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urban.spaceman

Leicester City demand official response over handball controversy in Carabao Cup semi-final defeat

By urban.spaceman, in Leicester City Forum

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fuchsntf

fuchsntf

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, st albans fox said:

they already gave their explanation at half time on sky

 

this seems to have been dug up by stringer at the presser yesterday and Percy sees a chance to hang VAR .......

 

apparently the shot was very hard so it went very quickly and the distance not very far ...... lost for words but that was the explanation given. They definitely reviewed it - dean delayed the corner after the Konsa block was viewed to show that clearly hit his ribs ..... it’s simply an example of why var doesn’t work unless the ref nearly always gives the decision of a pen and var is used to overturn clear injustices. So you never overturn a mane pen cos there was some contact ...... it’s jut a flipping mess isn’t it 

If seems you also,didnt recognized the 2 separate shots...:)

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Xen

Xen

Posted
Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, Stoopid said:

Maybe we suffered from this decision but come on - we had plenty of chances in both legs to make it irrelevant. We basically blew it, and no amount of retrospective hand-wringing's gonna change that.

It's fair enough to feel aggrieved and slagging the ref or VAR is fair game. But the simple fact remains we couldn't beat Aston Villa in two attempts - looking at everyone else for the reason really does us no favours.

 

We're not asking for any retrospective action. The club are well aware that we should've done better in the game and should've put outselves through to the final regardless of this decision.

 

The club is standing up and calling out an atrocious VAR decision - one of many this season, and not just in matches involving ourselves - and demanding clarification on what exactly was the reasoning behind it not being given. So far this season there have been loads of contentious and controversial decisions and yet the people behind VAR have not been held accountable in any way whatsoever. Someone has to step up and be the voice that kicks off a movement for change, otherwise all we'll ever have is grumbled conversations about VAR and noone doing anything differently. Seems like on this occasion, that's us.

Edited by Xen
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mabrah

mabrah

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Les-TA-Jon said:

Is Mason going to be influenced to give us favourable decisions tomorrow now? Or is he going to be influenced to not give us decisions, to make it look like he's not influenced!? lol

Who tf knows? It'll be damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. 

 

As I said earlier, I think it'd be wiser to swap refs for tomorrow - just to avoid possible incidents. What gets me about the 'we've done nothing wrong, why should we change anything?' barrel-chested squaring-up type of response is that it draws battle lines that could be avoided. There's not need to imply fault by taking an action. You can simply acknowledge a situation with a desire not to further confuse it.

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jmono84

jmono84

Posted
Posted

The Mee handball was completely intentional, he actually moved his arm the block the ball and Vardy went down after much more contact than all of Mane’s penalties and yet he was booked for diving!

 

Both of these decisions and the handball against Villa should have been sorted by VAR but nothing happens!

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Stoopid

Stoopid

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, Xen said:

We're not asking for any retrospective action. The club are well aware that we should've done better in the game and should've put outselves through to the final regardless of this decision.

 

The club is standing up and calling out an atrocious VAR decision - one of many this season, and not just in matches involving ourselves - and demanding clarification on what exactly was the reasoning behind it not being given. So far this season there have been loads of contentious and controversial decisions and yet the people behind VAR have not been held accountable in any way whatsoever. Someone has to step up and be the voice that kicks off a movement for change, otherwise all we'll ever have is grumbled conversations about VAR and noone doing anything differently. Seems like on this occasion, that's us.

It just strikes me as wanting perfection in an imperfect world. VAR could work better maybe, but bad decisions - or at least decisions we don't like - will always be with us.

Football isn't mathematics - there are no absolutes. The more we try to impose them, the further we get from its chaotic beauty.

Football's getting sterile enough - I'd love to see VAR binned but it won't be unfortunately.

The kind of scientific certainty implied by more refinements to it seems illusory to me, that's all.

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Les-TA-Jon

Les-TA-Jon

Posted
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Posted
2 minutes ago, Stoopid said:

It just strikes me as wanting perfection in an imperfect world. VAR could work better maybe, but bad decisions - or at least decisions we don't like - will always be with us.

Football isn't mathematics - there are no absolutes. The more we try to impose them, the further we get from its chaotic beauty.

Football's getting sterile enough - I'd love to see VAR binned but it won't be unfortunately.

The kind of scientific certainty implied by more refinements to it seems illusory to me, that's all.

Yes, but this is about getting clarity on some key things. Not only for 'peace of mind' but to ensure that things don't get this bad going forward / to protect us from similar controversies in future games. 

  • Did they look at the right footage? If they didn't that's a pretty serious flaw that needs addressing
  • If they did look at the correct clip, then what did the ref advise the VAR room?
  • What did the VAR room make of the footage? 
  • Under what circumstances was a penalty not given, considering the clear case for a penalty in the footage? 
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Stoopid

Stoopid

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Les-TA-Jon said:

Yes, but this is about getting clarity on some key things. Not only for 'peace of mind' but to ensure that things don't get this bad going forward / to protect us from similar controversies in future games. 

  • Did they look at the right footage? If they didn't that's a pretty serious flaw that needs addressing
  • If they did look at the correct clip, then what did the ref advise the VAR room?
  • What did the VAR room make of the footage? 
  • Under what circumstances was a penalty not given, considering the clear case for a penalty in the footage? 

I get all that and, yes, it should have been a pen - no argument from me. 

But that doesn't really change my point. We're looking for perfection and that just doesn't exist. And I think trying to achieve it is taking us down a blind alley.

And, let's face it, even if we had the pen, there's no guarantee the result would be any different, 

The whole thing just smacks of sour grapes to me. I repeat - we had 2 chances to beat Villa, VAR or no VAR. We couldn't do it.

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Les-TA-Jon

Les-TA-Jon

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Stoopid said:

I get all that and, yes, it should have been a pen - no argument from me. 

But that doesn't really change my point. We're looking for perfection and that just doesn't exist. And I think trying to achieve it is taking us down a blind alley.

And, let's face it, even if we had the pen, there's no guarantee the result would be any different, 

The whole thing just smacks of sour grapes to me. I repeat - we had 2 chances to beat Villa, VAR or no VAR. We couldn't do it.

All I'm saying, is after years of prep, and lobbying VAR is finally here. The PL has deliberately held off, to learn from other leagues and to implement the 'best' vision of VAR. If they're making fundamental mistakes such as not looking at the right footage or not making a decision, when no other interpretation is possible, then that needs to be scrutinised. 

 

Since we're only little old Leicester, and since Villa finished with a dramatic last minute winner, no one else is making the necessary noise. So we have to make it ourselves. I agree - this isn't and shouldn't be about sour grapes - it's about ensuring that due process is followed, and where the process seems completely unclear and opaque, asking for clarity. 

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car1os

car1os

Posted
Posted

Agree that this is about highlighting that the system is Broken.

 

We lost to a Villa team which seemed to want it that bit more than we did. I can accept losing and DO NOT want a replay (we’ve played enough games as it is)

 

I would settle for an acknowledgement they fcuked up

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st albans fox

st albans fox

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, car1os said:

Agree that this is about highlighting that the system is Broken.

 

We lost to a Villa team which seemed to want it that bit more than we did. I can accept losing and DO NOT want a replay (we’ve played enough games as it is)

 

I would settle for an acknowledgement they fcuked up

There couldnt be a replay 

 

if villa have badly broken any rules then they are kicked out (there is actually precedent for playing an illegible player in this comp and only being reprimanded)  .... there are no circumstances a replay can be ordered 

 

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fuchsntf

fuchsntf

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, st albans fox said:

No they didn’t!!!!!
 

they justified the non over rule by referring to the short distance between madison and Nakamba 

 

the justification for konsa was a little more straightforward- it didn’t hit his arm!

 

 

I believe we are at Cross purposes...:)

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urban fox

urban fox

Posted
Posted
50 minutes ago, Brooksy said:

After the game yes, VAR can intervene during the game though

No it can't. VAR can only be used for straight red decisions. The only exception to this would be if, such as in Vardy's case the player is booked for simulation and VAR then overturns the decision and awards the penalty, hence no simulation no yellow. Also if a player is booked but VAR identifies an earlier offence, such as if a pen is awarded for a foul but VAR spots an infringement such as handball or offside by the attacking team before the alleged penalty offence then the pen is not awarded and the game is effectively remound to the original offence, and hence no yellow as play was deemed to have stopped.

 

It would be interesting if a straight red was given for dangerous play but VAR noticed an earlier offence. In this instance, although the play would be brought back to before the latter offence, I think the red would still stand. Red cards can be awarded retrospectively or even in the tunnel for dangerous/violent conduct. The red against Southampton was still awarded despite the fact that advantage was played and we went on to score.

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Brooksy

Brooksy

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, urban fox said:

No it can't. VAR can only be used for straight red decisions. The only exception to this would be if, such as in Vardy's case the player is booked for simulation and VAR then overturns the decision and awards the penalty, hence no simulation no yellow. Also if a player is booked but VAR identifies an earlier offence, such as if a pen is awarded for a foul but VAR spots an infringement such as handball or offside by the attacking team before the alleged penalty offence then the pen is not awarded and the game is effectively remound to the original offence, and hence no yellow as play was deemed to have stopped.

 

It would be interesting if a straight red was given for dangerous play but VAR noticed an earlier offence. In this instance, although the play would be brought back to before the latter offence, I think the red would still stand. Red cards can be awarded retrospectively or even in the tunnel for dangerous/violent conduct. The red against Southampton was still awarded despite the fact that advantage was played and we went on to score.

Even if the referee decides there was contact but not enough to warrant a penalty? Can he not rescind the booking?

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