now if Messi or Ronaldo went to stoke and did the same I'd say they were the greatest.

 

But for me Diego just edges Messi.

In terms of raw skill and what they could do it's pretty difficult to pick between eras - how would the likes of Maradona, Pele or Best feature in todays game? There's too many variables to really make a definitive call, though I can see the point of view that Messi is more prolific statistically.

 

However, as has been said, what Maradona did do - something not Messi nor Ronaldo nor any great modern footballer has done, as they tend to stick to the big clubs where they are supported and shadowed by capable team mates -  is drag a provincial football team to a national title and their country to a World Cup pretty much single-handedly. Whether you consider that to be the most important arbiter of footballing greatness...well, that's up for debate too.

Edited 19 February 2018 by leicsmac

[Manwell Pablo]

The games come along way since Maradonna was playing. Maradonna stood out a lot more back then than he would now. Messi might play in a dream team but he also has to play against them.

 

Hes a legend of the sport though despite the various controversies, the mafia involvement in him being bought to Naples being of them.

Edited 19 February 2018 by Manwell Pablo

[leicsmac]

39 minutes ago, Manwell Pablo said:

The games come along way since Maradonna was playing. Maradonna stood out a lot more back then than he would now. Messi might play in a dream team but he also has to play against them.

 

Hes a legend of the sport though despite the various controversies, the mafia involvement in him being bought to Naples being of them.

3

This, and also being Pablo Escobars biggest customer for a fair amount of time.

[Jattdogg]

Reckon he could murder messi in a pie eating contest