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smileysharad

Brexit!

By smileysharad, in General Chat

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Claridge

Claridge

Posted
Posted
34 minutes ago, HappyHamza said:

The EU bit is a bit cheeky given the timing. 

 

16 should have been the voting age for generations.  People can work, pay taxes and join the armed forces before they are 18. They should have the vote. There's a reason it's only the Tories that don't want that. 

And anyone who has ever met any 16 yr olds. 

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Guest MattP

Guest MattP

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, HappyHamza said:

And the government has indicated that it could pull the bill if amendments are made. 

 

Imagine it claiming the opposition are holding things up if it wins a vote of it's brexit bill then pulls it before  looking like winning an election and pulling it. 

It should pull it as well - constitutional change of that significance should be stood on at an election to pass, not pushed through because the opposition need a few votes from kids and foreigners at short notice.

 

By the way I've actually said I'm fine with votes at 16 providing we treat them as adults in all other ways as well, let them go to war, buy beer, smoke, drive etc

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HappyHamza

HappyHamza

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, MattP said:

It should pull it as well - constitutional change of that significance should be stood on at an election to pass, not pushed through because the opposition need a few votes from kids and foreigners at short notice.

 

By the way I've actually said I'm fine with votes at 16 providing we treat them as adults in all other ways as well, let them go to war, buy beer, smoke, drive etc

 What comes next?

People's vote would start looking ominous.

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Guest MattP

Guest MattP

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, HappyHamza said:

 What comes next?

People's vote would start looking ominous.

Amendment not selected anyway. Quite rightly. 

 

(Lindsay Hoyle in the chair, not John Bercow)

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Guest MattP

Guest MattP

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

Amendment for 9th December election to be put by Corbyn & Swinson, I gather. Didn't know they were friends again....

I hope it wins to be honest.

 

I've got a Xmas party on the 13th and the last thing I want is to be up all night before it and have the possibility of being totally miserable during it.

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lgfualol

lgfualol

Posted
Posted

Why shouldn't you be able to vote if you have made a life in a different EU country tho? Seems a nice idea. 

 

I'd like to vote in Germany where I live as the racist bastard party is getting slowly popular and that is worrying in Germany of all places. I have to wait another year to get citizenship tho.

 

Votes for all I say.

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Guest MattP

Guest MattP

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

I'm just watching a bit of the debate live.

 

A bit poor that Cat Smith can only give a speech by reading it out verbatim from a script - without even lifting her eyes.

 

A few notes of key points should be enough, surely?

Loads of them like this these days. 

 

Did you see the end of the Labour parry conference? Dawn Butler and Emily Thornberry don't even know the words to the red flag lol

 

 

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Alf Bentley

Alf Bentley

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, MattP said:

 

Did you see the end of the Labour parry conference? Dawn Butler and Emily Thornberry don't even know the words to the red flag lol

 

 

Poor show. You should offer to teach them the words. 

 

Can't remember exactly myself.

Starts off "The people's flag is deepest pink, it's not as red as you might think", doesn't it?

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oxford blue

oxford blue

Posted
Posted
55 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

apparently the amendments re EU nationals and 16/17 y o were never going to be selected as they had nothing to do with the actual bill.  begs the question why they were put forward in the first place ……. 

The difficulty for the government would be if the Lords amended the bill to include 16/17 year olds. This would then be voted upon by in the Commons, when. I believe, the bill could not be pulled by the government. 

 

(PS Although the fixed term parliament act seems to have had very litlle effect on election dates, if it continues, it would mean elections become part of the Christmas run-up every 5 years." Oh. come all you faithful" will have a different meaning...)

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Sampson

Sampson

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, HappyHamza said:

Like any other section of society, only goose with an interest would vote. 

 

Anybody that's ever met the residents of a nursing home might say the same yet we don't pull the vote from them. 

Not really the same thing comparing 16 year olds with the elderly.

 

Your brain doesn't fully form until your mid-20s. At 16 you dont even half a fully formed frontal-cortex - that's what makes teenagers adolescents - because at 16, people universally don't have a fully formed memory or rational brain. It's why oeople see a big difference between two 17 year olds at a similar stage having consensual sex when they are at the same developmental stage as fine - Compared to someone in their 30s having "consensual" sex with a 17 year old, which is heavily looked down on and seen as taking advantage of someone who does not have a fully formed rational brain yet - or why we don't punish 17 year olds who've committed crimes the same way we do grown adults.

 

 You could argue that people have brain deterioration at older ages, but that isn't at a universal age, so you cant really implement it.

 

Of course 18 is a pretty arbitrary age, but I guess that comes from tradition due to what people saw as general "maturity" before Scientific studies took place. In reality, science probably shows the age to vote, be tried as an adult, the age of consent etc. should be much higher than 18 and closer to 25 - but not much support for that will ever happen.

Edited by Sampson
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Claridge

Claridge

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, HappyHamza said:

Like any other section of society, only goose with an interest would vote. 

 

Anybody that's ever met the residents of a nursing home might say the same yet we don't pull the vote from them. 

Because they have paid taxes all their lives. Most 16 yr olds haven’t or at least not with their own money

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Guest MattP

Guest MattP

Posted
Posted

Anna Soubry just stood up to raise a point or order and went into a rant about how the house doesn't really want a GE but instead wants a people's vote lol

 

She's knows this because it's what people say in private

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WigstonWanderer

WigstonWanderer

Posted
Posted (edited)

Best result I can think of would be another hung parliament with more Liberals and labour as the biggest party. If the Tories/Brexit party have a comfortable majority, the dogs will be off the leash, particularly with Cummings pulling the strings.

 

Wouldn’t want to see Corbyn unfettered either.

 

Edit: I don’t get a vote.

Edited by WigstonWanderer
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Guest MattP

Guest MattP

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, MattP said:

Anna Soubry just stood up to raise a point or order and went into a rant about how the house doesn't really want a GE but instead wants a people's vote lol

 

She's knows this because it's what people say in private

Fitting in her last speech she confirms she has completely lost her marbles. 

 

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